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Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
enzo.sandrolini #2295794 06/27/14 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by enzo.sandrolini
As I said in another post, I was curious about the new 585 and went to the shop where I could (only) tried the 575
I found its action extremely good, and really close to my N2 (which is not a 'small' reference I think)
For sure Yamaha made a great job there, and probably the 585 is even better on this side
I am now eager for your opinion about this piano after having played it some hours.

Cheers and enjoy

Hi enzo, does this mean you are even remotely thinking of changing from your N2 to a 575 or 585? Really curious as this would suggest some small dissatisfaction with the N2.

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Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
theoak #2295806 06/27/14 12:48 PM
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The adjustable stool came with the 585 at no extra cost - it was in the huge box with the piano. The salesman told me they came with the adjustable stool.
I was not aware of that from the marketing material until he told me.

Can I say the stool is very solid and sturdy with a smooth mechanism and looks quite good too. I see it as a bonus and am very pleased as I have not really been happy with the stools that came with my last clavinova (240) and the kawai ca95. It will save me buying a separate piano bench.

I played some more this afternoon and I can say I'm in love with the piano. Both the action and sound are very pleasing. I probably prefer to CFX sound to the bosendorfer but its too soon to tell for sure as I haven't yet had time to try different styles of music with each.

Even my wife immediately commented on the sound from this piano and how much better it was. She said that from the next room the sound was so realistic she thought I was playing my acoustic piano.

I'm working long hours this weekend but will update further as I get a chance to play more. whome

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
spanishbuddha #2295816 06/27/14 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by spanishbuddha
Originally Posted by enzo.sandrolini
As I said in another post, I was curious about the new 585 and went to the shop where I could (only) tried the 575
I found its action extremely good, and really close to my N2 (which is not a 'small' reference I think)
For sure Yamaha made a great job there, and probably the 585 is even better on this side
I am now eager for your opinion about this piano after having played it some hours.

Cheers and enjoy

Hi enzo, does this mean you are even remotely thinking of changing from your N2 to a 575 or 585? Really curious as this would suggest some small dissatisfaction with the N2.


grin grin
Absolutely not....
I am really in love with my N2...
I can even, the more I play it, the more I love it..as I improve a lot my technics with that piano.
It is even far better than the AP upright I take lesson on
No..I must admit I have a GAS to change my VPC1 for a 575...
Why ??
Simple : The N2 action is quite noisy, and when I play really early in the morning, it makes too much noise...
Moreover, playing the N2 with Headphone is less pleasant.
But till I Have my N2, I find no pleasure playing the VPC1..the action seems 'unrealistic' for me now.
Whilst the 575 action is more closer to the N2...
but...It is just a GAS....for the moment wink

Last edited by enzo.sandrolini; 06/27/14 01:25 PM.

Music is a lifestyle
(Happy Yamaha N2 and Roland FP90 owner)
Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2302101 07/14/14 05:02 AM
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Just took delivery of a Yamaha CLP585PE. I've been thinking of upgrading from my old technics for some years. I've been driving Ivory II GP's from the Technics. I'm no expert and haven't had the opportunity to try CLP next to a K CA95 or K CS10 which, as these had been my previous top picks I would have liked to do.

The action on the CLP is very precise. I think it recovers more quickly than the Kawai. As it's so different to my Technics I can't yet comment on subtly of touch. It will take a while to get the feel and exploit the full range. The weighting is well balanced and is slightly lighter than the only NU1 I've tried. I know it's not an 'authentic' grand action like the AvantGrand, but it still feels right.

The CFX sound is great. Plenty of grunt in the base, really rich and resonant. The treble is nice, perhaps a little bright, but I haven't played around with any parameters yet. I haven't hooked up Ivory II yet. It'll be interesting to compare the Steinway as I love that treble.

The Bosendorfer sounds very soft. A bit too soft for me, but again I haven't made any adjustments.

The pedals (or rather pedal - 'cause I only use the damper) seems very precise and this is difficult for me at present as they are so different to the technics.

Anyway, my first impression - Sounds Great, Feels Great, Looks great. I will certainly use the piano standalone without connection to PC unless recording to Cubase.




Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2302105 07/14/14 05:30 AM
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Hello Adro
When I tried the 585, I though the same about the Bosendorfer sound
to improve / change it, you can tweak with following settings:
- Key sensitivity (it controls the keyboard dynamics) : increasing it make the sound much more live
- key touch => also setting it to soft1 /Soft2 make the sound alive

and if it is not enough, you have also Brightness and Brillance controls

With all these parameters I got I really really pleasant Bosenderfor (at the end, I preferred it to the CFX which requires less tuning to sound good)
Enjoy your 585...
I think I will pull the trigger myself on the 575 (in replacement of my VPC1, as I fully agree with you, I find the touch more precise, less sluggish / faster)


Music is a lifestyle
(Happy Yamaha N2 and Roland FP90 owner)
Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
enzo.sandrolini #2302464 07/15/14 03:27 AM
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Thanks Enzo, I'll have a go with those parameters on the Bosendorfer. Did you find the 575 and 585 actions equally precise. I've not played both in the same place at the same time but I don't remember having the same instant reaction when I tried the 575.

