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Re: Laminated soundboards [Re: Del] #2466291 10/04/15 07:29 AM
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Olek Offline
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A highly recognized pianist, now Yamaha artist, that checked side by side the Phoenix and normal Steingraeber, told me he was surprised that the Phoenix (bridge agrafes and other modification) was even considered "better ".

It was so evident to him the classical version was more interesting, more manageable tone essentially.

I think some process add power or sustain, or partials to the tone. They leave then a strong coloration that tend to be heard at all level of playing.

The pianists seem to like pianos that can be driven "wild" playing with saturation level(s).

A similar thing happen with pianos that sound good whatever the touch quality of the pianist.
They can be a little deceiving as they help too much in rounding the tone.

The saturated tone is not always pleasing, too so on some pianos the power input from the hammers need to be lessened.



Last edited by Olek; 10/04/15 07:33 AM.

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Re: Laminated soundboards [Re: Del] #2466336 10/04/15 10:29 AM
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Mark Polishook Offline
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Originally Posted by Del


I was able to listen to two large Steingraeber grands at the factory in Bayreuth a year or so back. One was fitted with the normal wood soundboard, the other with a carbon fiber board. They were both, of course, magnificent instruments and there were a lot of similarities between the two. But there were also some differences. I found the differences interesting but I liked both of them. I think many -- possibly not most but it would be interesting to find out -- would have found each of them to be a more than satisfactory instrument. But I also think many -- again, most? -- would have found that they didn't really like the piano with the carbon fiber soundboard once they knew it was not wood.

I do know from actual experience that people who initially really liked how a certain piano sounded when they thought it was using a solid spruce soundboard ended up deciding they really didn't like it all that much once they learned it was actually using a laminated panel.

I'd love to design a test of this just to find out how much our prejudices affect how we "hear" the piano.

ddf


This is a great point and some research on it would be very interesting. My limited experience playing and comparing spruce and carbon fibre soundboards at Hurstwood Farm Pianos has led me to the exact same conclusion.

Last edited by Mark Polishook; 10/04/15 10:29 AM.
Re: Laminated soundboards [Re: Gregor] #2466345 10/04/15 10:45 AM
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Del Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Gregor
Originally Posted by Del
What was it that caused you to prefer one over the other?


The sound grin

The one with the carbon board sounds not bad, too. After all it´s still a Steingraeber. But the other sounds just better.

Thanks, Gregor, but that doesn't tell us much. Could you be a little more specific?

ddf



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Re: Laminated soundboards [Re: Del] #2466375 10/04/15 12:21 PM
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Gregor Offline
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Originally Posted by Del
Could you be a little more specific?


I feared that this question could come up wink

To be honest: no, I can´t. It´s generally hard to express a sound in words. Particularly in a language that is not my first and furthermore from memory. But I remember that the first word that came into my mind while playing was: flat, shallow. Of course only in comparison with the normal wood board instrument. I.e., it sounded well, but the other was more refined, somehow.


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Re: Laminated soundboards [Re: Gregor] #2466376 10/04/15 12:29 PM
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The problem with any sort of comparison of pianos is that there is so much variation of sound that you can get from seemingly identical pianos, not to mention the variation in touch that different pianists can make on the same piano, that comparing one feature is pretty much hopeless.

Even then, people often do not try. There have been so many demonstrations of what purport to be different tunings elsewhere on this board, but they are always announced, so there are no blind tests of preferences.


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Re: Laminated soundboards [Re: Gregor] #2466411 10/04/15 03:01 PM
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Del Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Gregor
Originally Posted by Del
Could you be a little more specific?

I feared that this question could come up wink

To be honest: no, I can´t. It´s generally hard to express a sound in words. Particularly in a language that is not my first and furthermore from memory. But I remember that the first word that came into my mind while playing was: flat, shallow. Of course only in comparison with the normal wood board instrument. I.e., it sounded well, but the other was more refined, somehow.

I understand. I'm hoping to get an idea of what the sound spectrum might have been like both with the piano you liked and with the one you didn't like. I have a pretty good idea what the standard Steingraeber with a wood board might look like but not with the carbon fiber soundboard.

ddf


Delwin D Fandrich
Piano Research, Design & Manufacturing Consultant
ddfandrich@gmail.com
(To contact me privately please use this e-mail address.)

Stupidity is a rare condition, ignorance is a common choice. --Anon
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