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Joined: Aug 2010
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pv88 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Jeff Clef
It could be true that some frequencies in the bundle of tones you hear as 'raspy,' are frequencies your ears are more sensitive to, and so they bother you more. I forget the technical name this is called, but one backwards-seeming feature of early hearing loss is, not that you hear less well, but that things sound hyper-loud. One way I hear this, is that the tinnitus doesn't sound like a high-pitched tone anymore, but that the notes sound shredded up, and the louder the sound, the more the tone shreds and takes on this very odd quality, as if somebody was turning a mod wheel--- except it's the real AP and the naked ear. And it is known that different frequencies are detected by different parts of the inner ear--- tiny little hairs that stimulate nerve endings; there are many of them, so that 'rasp' could bother some but not all.

The only way you can fix it is, turn down the volume. Sometimes tweaking the EQ settings can get you there. To me, it's a danger sign to stop listening for awhile and let my ears rest.


Jeff,

Sounds like a lot of what you are saying may be true in my case, as I am probably more sensitive to certain frequencies (with the piano tones that sound "raspy") on the CA95. Playing the V-Piano with speakers and a sub woofer does not create these annoying and grating sounds even at louder volume levels.

Lower volume levels are needed on the CA95 plus using the "Mellow 1 & 2" piano presets, and, to alter the "voicing" to mellow. This helps to minimize the fuzzy sounds somewhat and make them bearable to listen to.

Still not sure if the piano doesn't have speaker / soundboard / cabinet vibrations which would add to the murky timbre and fuzziness.

The V-Piano has clarity in its sounds as the CA95 does not.

Also, the EP3 sounds crystal clear... not like the CA95.

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The V-Piano has clarity in its sounds as the CA95 does not.

Why don't you just get rid of the CA95 and stick with the V-Piano (which is almost double the price of the Kawai)? You seem to be so unhappy with the CA95 that I cannot understand why you continue with it if the apparent faults bother you so much.

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Originally Posted by pv88
Originally Posted by Jeff Clef
It could be true that some frequencies in the bundle of tones you hear as 'raspy,' are frequencies your ears are more sensitive to, and so they bother you more. I forget the technical name this is called, but one backwards-seeming feature of early hearing loss is, not that you hear less well, but that things sound hyper-loud. One way I hear this, is that the tinnitus doesn't sound like a high-pitched tone anymore, but that the notes sound shredded up, and the louder the sound, the more the tone shreds and takes on this very odd quality, as if somebody was turning a mod wheel--- except it's the real AP and the naked ear. And it is known that different frequencies are detected by different parts of the inner ear--- tiny little hairs that stimulate nerve endings; there are many of them, so that 'rasp' could bother some but not all.

The only way you can fix it is, turn down the volume. Sometimes tweaking the EQ settings can get you there. To me, it's a danger sign to stop listening for awhile and let my ears rest.


Jeff,

Sounds like a lot of what you are saying may be true in my case, as I am probably more sensitive to certain frequencies (with the piano tones that sound "raspy") on the CA95. Playing the V-Piano with speakers and a sub woofer does not create these annoying and grating sounds even at louder volume levels.

Lower volume levels are needed on the CA95 plus using the "Mellow 1 & 2" piano presets, and, to alter the "voicing" to mellow. This helps to minimize the fuzzy sounds somewhat and make them bearable to listen to.

Still not sure if the piano doesn't have speaker / soundboard / cabinet vibrations which would add to the murky timbre and fuzziness.

The V-Piano has clarity in its sounds as the CA95 does not.


PV,
Remind me again why you are still persisting with the CA95 when you seem to prefer the V-Piano for everything? I'm not being smart here, I honestly don't get it.

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Hi,
I recently bought a Kawai CN-34 and I heard the same as you!!!! Middle D has a metallic sound clearly and G# too. I hear it very well in Concert Grand and it is atenuated in Mellow Grand.

Regards.