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
Adro #2302470 07/15/14 03:48 AM
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Hi Adro,

Congrats on you new DP! I hope you enjoy it as much as I've been enjoying mine. It really has a great feel and a great sound. I just love the yamaha sound myself and the way it is right 'out of the box'. It amazes me how much others are having to tweak their high end Kawai DPs just to get a good acoustic sound.

Pete.

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2327953 09/16/14 02:43 AM
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Hello,

I wanted to quickly share my CLP 585 purchasing experience here.

I was looking for a digital piano as close as possible in touch and sound to an acoustic one.
Fidelity of touch was actually even more important than sound quality. I had a budget of 4,000 euro (5,000 USD).
I visited a few times some shops in my region (South of France) and tested a few DP models.
In all my tests, I started by playing something on an acoustic piano, then move to a DP, play the same thing and evaluate the difference in feel and sound.
Not a very scientific approach,... just judging from my own feel and taste. For the final test, also, I asked my music teacher to come over with me.

I started by trying out some hybrid pianos, I was in fact fascinated by the Yamaha Avantgrand N2, which I found even better than most acoustic models,
but the price (12,000 euro) was well beyond my reach.
The only “hybrid” option which would fit in my budget was the Yamaha NU1, but somewhat I was not impressed with it, I found it had a bit uneven sound and response…
again, not a scientific argument, it is absolutely personal feeling, but simply I didn’t really fall in love with it.

Therefore I decided to give up on hybrid pianos for now, and turned to good quality "pure" DPs.
I finally restricted my choice to the Yamaha CLP and Roland HP series, and went to a local dealer to test them.
The dealer had no CLP 585 in stock but only other CLP models (575, 545) - and the Roland HP508.
I have to say, when I tried the CLP 545 and 575 I didn't completely like them, especially the touch didn't seem to me very realistic.
Pricewise of course, they were a very good deal, namely the 545. But, don't know how to put it, something was missing.
I also liked the Roland HP508, it was maybe a bit more realistic than the two CLPs, from the "touch" perspective, albeit still softer than the real thing.
To be clear, we are talking about some very good DPs, top of the market, but I was missing that "wow" effect that usually triggers a purchase....

I was at an impasse and couldn't really make a choice when, fortunately, the dealer received some Yamaha CLP 585's and I decided, for peace of mind, to try one.
It was amazing; in my opinion it feels under your fingers VERY different than the other CLP models, with a much more realistic touch. The speakers system is also excellent.
I did some other tests, helped also by my teacher, and the CLP 585 came out as the clear winner in the non-hybrid category (to be fair, it is also the most expensive one that we tried).
So I bought it right away.

I received my CLP 585 a couple of weeks ago and I am enthusiastic about touch response and quality of sound.
It is of course not an acoustic piano but it has a warmth of sound which is impressive, and a very realistic, vibrant touch.
I can only say good things so far, echoing the positive comments made in previous posts.

I am glad I delayed my purchase until a CLP585 was available, in my opinion this model is a far cry from the rest of the CLP series today, and it's well worth a test.
It really stands in a category of its own.

Ciao!
Paolo

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2340810 10/24/14 02:07 AM
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Hi, I wanted to make sure that I have understood corrently that the CLP-575/585 doesn't have a note by note voice tweaking? I mean the same type that e.g. the Roland HP-508 has, where you can adjust the brighness and other parameters (maybe even volume) of each note individually. This would make it easier to adjust the piano's sound in a medium size apartment building room with concrete walls.

So, the Yammies don't have this functionality?

What about any kind of narrow or wider band EQ?


Roland HP101e
Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2342093 10/27/14 04:26 PM
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I'm seriously considering upgrading from my Kawai CN33, which is much loved, to the CLP 585
I had initially decided on the Hybrid NU1 but had to return that piano as it was faulty (discussed in another thread) with sudden key loudness happening several times per min.
My main concern with the NU1 was reliability, lots of people reporting similar issues to mine on here.
So how do people feel about the reliability of the new CLP 500s?

They touch is actually amazing on it. I did also notice in the showroom that the sound was a bit muffled, but the room is a large open area and I would imagine it will sound similar to the NU1 in my home?
They speakers seem to be similar (actually may be more powerful on the 585)
The CFX Grand is a beautiful sound too, and they actually have an acoustic CFX grand in the showroom so I got to try it out too which was amazing, I was just in total awe of it.

