2017 was our 20th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Shop our online store for music lovers
SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Wessell Nickel & Gross
PianoForAll
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
Who's Online Now
66 members (anotherscott, chopinetto, Beowulf, bob44, butchkoch, aMused, A441, 21 invisible), 536 guests, and 469 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Going Paperless
#2513669 02/22/16 01:50 PM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,005
Sam S Offline OP
4000 Post Club Member
OP Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,005
When Henle came out with their new app for tablets a couple of weeks ago I decided to give it a try. I have an old iPad so I installed the app and bought some credits and downloaded the first Beethoven Sonata. I was impressed, so I ordered a Pageflip Firefly from Amazon - a bluetooth pedal so I can turn pages with my left foot.

So the combination works well. I then installed forScore so I could use pdf scores (which it turns out I have a lot of) and that works OK too. Not as well as the Henle app, which has customized it's scores for the app, but well enough.

I used an old scanner on my laptop to make new pdfs of things I didn't have files for. It's a flatbed scanner that will do A4 size pages - most published music is bigger than US letter size. Then loaded them into forScore.

My iPad is pretty old, from 2011, and the usable part of the screen is only about 5 1/2 x 7 1/2 inches. With a bigger screen it would be much better.

It's taken me a couple of weeks to get used to turning the pages with my left foot, but it's getting better. Faster pieces are more difficult. I usually use the tablet in landscape mode, so there are many more page turns, since I am only displaying 2 or 3 staves at a time. A quick stab with the foot works best - you cannot rest your foot on the PageFlip - it's too sensitive. And making a mistake with the page turns is usually disastrous as I try to figure out if I am a page ahead or behind.

The Henle app is sometimes very slow to recognize the pedal, which is aggravating. Then the next time I use it it works immediately. Henle says they are working on the problem. I've never seen a pedal problem with forScore.

It's been very good for my old eyes, since the tablet is backlit, and the display is nice and bright with high contrast.

Marking up the score is not as easy as picking up a pencil - both apps have predefined symbols and fingering numbers that you drop on the score, as well as drawing colored lines of various thicknesses.

My teacher doesn't like it much, because she can't take my music and make marks on it - I do it for her.

Anyway, that's my report from Georgia USA. Anybody else experimenting with paperless?

Sam

(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513718 02/22/16 03:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,529
D
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
D
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,529
Interesting. I think you might usefully post this in Pianist Corner also.

Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513727 02/22/16 04:03 PM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,468
P
4000 Post Club Member
Offline
4000 Post Club Member
P
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,468
I use forScore and AirTurn on my iPad for all my music now, including chamber music recitals.

I have learned the hard way that it is best to learn the music (unless you are planning on memorizing it - I don't memorize any more) from the digital score, as the page turns may be on different pages from the hard copy, and you need to include the foot pedal page turns as part of the learning process, as if it were just another note.

I am performing the complete Copland Appalachian Spring Suite for solo piano (25 minutes) using a digital score.

Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513729 02/22/16 04:05 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 6,424
Founder - Owner - Host
6000 Post Club Member
Offline
Founder - Owner - Host
6000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 6,424
Hi Sam,

Yes, I've been using a tablet for a little over a year now.

In fact the balding chubby guy in this picture is me, playing for a private Valentine's party last year.

[Linked Image]

Kathy scans the music for me, I use a program called MobileSheets Pro to organize (and markup) my music. It's really cheap but works well.

I can categorize it any way I want (genre, key, composer, etc.) and assign unlimited meta data for organizing.

I can also easily create collections and set lists. I can even set the music up with anchors taking me immediately back to the coda, etc.

My page turning pedal is from AirTurn, a wireless pedal that lets me page forward or back easily. I often kick my shoes off and control the pedal in stocking feet, easier to "feel" the forward and back buttons.

I still haul some of my printed music with me, but leave it in the care, just in case. And I still prefer the printed copy to learn from, mainly because my tablet screen isn't as big as a regular sheet of music.

It has made my life much easier, and it comes in handy when someone has a request for something I don't have memorized.

I've now started adding in my exercise books so I can sit at my piano with just the tablet and pull up my Hanon, Schmitt, etc.



- Frank B.
Founder / Owner / Host
PianoWorld.com
www.PianoSupplies.com
Maple Street Music Shop
Find Us On:
Facebook.com/PianoWorldDotCom
ProRecord.info
www.youtube.com/PianoWorldDotCom
www.linkedin.com/in/pianoworld
Skype: PianoWorldDotCom
My Keyboards:
Estonia L-190 w/ ProRecord, Yamaha P-80, Harpsichord (kit), Clavichord (kit), Bilhorn Telescope Organ c 1880, 2 - Antique Pump Organs
-------------------------
It's Fun To Play the Piano ... PLEASE Pass It On!
Please invite every piano enthusiast you know to join our piano forums!


Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513744 02/22/16 04:40 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,086
W
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
W
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,086
Originally Posted by Sam S
It's taken me a couple of weeks to get used to turning the pages with my left foot, but it's getting better. Faster pieces are more difficult.


Playing in portrait mode and then setting ForScore to do 'half page' turns works well, at least for the music I play.

The smaller size of the music is, IMO, the biggest drawback related to using an iPad. I definitely want to get my hands on one of the larger iPads as soon as is feasible.


Whizbang
amateur ragtime pianist
https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeschala
Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513746 02/22/16 04:42 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,086
W
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
W
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,086
Also, if you have repeats, instead of turning pages back, which is error prone, you can sometimes simply duplicate the pages so that you can keep turning forward. Doesn't always work, but it's nice when it does.


Whizbang
amateur ragtime pianist
https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeschala
Re: Going Paperless
Piano World #2513750 02/22/16 04:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,372
N
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
N
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,372
First of all -- What is this Henle app?

I've been using ForScore and a Bluetooth pedal (Pageflip Cicada, in my case) for about 18 months now. As you say, it take some getting used to at first, but eventually becomes 2nd nature. (BTW - I CAN rest my foot on the pedal, and DO.)

In terms of getting scores into ForScore, I use two methods:

Method 1 is just using the iPad's camera (the "Darkroom" function in ForScore). This generally works just OK as the original source of the score might not lie perfectly flat when photographing it. (If the source is a book.)

Method 2 works much better, but is limited to newly purchased scores. When I purchase a score online, I now print it to PDF rather than printing a hard copy. I use a free downloadable printer driver called "Bullzip PDF Printer". I then move the PDF file into Dropbox (free) and then load it into ForScore from Dropbox. These come out looking great!

When I want to mark up a score (which is quite often), ForScore now supports the Apple Pencil (which only works on the iPad Pro, of course). Another advantage of the iPad Pro is its larger screen of course. -- Really helpful for these 63 year old eyes!

So what is this Henle app, and what is it's advantages over ForScore?


Bert
[Linked Image] [Linked Image] [Linked Image]
Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513751 02/22/16 04:54 PM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,468
P
4000 Post Club Member
Offline
4000 Post Club Member
P
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,468
I use forScore in landscape mode to reduce the number of page turns. The music is very small, but I have been playing from very, very small photocopied scores for over 40 years and my 66 year old eyes (with glasses) seem to do all right. Needless to say, the music works best as 'guidelines' - basically reference notes to keep you on track. No way to actually read the notes at speed.

Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513825 02/22/16 07:59 PM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 635
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 635
My goal is to one day have all my pieces digitized and play my sheet music using an iPad Pro and an AirTurn. The iPad Pro has a MUCH bigger screen than the regular iPad, and is compatible with the Apple Pencil so you can make marks directly on the screen. The entire setup currently costs quite a penny which is why I haven't jumped on it yet (though I badly want to). With my beginner pieces and limited repertoire, I feel it's a waste to have an ultra-setup. Someday...

Last edited by marimorimo; 02/22/16 08:00 PM.

Working on: Schumann Album for the Young, Clementi Op 36 No. 1 (all movements), Various Bach, Czerny 599
+ CASIO PX-720 and PX-730 +
Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513829 02/22/16 08:13 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 733
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 733
Can't help it - I'm old school. Its paper for me.


Barbara
...without music, no life...
Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513841 02/22/16 08:45 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 5,918
5000 Post Club Member
Offline
5000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 5,918
I'm a spoiled brat: I love both!


Learner
Re: Going Paperless
newbert #2513862 02/22/16 09:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,816
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,816
Originally Posted by newbert
So what is this Henle app, and what is it's advantages over ForScore?


The Henle app lets you buy sheet music from Henle's music library. The main advantage is that Henle has come up with a true digital score format and there are a lot of really cool digital features. Like score can auto fit/wrap to the screen, multiple fingering suggestions you can turn on/off. Embedded notes and playing instructions and and a host of other really neat features. Decide for yourself if you need them.

Personally I really like Henle's digital format, but ForScore has most of my PDF scores loaded which is very convenient and hard to beat.


We are the music makers,
And we are the dreamers of dreams.
Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513868 02/22/16 10:17 PM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,005
Sam S Offline OP
4000 Post Club Member
OP Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,005
The Henle app is cool, but only if you are into urtext classical music scores. No need to scan or photo anything, you buy credits that you use to download music from them. You can't use pdfs with the Henle app. It's an interesting business model, sort of like buying a Kindle from Amazon and then buying books from them to read on it. Except you aren't buying anything except the music - the Henle app is free.

I don't think the music is small, even on my older ipad. In landscape mode, with only 2 or 3 staves showing, it's bright and easy to read.

