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Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: mrpanoff] #2507001
02/03/16 10:07 PM
02/03/16 10:07 PM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,821
Hamamatsu, Japan
Kawai James Offline
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There are no plans to introduce a successor to the VPC1 at this time.

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
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Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: Kawai James] #2507068
02/04/16 04:46 AM
02/04/16 04:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
There are no plans to introduce a successor to the VPC1 at this time.

Kind regards,
James
x


Yes James, but what about a fullfledged midi controller with top end kawai keybed...

A Kawai midi controller comparable to NI komplete, Nektar Panorama or Akai Advance would be the best thing that could happen to the world of professional controllers..


I think Akai, is willing to sell the VIP in license to 3rd party companies, to make another step in their fight against the NI komplete to become the new standard... And with VIP 2.0 it offers more then komplete...

VIP support would also work perfectly in a stage piano..

Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: mrpanoff] #2507331
02/04/16 08:52 PM
02/04/16 08:52 PM
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Hamamatsu, Japan
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Bachus, yes, that would be rather nice, although the 'do-everything' controller market is incredibly price competitive - I wonder if using a wooden key action would make such a product too expensive for most consumers?

Regardless, such a controller would not carry the 'VPC' designation, as the core concept would be rather different.

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: Kawai James] #2507574
02/05/16 01:43 PM
02/05/16 01:43 PM
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JL16 Offline
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Bachus, yes, that would be rather nice, although the 'do-everything' controller market is incredibly price competitive - I wonder if using a wooden key action would make such a product too expensive for most consumers?

Regardless, such a controller would not carry the 'VPC' designation, as the core concept would be rather different.

Cheers,
James
x

If a Kawai VIC were forthcoming I too definitely would be very interested, since the market for controllers may indeed be price competitive, but IMHO it needs to focus more on becoming quality-competitive.
And that is where I think Kawai could shine. smile

If Kawai were to introduce a high end controller with for example an onboard screen displaying a browser and the parameters assigned to the controls (as is the case with e.g. the Akai Advance/Alesis VX/M Audio CTRL which use the VIP software), then the higher price for the quality and the action would be worth it for me.

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Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: JL16] #2507592
02/05/16 02:40 PM
02/05/16 02:40 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,652
Boynton Beach, FL
Morodiene Offline
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Originally Posted by JL16
Originally Posted by Kawai James
Bachus, yes, that would be rather nice, although the 'do-everything' controller market is incredibly price competitive - I wonder if using a wooden key action would make such a product too expensive for most consumers?

Regardless, such a controller would not carry the 'VPC' designation, as the core concept would be rather different.

Cheers,
James
x

If a Kawai VIC were forthcoming I too definitely would be very interested, since the market for controllers may indeed be price competitive, but IMHO it needs to focus more on becoming quality-competitive.
And that is where I think Kawai could shine. smile

If Kawai were to introduce a high end controller with for example an onboard screen displaying a browser and the parameters assigned to the controls (as is the case with e.g. the Akai Advance/Alesis VX/M Audio CTRL which use the VIP software), then the higher price for the quality and the action would be worth it for me.


But then do you really want a pianolike action for a controller that would be used for strings and brass and other orchestral instruments? I think the market for controllers is really geared toward movies and games, which are heavy on orchestral stuff.


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Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: mrpanoff] #2507604
02/05/16 03:17 PM
02/05/16 03:17 PM
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 339
England
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propianist Online content
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In my opinion, Kawai VPC2 ought to have...

97 keys!!!!!
If VPC is intended for software pianos, that means Bosendorfers as well as Steinways, and most Bosendorfer libraries sample all 97 keys, so we want to be able to play them all please! This would also make it stand out from the rest in the market. Only Lachnit 97 Imperial MIDI controller offers 97 weighted key action, and that costs a fortune.

Grand Feel 3
Grand Feel was good, and Grand Feel 2 may be technically superior, but Kawai ruined it by putting that ridiculous over-the-top textured / 3D serrated / ribbed for her pleasure / deep grooved wood grain feel on the black keys!!!! I don't like new black keys at all and they don't feel natural. When has anybody ever seen a real piano with THAT MUCH uneven finish surface on keytops?! Hopefully Kawai will go back to a smoother flatter sensible finish for Grand Feel 3 and that is what will make it onto VPC2 model, not the GF2 key surface, otherwise it will be so annoying.

Pitch & Mod Wheels / Assignable knobs & sliders / a few basic built-in piano sounds in case your laptop crashes...
Oh wait, that's just an MP11....
There is an argument that piano purists don't need all this other stuff, and we do like the minimalist visual look of VPC1, but having assignable MIDI controller knobs / sliders makes editing sounds while you play them much easier, and better than mouse / keyboard. So how about touch panel controls under glass like the Physis Piano H1, with LEDs that can be then turned off afterwards for sheer black look.
Same goes for next MP12 design, (I prefer MP8 shape anyway and the 256 sound library it used to have - useful for band gigs) maybe MP12 could have the glass touch style controls, or even a sliding over black cover that covers the controls leaving a blank VPC1 appearance. Also MP12 needs digital out!!!!

Audio Interface built in
On VPC2 would be a good idea. I suppose having a Muse Receptor and 10 inch touchscreen built in is out of the question?!