My own feeling is that the CLP 585 touch is very similar to acoustic, and I need to change from DP to acoustic for lessons, exams and performances so I think this will suit well for my needs.

So really I just need to be happy with reliability and the speaker sound system.
I did find out on this thread how to reset to factory settings which I will try in the showroom on next visit to see if that's the problem with the sound.

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2342097 10/27/14 04:40 PM
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Why not shell out a couple more bucks for the N1? Unless you absolutely need that string patch on the CLP 585; I hear they're quite realistic, the strings. I believe there's also a sax somewhere in there.

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2342110 10/27/14 05:19 PM
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Hi Alan, I have tried out the Yamaha 586 at Yamaha Music London, and I found the sound a bit overblown in that environment. I'm sure this can be attuned to a smaller environment given the experience of those who own the 585. However, for me the touch does not quite suit. Its hard to put my 'finger' on it but there is a bounce to it that takes me out of the illusion of playing a mechanical instrument. Although one can play the 586 gently which is a good thing, after a period of play I felt the soft touch did not really resemble the gentle touch needed for an acoustic. I have come to this conclusion after playing the 585 and then rushing upstairs to play on the Yamaha grands and the upright SE 133 and then rushing back down again. Yamaha London have two floors and a basement. I always thought the Kawai grand feel was a bit on the light side but after playing on the new grands I can see where Kawai are coming from. In my assessment the grand feel does seem closer to the touch of a modern grand piano. However, the Yamaha Avant Grand N2 has in my view the very best touch of all the digitals along with a warm dynamic sound. I just wish it wasn't so darned expensive. I've know idea if any of this will be of help. Its only when you try these piano's yourself will you know which will float your boat. Good luck with your research,

Paul H


Kemble Compact Acoustic Piano, Yamaha CVP 709 Polished White, Kawai MP11se, Pianoteq Standard, Galaxy Vintage D, Garritan CFX.
Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2342121 10/27/14 05:57 PM
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Hi Pete,
I tried the N1 and thought it was amazing, but it's out of my price range.
I'm only really interested in the piano sounds, not strings or other voices or gadgets.

The N1 is actually so good it would make it difficult to switch to an upright acoustic as the N1/N2 are so much better.
I don't know why anyone actually buys acoustic uprights for their homes anymore.

And thanks pmh I agree it's hard to tell about sound in a showroom, I did like the touch on the 585 but I was comparing to upright acoustic and the NU1, they N2 is superior without a doubt, but the N2 is superior to any upright acoustic too.

so its a choice between a CLP 585 now, which meets all my needs, or wait couple of years and getting the N1 or N2 which is by far the best DP option available at the moment. But whatever I buy in this price bracket it will need to last a long time

I hadn't realised what a big decision it is!
It's great to have this site for information and advice.

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2342125 10/27/14 06:13 PM
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Keep in mind that the MSRP's on these are ridiculous ($10,000). I was once quoted $5,900 (taxes and delivery included). Sadly, the price has gone up since. They're going for a little more now. Check for a floor model; these are usually in excellent condition, and you can get substantial discounts.

On the plus side, you now get a Piaggero NP-11 with the purchase of a new hybrid (U.S.A.) Offer good thru December 31st.

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
Pete14 #2342149 10/27/14 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Pete14
Check for a floor model; these are usually in excellent condition, and you can get substantial discounts.


I was at my local Yamaha shop testing out the 585 and along came 2 kids. One of them started to bang loudly on one of the digital pianos, and went on to do the same to the others. The second kid, probably the sibling, followed suit.

I was quite open to floor models before, but after witnessing that, I now have some reservations.

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
iceporky #2342267 10/28/14 04:00 AM
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re: floor models...

I have a floor model N2 in view that I can't try at a 20% discount (based on the 10% discount you can get on a new N2) they say it was not played more than 30 mins...I asked for a pic of the black keys (below line) and they look as new. Not sure what else I could look for...a 30% discount? It hasn't moved for 3 months since discounted.


Yamaha C3X-SH. Pianoteq V5. Steinberg U22 USB.
Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2342268 10/28/14 04:13 AM
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Is the discount based on the MSRP ($15,000)? if so, you should get at least a 50% discount. Let me put it this way: Two years ago I received a $7,500 quote for the N2 (brand new). Granted, the price has gone up since; however, I would not pay more than $8,500/9,000 for the N2 (taxes and delivery included).

The dealer might act offended if you offer half the MSRP, but trust me, he is full of it; so is Yamaha for deliberately inflating the MSRP (a very common practice amongst piano makers).

