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Yes, that is what I meant in the second part of this text (the first part is the objective fact):
Objective reality: "I play this piece in some way such that these notes are struck with this velocity at this time for this duration, etc."
Subjective perception: "The resulting music sounds 'unpolished'." Since this is the subjective perception of the objective fact, this subjective perception may also be something like "The resulting music sounds polished and great" to a different listener.

So it seems we are in agreement.

Now I must ask why this discussion was necessary.

I don't know; you asked some questions so I figured I'd answer them

So be it. One you chimed it, I guess I couldn't help but wonder why?

Fascinating article. I've added it to my favorites to re-read.

Another expressive device which is related to agogic hesitation is desynchronization of hands. It seems to be coming back into fashion - I've heard quite a number of young pianists using it to highlight certain notes within phrases, or to start new phrases, to make the listener prick up his ears. This is especially effective if the LH bass note(s) is/are much lower than the RH melody, which is played just fractionally off the beat. Singers - both operatic and Lieder - do this quite often. Of course, it's a lot easier for a singer to soar freely with his/her melodic line, tugging and pushing at/against the beat supplied by the accompaniment, than a solo pianist who has to be careful not to sound contrived, or even amateurish .

Personally, I believe that many of these methods of elevating one's interpretation to new expressive heights can be picked up by listening to lots of great pianists, past & present - and to other great instrumentalists and singers. (When I got interested in opera and Lieder, my piano playing became much more freely expressive: I was already unconsciously making use of the kind of expressive devices used by singers, as well as their phrasing and 'breathing' - the bel canto quality so often implicit in Chopin, for example). Of course, technique and expression go together - without the former, one would struggle with the latter.

@bennevis- It's funny you mentioned the desynchronization of the hands. Within the last year, I asked my teacher how to give the illusion of a sound increasing in dynamic after it has been struck - much like a singer or violin creating a crescendo while holding a single note. Desynchronization was his answer.

Oo, I have one. So sometimes, you play a really pretty piece and there's this climatic note--something minor and sad. The instinct is to play it louder, since it's the climax of a phrase. My piano teacher once asked me to build up to that note (this was Rachmaninoff's Elegie), but then play the note softly.

It was mind blowing how different that phrase sounded, it was that much more interesting and that much more dramatic.

In general, I think what he was teaching me is how to surprise listeners. I think the element of surprise is very important in music, art, theater.. life in general.

Anyway, that was one of my favorite musical moments.

A very good point but it's important that this device not be overused.

A competent musician can always find an endless list of things to criticize, even in famous pianists. I can listen to a Lisitsa recording and comment nonstop through the entire thing on what she could be doing better.

Who told you? I thought your teacher was a man.

This was at the VCM Summer Piano Academy in Victoria B.C. I had two private lessons with Michelle Mares who studied with Leon Fleisher, Alfred Brendel and others.

FTFY.

Sounds like a quality teacher.

If you like.

That's an understatement. All of the teachers at the Summer Academy are top notch. I always come away with new insights.

I'm sure.

Be careful not to take anything they say too seriously, though. There may be even more qualified musicians who disagree. Everything a teacher tells you that you don't agree with yourself should be taken with a whole container of salt.

"Be careful not to take anything everything they say too seriously...."

When a problem is "solved" by a practical suggestion or "Eureka!" advice from a teacher, why should that not be taken seriously? If it works, I do take the advice seriously.

I've heard performances and have had lessons with the same teacher and can attest that not only is she an outstanding performer but that she is also a wonderfully gifted teacher.

Regards,

Deborah, thank you for bringing this up again.

As an amateur I too am following the very informative comments so far with interest.

I might only add that one of my drawbacks has always been about the time I could spend to perfect a piece. There really was never enough time. Because I had other things that I had to do.
But, if perfecting a piece were my first priority in life, I am sure I could come up with a performance that would not leave that last 10% out.

Unfortunately, you are right. Besides all the technical things we need to do to make a performance special, we always have to consider available time, something many of us do not have. I find myself thinking, "Gee, if I could play this 500 times more, it would be perfect." That's tough to do with a full time job and only 1 to 2 hours of practice time a day.