Last edited by propianist; 02/05/16 03:20 PM.
Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: propianist] #2507607
02/05/16 03:31 PM
02/05/16 03:31 PM
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 353
Punta Alta, Buenos Aires, Arge...
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Marcos Daniel Online content
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If VPC is quite expensive, I don't want to think about the price of such machine


Pianoteq / Kawai CL 35 & MP11 / Old 1920's Upright Zimmerman
Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: Morodiene] #2507613
02/05/16 03:46 PM
02/05/16 03:46 PM
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JL16 Offline
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Originally Posted by Morodiene
Originally Posted by JL16
Originally Posted by Kawai James
Bachus, yes, that would be rather nice, although the 'do-everything' controller market is incredibly price competitive - I wonder if using a wooden key action would make such a product too expensive for most consumers?

Regardless, such a controller would not carry the 'VPC' designation, as the core concept would be rather different.

Cheers,
James
x

If a Kawai VIC were forthcoming I too definitely would be very interested, since the market for controllers may indeed be price competitive, but IMHO it needs to focus more on becoming quality-competitive.
And that is where I think Kawai could shine. smile

If Kawai were to introduce a high end controller with for example an onboard screen displaying a browser and the parameters assigned to the controls (as is the case with e.g. the Akai Advance/Alesis VX/M Audio CTRL which use the VIP software), then the higher price for the quality and the action would be worth it for me.


But then do you really want a pianolike action for a controller that would be used for strings and brass and other orchestral instruments? I think the market for controllers is really geared toward movies and games, which are heavy on orchestral stuff.

But then again: which 88 key options are available right now?
Aren't almost all of them hammer actions, most of them disappointing when it comes to playability, key response, keybed noise, etc?
And the few 88 key controllers which are semi-weighted are not exactly renowned for their quality, quite the contrary. They may do the job, but that's about all that can be said about them.

So, both of these areas of 88 key controllers have ample room for improvement, both the hammer action and the semi-weighted action (which is almost absent from the market).
When it comes to the hammer action I strongly feel that Kawai could make a significant positive difference with a controller as mentioned earlier.
When it comes to semi-weighted or lightly weighted action, well, who will rise to the challenge?

Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: mrpanoff] #2507840
02/06/16 09:02 AM
02/06/16 09:02 AM
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JL16 Offline
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Just out of curiosity, what sort of price are we talking about when contemplating a possible Kawai mastercontroller with a wooden keybed, and how much less would such a controller with a keybed like the MP7 cost?

Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: JL16] #2508010
02/06/16 06:07 PM
02/06/16 06:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 353
Punta Alta, Buenos Aires, Arge...
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Marcos Daniel Online content
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I don't understand why Kawai uses wood in digital pianos and composite in grands... Anyway I believe that some day, probably with the exception of the soundboard, pianos will be made of artificial materials.


Pianoteq / Kawai CL 35 & MP11 / Old 1920's Upright Zimmerman
Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: Marcos Daniel] #2508015
02/06/16 06:27 PM
02/06/16 06:27 PM
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,930
France
Frédéric L Online content
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Frédéric L  Online Content
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France
Originally Posted by Marcos Daniel
I don't understand why Kawai uses wood in digital pianos and composite in grands...


You seem to see a difference. From the photos I have seen both actions are similar* : a wooden key and the rest of the action in other materials. (The hammer of the grand excepted)

* from one point of view, the choice of materials...

Last edited by Frédéric L; 02/06/16 06:33 PM.

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Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: Frédéric L] #2508017
02/06/16 06:34 PM
02/06/16 06:34 PM
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Punta Alta, Buenos Aires, Arge...
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You are right, but I was trying yo understand why they move in opposed ways in each market.
By the way Mason & Hamlin also use composite in their actions.


Pianoteq / Kawai CL 35 & MP11 / Old 1920's Upright Zimmerman
Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: Marcos Daniel] #2508043
02/06/16 08:28 PM
02/06/16 08:28 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,638
Hobart, Australia
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ando Offline
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Joined: Nov 2010
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Hobart, Australia
Originally Posted by Marcos Daniel
You are right, but I was trying yo understand why they move in opposed ways in each market.
By the way Mason & Hamlin also use composite in their actions.


But not the actual keys. =Kawai DPs.

Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: mrpanoff] #2508329
02/07/16 09:46 PM
02/07/16 09:46 PM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,821
Hamamatsu, Japan
Kawai James Offline
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Right, the keys of Kawai Arctic acoustic pianos are still wood, while (some of) the action parts use composite materials when there are benefits to doing so.

The keyboard and action mechanism parts perform different functions. We select the best materials for each, depending on their function.

James
x



Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: Kawai James] #2508383
02/08/16 05:56 AM
02/08/16 05:56 AM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,033
Germany
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Germany
Originally Posted by Kawai James
Right, the keys of Kawai Arctic pianos are still wood
Do you have to wear mittens to play such an arctic piano? Could make playing quite difficult, couldn't it? grin

Re: Kawai VPC2 with GF action. [Re: mrpanoff] #2508637
02/09/16 04:15 AM
02/09/16 04:15 AM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,821
Hamamatsu, Japan
Kawai James Offline
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Lol, that's true.

Time to fix that typo...

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
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