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2342274 10/28/14 05:18 AM
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Thanks Pete14. It's off the usual retail price listed in my EU country (so about 14.5kUSD, MSRP would be 15.6kUSD). Actual transaction price would be perhaps 10-15% lower (based on full grands discounts, without negotiating).
Now Yamaha has this 'piano lemon trade in' offer where you give them the serial number of an upright which gives you a 1300USD rebate on hybrids.
I think I'll offer 6.5K EUR = 8.1kUSD for the floor model (30% off likely transaction price), although I also need to know what year it was made (post 2010 apparently avoids the 'noise gate' issue)...


Yamaha C3X-SH. Pianoteq V5. Steinberg U22 USB.
Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2342295 10/28/14 07:09 AM
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Yes, definitely confirm the year of manufacture. Asides from the noise gate, Yamaha might've made other improvements over the years. For example, simply having the action regulated by experienced technicians instead of the average-newbie-trainee could make a huge difference in how the piano plays out of the box.

Re: Yamaha Clavinova CLP 585
cub #2372646 01/12/15 11:50 AM
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I just purchased a CLP585 a couple of weeks ago. I think Cub has already done an excellent job reviewing this instrument, so I don’t have much to add other than I concur with everything already said.

I’m an intermediate player and also own a Boston GP156 baby grand (which I love) and for the last 18 months I had a Casio PX780. This, for the money, I thought was an excellent buy and has served me well. But there were a couple of things that bothered me about it – firstly the lack of resonance with the pedal. Not so bad without headphones (but really only barely acceptable), but with headphones I found it almost impossible to distinguish pedal changes. I also found the keyboard quite noisy - and it seemed to me it has gotten worse, which may be the result of playing it 2-3 hours a day constantly for 18 months. But I did enjoy the piano sound on the Casio; I had originally purchased it because I thought I would enjoy playing with the gizmos and gadgets that it offers, especially auto-accompaniment. But right now I’m so focused on learning classical piano, I really had no interest in those features in the end.

Happily both these issues are fully resolved and then some with the CLP585 (which of course considering it costs nearly 5 times as much as the 780 one would hope so). I’m not an expert in digital piano technology, but so far my experience with the CLP585 is very positive. The CFX sampling sound to me seems very rounded, sweet and bell-like (and of course a much longer decay than I’m used to on the Casio). I’m particularly impressed with the how much the sound surrounds me when playing – there’s even something of a tactile feel of vibration when playing (particularly in the lower register) that reminds me of the Boston. It’s great fun to play the demo songs and being enveloped in the sound. I can’t put my finger on it exactly, but there is a refinedness and clarity to the sound – every note seems incredibly crystal like (and so do my mistakes too…) – in a way I never noticed on the Casio. As Cub pointed out the Bosendorfer takes a bit of getting used to. Firstly it doesn’t have the same enveloping “presence” that the CFX has – it seems withdrawn and perhaps a bit muffled. But it is not unpleasing at all, and perhaps it’s case of matching it to the right kind of music. I have tinkered a little with the settings and increased the brightness through the voice edit about +5 and that seems to help. Actually I must like it to some extent because I do switch back and forth between the two samples. I’m finding I particularly like using it for pieces such as Chopin Nocturnes, where there is a strong melody in the RH and a more subdued LH, it seems to work really well for these kinds of pieces. I've also experimented with some of the damper resonance settings, and I think I may be able to get closer to simulating the resonance on my Boston.

The touch seems very good to me – have to admit I’m not sure I fully appreciate the difference between light and heavy touches, but the touch has a firmness to it that feels very solid and definitely a little more resistance than the Casio, but I really like that and again really feels very close to the Boston (I read a reviewer saying he/she felt there was a looseness to the touch, but I haven't detect that it at all). I've played the CLP585 for hours on end and haven't noticed any fatigue.

I’ve played a few of the other sounds too – mostly organs and harpsichord which to my ears at least sound authentic and convincing. With the harpsichord you can clearly hear the release of the jack when a key is released (at least I think that's what it's called).

I think the build quality of the CLP585 is very high. For example the hinged keyboard cover is very solid and when shut closes very slowly. My only slight complaint is why doesn't the CLP585 have music holders as the other Clavinovas do? It seems like it should have been easy to add. I got the matte black (black walnut) version; the ebony black wasn’t available, but I am actually very pleased with the finish and look.

I actually bought the CLP585 without playing it first (I know..)..I had played a CLP575 at a dealership about 90 miles away a few weeks ago, but our local dealer has had trouble getting the CLP585s. Then all of sudden they had one become available that a person had put a deposit on but backed out of, so I jumped on it sight unseen.

But so far absolutely no regrets and despite the high cost compared to the Casio it really feels worth it. I did enjoy the CLP575 too (and of course the touch is similar), but I think the improved speaker system on the CLP585 actually is quite a big improvement. I’m usually a person who suffers from severe buyer’s remorse on just about anything I buy, but so far I have absolutely no regrets on my purchase. Playing it is just a totally satisfying experience.

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