Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Forum Schulze Pollmann 113e Moderno detail information?

Hi everyone.
I am a new member here but have been lurking and reading a lot of useful discussion and information on this forum.

We are in the process of buying a Schulze Pollmann 113e Moderno. We also looked at Kawai K200 and K300 after reading that they have a good reputation in building quality uprights. We read about how K300 won multiple awards multiple times in the past several years.

When we went to our local showroom we were shown a uses SP 113e Moderno. My young sons tried different Kawai models about 4 of them including the k200, k300, and k400 but he kept telling us he liked the SP 113e the best.

We went home trying to research more information on this specific model but could not find much information. We also could not find where we can verified the serial number.

We saw a couple of post about SP in this forum but it was from 2008 and was discussing more about the price.

So finally I decided to join so that we can post a question to all of you and hoping that you can share your knowledge to us about this specific model.

According to the dealer, this piano was build in 1999.

Any information that you can share would be very much appreciated.

A few question we have:
- is this model hand built?
- Was this model built in Italy?
- Quality

- is this model hand built?
Yes, but that doesn't mean every aspect of bulding was done by hand. It's really just part of marketing pianos to say that they are hand built. A better way to put it would be that Kawai employs more technology than Pollmann did in 1999.


- Was this model built in Italy?
Well yeah. Either Itay or San Marino inside Italy


- Quality
Generally considered very good as a new piano

You are looking at the smallest of three Pollmannn verticals of that era. There was a 113, a 117, and a 126. The 117 and 126 had beautiful cabinetry. That's always been a strong selling point for Pollmann. The 113 had a simple continmetnal style cabinet with no legs. My guess is that piano with a normal discount sold new for around 5k to 5.5k.

If the asking price is anything close to that, I'd say no thank you.

If it's under 3k and you want to bow to your son's judgment, pay for a technician to inspect it.

Thank you for the reply.

We went back again to the store today and made specific comparison between the K300 new and the SP 113. The tone just seem to be so sweet on the SP and the touch on the SP also felt more "natural" we can strike a note so very lightly and the it responded so accurately... while on the K300 it felt that it is so hard to do a light touch on the key..there was something assisting it when you pressed the key halfway and therefore it is hard to control or asked it to translate our light touch...

the sustain on the notes were also longer on the SP when we played the high C and above. the roundness of the tone was also so pleasing on the SP.

We really dont mind the continental styling of the cabinet and we find that the mahogany "peacock" or "fan" finishing was so beautiful and it looks very elegant.

We really felt in love with the SP but were really worried about the reputation and build quality of it.

You have alleviated most of our worry.. Yes it may not be fully hand build but at least it was partly hand build as we were told. And that it was really build in Italy and not Macau or China also as we were told by the dealer.

The price we paid maybe higher than $3k but when and if we are ready in the future to upgrade the local dealer will take back the S&P as a full current paid price trade in price. So that really helps.

Thank you again Turandot for the insight and information.

FYI. Here is the picture of the SP 113E

First of all, the mutt in the picture is Turandot. She was busy, so I answered your questions. I'm William.

It is no surprise that the Pollamnn has a sweet tone and a long sustain. Normally their pianos do.

It is also no surprise that the Kawai pianos offer more key resistance. Their actions are firmer than most. You can go in circles on that point when you're considering a young child.

On the one hand, it's an effort especially if the child has been playing something with a light action. On the other hand, little hands have a way of growing bigger and stronger. Finger strength develops quickly with piano practice, so the firm touch is not a long term issue.

I couldn't bring up your picture, but if this 113 Moderno has a wood finish cabinet with the peaccock motif, add at least a few hunderd to my estimate of the price.

Please do NOT concern yourself with the hand built issue. The use of modern technology makes more precise pianos. If any new piano today was truly being built completely by hand, I would never buy it.

Many European makers would love to have more advanced machinery than they do, but the stuff is expensive and small makers don't always find it easy to pay the cost. The real differences in what is done by hand is the level of skill of those doing it and the amount of time they are allowed to complete it. Some pianos are rushed through assembly and put in a crate for shipping. Better pianos take longer to build because of very careful high level work during assembly. They are also given considerable attention after they come off the line.

It sounds from the description of your comparison that you really like that Pollmann and that you were listening to it carefully. That's worth a lot. And there is nothing wrong with a continental style. I'm sorry if I implied that it was a drawback. I only meant that it knocks the value down. A continental can be quite handy when you don't want a piano to be too intrusive.

If you decide to buy it, I would still encourage you to first pay for a technical inspection unless the store wants to slap a warranty on it that covers all issues and you trust the store to honor its warranty. That's not a knock on Schulze Pollmann. It's just a check-up to make sure the piano is still in good health after 15 years of use.

Hi William. I am glad you answered my questions. I am pretty sure Turandot got to do what she got to do

Btw, no apology needed in regards to the continental styling comment. I had read from a few other people that continental styling may not be as popular with many people. For us we really had no preference (yet??). We just want to have a good quality piano with a good action and nice tone.

I am grateful for your input and wisdom on the subject at hand. It is so hard to find detail information on the SP let alone on the specific older model as 113 E.

In regards to the picture, yes I noticed that it was not showing on the posting. I tried to follow the instructions but was not successful. However, your description was spot on. It is indeed has the peacock motif.

As with the dealer we are comfortable with the dealer. We were recommended by my son's piano teacher and we dealt directly with the owner of the dealership. We are given full 5 years warranty and so far he has made us feel comfortable in our dealing and we felt no negativity in terms of sales pressure etc.

I think we are now much more comfortable with the SP. Also I forgot to mention one little detail. Today while we were there for the second time after we had made all our "exhaustive" comparison between the two there was a couple that was trying out some piano nearby. They are shopping for an upgrade piano for her. So I approached her and asked if she would be willing to play on the SP and the K300 we were considering. She was very gracious and agreed to played on both. She played quite a while on the SP then she moved on to the K300. She only played less than a page on her music sheet on the K300 and stopped. She confirmed our own discovery and findings. She told us that she liked the SP's action and tone better.

Thank you again William for taking the time to impart your knowledge. Cheers.

Our piano is here:

Looks great, congratulations!

So those are the little guys who enforced their will and got the one they wanted.

Sweet-looking piano!

Congratulations!

Congratulations!

That is a beautiful piano, for some handsom youngsters!

Enjoy!

Rick

William: Thank you. You helped me feel comfortable in purchasing this particular piano :-) And yes Adrian my oldest was the one that chose this piano. He made up his mind quite firmly on this one. However, he was quite generous when he saw that I was leaning toward a safer purchase of the Kawai. On our second visit, he was willing to let me get the Kawai but at the end this SP was the one all of us truly love.

Rickster & Troy 125: Thank you :-)

Congratulations. The piano look beautiful in your home. Hope you get many years of enjoyment from it. One note on price. This model is not sold in the USA any longer because the price differential between the continental and the next size up with legs is negligible. Just to make you feel even better about your purchase the same piano made new made entirely in San Marino would have an MSRP of 16-18K. Good luck and enjoy your piano.

Neat. Congratulations!

@Glenn: thank you. Especially about the info on the piano :-) Maybe I am a little OCD because not having enough information drives me a little crazy.. so I appreciate that you share some of your knowledge on this specific model :-)

@terminaldegree: thank you :-)

Congratulations. Just wanted to say that first picture of your little guys watching the arrival is priceless.

gutenberg: Thank you. Watching your kids express their love for each other is the reward of parenthood