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The dealer told me the B3 is similar to the U1 but just the case was made/assembled in Indonesia. Will it be a good alternative for U1? The new one price is $5800 when I asked.

Until someone with real knowledge of the B3 chimes in, I would suggest that a difference of over $3,000.00 in the MSRP between the B3 and the U1 could well mean that there is more than just a difference in cosmetics between the two instruments.

Regards,

Information about the B3, and its origins are here:

http://www.pianobuyer.com/spring15/198.html

I'm not sure if the soundboard is a laminated or solid spruce board, as it's not listed on the B3 features list, like it is on the U1 page. This may or may not make a difference, ultimately the performance of the piano matters more than the spec sheets or marketing brochures...

Assuming your "final two" pianos are the 2006 U1 (with a dealer warranty) vs a new B3, I would advise the RCM level 10 player in your home have a strong vote in the selection process, assuming you're comfortable buying either. It can be understandably tough, when you don't play, to get beyond the sales pitch and marketing stuff, and focus on the touch and tone of the piano above all. It sounds like you're just about ready to make a purchase - good luck!

Thank you, terminaldegree

The 2006 U1 is not available anymore. My choices become:

1. Charles R. Walter 1999 at $5990 I think it's a 45". Series number is 525400.
2. Yamaha b3 new at $5800

Both are a bit over my budget.

Another choice is to wait longer and see...

The Charles Walter is 45" at most.

I am not familiar with the B3, but its predecessor model, the T-whatever, was not quite as well finished as the U1, but a very solid piano. It might have needed a little more tweaking than the U1, but not much. For the most part, build quality from Yamaha has been very good. That is true of Charles Walter as well, but they have fewer models.

I didn't know Charles Walter made a 52" upright. I thought their console/studio was the only upright they made, (with a full-size upright sound ).

Rick

Yeah, I think the Charles Walter is 45"

Hard to beat.

I'd have to agree with ivan. I can't comment on U.S pricing, but here in the UK, the B3 represents cracking value for what it is. It's one of those "sweet spots" in Yamaha's range from a quality vs price perspective. It's quite a big step up quality wise from a B2, while being "only" another £500 or so here in the UK. My understanding is that it has the same strings, hammers, and scale design as the U1, although the soundboard and some other internal parts are different. Yes the U1 is better overall, but here in England, it's about £2,500 more expensive for a level of improvement probably not much bigger than between the B2 and B3.

To get more info, it's probably worth searching for posts by Chris Venables about Yamaha uprights, and the B3 in particular. He's a Yamaha dealer here in England who I recently bought from myself (in my case a YUS5), and his posts will say more of value on this subject than i ever could.

I agree this may not make a big difference but would be nice to know. Personally, I have always been a great fan of having all specs fully published for each piano. Transparency IMHO is important and eliminates guess work..

Between the B2 and B3 I found the B3 substantially better.
In fact, it's not far off from the more expensive U1.

That there are other great pianos worth consideration in these price ranges goes without saying. Literally....

So better "don't say".

Norbert

Hello izut.

Useful answers all round so far.

Yes, the b3E is a very good alternative to a new or older, U1 and if the price you can buy for in Canadian $ is 5,800 then that's a good price.

Choose your piano with your eyes, ears and fingers. (And if it's an old model, your nose may come in handy too) However, for those who want the specs:

The b3E uses the same new perimiter type iron frame/scale and strings as the new U1, (post 1999/2000), same keyboard but a different grade of quarter sawn solid spruce in the soundboard. (The graining is normally tighter in the Bavarian sourced quarter sawn spruce of the P121 and the Sitka spruce of the U1 model).

The bridge in the b3E is beech, whereas in the more expensive P121 and U1 it's maple.

Action components appear identical on b3E and U1, but there is, according to 'inside' sources, a difference. (The hammers are a much high quality than in the smaller b series models, b1 and b2, which makes me wonder why Yamaha include it in the b series stable. (The hammers, in fact, are the same as the erstwhile UK built U1s, -up to 2009- as an example).

Out of the box, the U1 has more factory prepping IMHO, but good dealer prepping is all it takes to make the b3E sound and feel better than most pre 1999 U1s and very much like the new U1.

A note on the laminated spruce boards, which were fitted to pre 2013/14 B3s, they were of the three ply type. When I compared the two b3 versions side by side, I could detect no tonal difference.

Best wishes in your search.

Thanks for that, Chris - it's invaluable product information that all of us learn from.

Chris's above post is essentially same of what I had said before about these pianos.

Once people [who can play..]try the different pianos on market "talk" stops and the real nature of a piano shows. At that time you can neither add nor deduct things.

It's how I have operated throughout my entire career.

Problem is that many contributing here on a regular basis have never played the various pianos on market or know much about them. This is especially true for new models.

I don't know them all myself but then wouldn't write about them

"Probieren geht ueber studieren" as they say in German...

Good luck to everybody making their own personal choice.

Insider tip: 'talk' might - but ears and fingers are not easily fooling you!!

Norbert

Great info.



To clarify, does the current b3 have the same scale as the current (post-2007) U1 or only as 2000-2006 U1?

Hi Ivan

Yamaha don't really make as many truly different pianos as it may appear. To benefit from economies of scale and keep prices highly competitive, the b3, P121, U1, YUS1 and in Europe SE122 use the same iron frame/scale design or 'chassis' in layman's terms, as well as a generous proportion of the keyboard and action components in all those models. Ditto 131cm models except hand built SU7.

Tweaks to cabinet design, strings, hammer spec and to a degree, more detailed factory prepping, are the differences.

So yes, the original b3 and current b3E have the same iron frame and bridge design (curved) as the latest U1.

Please see this extract from our website on new v old 121cm Yamahas (and re U3 131 models too) for info and several pics too detailed for me to retype and load here.

Price-wise, it's either the law of diminishing returns, as with most products, huge price hikes for almost negligible add-ons, or maybe the budget models are just loss leaders?....

http://www.chrisvenables.co.uk/early-yamaha-u1-u3-vs-new-yamaha-models/

I paid $5600 for my new B3. They didn't have a U1 in stock with which to compare it, but I sure love my B3.

Thanks, Chris. The price structure is indeed intriguing in view of these details.

Thank you everybody for your time and comments! Appreciated!

How much should a s/h 2012 b3 cost?

Depends on who's selling, Jazzpianist. Last one I saw at a London dealer was on sale for 3,200 gbp (which I assume is relevant to you given your local), although I suspect there was some room for negotiation there. New Yamaha priced have rise a lot in the ast few Months though, presumably due to the post brexit fall in the pound, and I'd expect used prices to rise a bit as well following that.

A private sale imho should be much less than that, and even now I'd expect not much more than £2k, albeit that's just a guess.