Sam

Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513920 02/23/16 03:03 AM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 585
Gold Subscriber
500 Post Club Member
Offline
Gold Subscriber
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 585
Sam, apart from buying my C3, the best piano-related thing I ever did was to swap my older iPad for an iPad Pro. The much-larger screen and the higher resolution of its in-built camera mean that scanned music sheets are better than the originals - full-size, crystal-clear and back-lit. Perfect for my (older) eyes. Another bonus - on hot, humid Brisbane summer days the overhead fan doesn’t blow the music sheets around. I’m rapidly going completely paperless.

While Bluetooth pedals are essential, I share your frustration with left-foot coordination; it's tricky! It's even more complex when you add in compositions calling for 1C, as many of (ahem) Einaudi’s pieces do. But practice, they say, makes perfect …

Way to go thumb!



[Linked Image] [Linked Image]XXXVIII-LX

My C3 - solace. And joy.
Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513931 02/23/16 03:43 AM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,960

Gold Supporter until Sept. 05 2014
1000 Post Club Member
Offline

Gold Supporter until Sept. 05 2014
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,960
+1 for the iPad Pro. The Pencil works well for marking scores, but I have only used it on my PDF files in GoodReader. This app was recently updated, but still behaves erratically when you touch the screen with your palm. I'll have to try ForScore. And there's also an app that allows direct download of IMSLP scores.

I still buy paper books, RCM collections etc., because many of them are not available as ebooks, but I really hope to be able to go completely paperless one day.

Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513933 02/23/16 03:51 AM
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,092
R
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
R
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,092
It shouldn't be a big deal to use voice recognition technology instead of a foot pedal.
"Next"..."Back"..."Repeat"..."Coda" etc.

Last edited by RaggedKeyPresser; 02/23/16 05:36 AM.

Czerny's Piano School Vol. 1, now at #77 and giving it a break.
Re: Going Paperless
RaggedKeyPresser #2513940 02/23/16 04:29 AM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 585
Gold Subscriber
500 Post Club Member
Offline
Gold Subscriber
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 585
Originally Posted by RaggedKeyPresser
It shouldn't be a big deal to use voice recognition technology instead of a foot pedal.
"Forward"..."Back"..."Repeat"..."Coda" etc.


Just what you need when recording your next Recital submission laugh !




[Linked Image] [Linked Image]XXXVIII-LX

My C3 - solace. And joy.
Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513961 02/23/16 05:36 AM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,005
Sam S Offline OP
4000 Post Club Member
OP Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,005
I also tried the metronome feature of the Henle app yesterday. I've always had trouble staying with a metronome - not loud enough, or visible enough. No problem with the app, since the metronome flash is part of the score!

Sam

Re: Going Paperless
MarieJ #2513962 02/23/16 05:38 AM
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,092
R
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
R
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,092
It could be sung too...to make it blend in better grin


Czerny's Piano School Vol. 1, now at #77 and giving it a break.
Re: Going Paperless
Sam S #2513969 02/23/16 06:55 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,321
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,321
I've used an iPad and took photos of my sheet music for practice when I was travelling. However, the size is just a bit small for my eyes.

I recently got an iPad Pro and the screen size is perfect for sheet music. I too bought forScore. With forScore, I:

- downloaded sheet music
- Scanned sheet music using a scanner app and import into forScore
- stored the entire music theory study and exercise book (in PDF)

So far I've used it to study theory the most. Since you can do markups on the sheets and easily erase them, I find it handy if I need to correct myself, or use different colours for different notes. Long gone are the days of pencil and messy eraser. It's particularly handy to work on harmony exercises because I keep changing my answer as I go when writing 4-part voices. As such, I get to do my music theory exercise every day on the train to/back from work.

As for lessons, I still prefer the music books because I rather have my teacher's pencil writing on them. I treat my teacher's written instructions like autographs. I will definitely scan and download sheet music for practice on my iPad Pro when I travel again.

Page turner is a bummer. I use a lot of una code and sustain pedals. So both my feet are occupied. I was secretly hoping forScore would include a function to turn page by soft voice command, an eye gesture, a head gesture, or whatever gestures that doesn't require hands and feet.

Of course, the iPad Pro is also good for sketching/drawing, taking notes at meetings, planning for an overseas trip, store your favourite movies (the 4-speaker system is pretty good), reading online news, enjoying some of your favourite photos you took with that stunning screen etc.

So ya. I'm going paperless too. Except for lessons.


Be yourself

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  BB Player 

Link Copied to Clipboard
(ad)
Pianoteq
Steinway Spiro Layering
(ad)
PianoDisc

PianoDisc
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Mason & Hamlin Pianos
(ad) SWEETWATER Cyber Sale
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Yamaha C2x and C3x Cost???
by navi9187 - 12/02/20 04:10 PM
plz help ID this piece :)
by Chummy - 12/02/20 03:25 PM
CLP 735 vs CA49 vs HP704
by Einaudio - 12/02/20 02:49 PM
Is there a term for this?
by TBell - 12/02/20 02:04 PM
Download Sheet Music
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
Forum Statistics
Forums41
Topics203,218
Posts3,029,742
Members99,451
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers


Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads



 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2020 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.4