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I believe the Kawai's all use the same sample set. My ES6 has some of the same characteristics. For solo playing I typically adjust the voicing 1 step harder than normal and the touch 1 step heavier than normal. I like the way the piano sounds and plays through it's internal speakers like that and I don't notice the metallic sound on those few notes at all.

Somtimes when playing with a combo I'll set the voicing back to normal

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It's very interesting coming across this old thread. I've just taken delivery of a Kawai CS10, which is basically a CA95 in a different cabinet, and I've been disappointed to hear the same raspy sounds mentioned by others. I'd been at a loss, but after reading this I believe I might be able to attribute it to my tinnitus.

I'm still not quite sure what to do, though. The only more or less direct competitor to the CS10 is the Roland LX-15e, and I don't know whether I would like it any better or not. Right now, I can alleviate the problem by running Pianoteq 5 or one of my Ivory II pianos through the CS10 sound system, but for the money these instruments cost, I'd like to have one I can just walk up to, turn on, and enjoy (or at least not be irritated by) its default built-in sound. I love how my CS10 looks and feels, and the sound system is great, however. So I'm currently mulling over what to do.


Jayson
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Jayson, may I suggest giving Kawai America's customer support a call, and explaining the situation. The folks there may be able to suggest settings that you can adjust to reduce this tonal characteristic on some notes.

Kind regards,
James
x


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Originally Posted by SomeGuyNamedJayson
...So I'm currently mulling over what to do.


Well...use the Studio Grand, or Jazz presets. They sound very different from the first grand piano sound and have been my preferred sounds since my first Kawai (Mp6). They sound more balanced to me than the default concert grand.

Furthermore , there's lots to tweak with the Virtual Designer , EQ , touch curve settings etc. I would suggest using and adjusting your favorite presets to your liking rather than stick to the first grand preset in default factory mode. I'm sure that will help a lot. As for PT5 over the CA/CS - tried it recently again with PT5 , but every time I come back to the build-in sounds. Works better somehow. You could carefully layer some PT presets with the build-in sounds however to create a more natural and longer sustain. I also tried Roland SN sounds over the CA95 and that worked better than using PT IMHO.

By the way , I shortly tested an HP508 recently , but still prefer the nice wooden action of the Kawai with proper hammer mechanics . The AP sound of the Roland is good. All-in-all , I would stick with the CA10 for a while and test presets and tweak the sound to your liking. Don't forget to turn off the reverb by the way - you don't need it with the soundboard acoustics - it gets more in the way, than it adds.

Cherio, J

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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Jayson, may I suggest giving Kawai America's customer support a call, and explaining the situation. The folks there may be able to suggest settings that you can adjust to reduce this tonal characteristic on some notes.

Kind regards,
James
x


Thanks for that suggestion, James. I will have an afternoon off next week, and will see about giving them a call that day, when I can be on the phone with them and at the piano at the same time.

In the meantime, I've been finding that keeping it set to Jazz Grand is working pretty well for me. Though I have to admit, just to see how it would sound, I just bought a used Roland Integra-7 on eBay, so I can see what its SuperNATURAL grand piano sounds like when run through the CS10's sound system. I'd read someone mention that when doing something like that, the touch curve might need to be adjusted. So I'll have to figure out what that means, and how to adjust it appropriately. laugh

If I'm not careful, I'm gonna wind up with enough virtual pianos to use a different one every day of the month.


Jayson
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Originally Posted by JFP
Originally Posted by SomeGuyNamedJayson
...So I'm currently mulling over what to do.
Furthermore , there's lots to tweak with the Virtual Designer , EQ , touch curve settings etc. I would suggest using and adjusting your favorite presets to your liking rather than stick to the first grand preset in default factory mode. I'm sure that will help a lot. As for PT5 over the CA/CS - tried it recently again with PT5 , but every time I come back to the build-in sounds. Works better somehow. You could carefully layer some PT presets with the build-in sounds however to create a more natural and longer sustain. I also tried Roland SN sounds over the CA95 and that worked better than using PT IMHO.


Some good ideas in there, JFP. Now that you put it that way, it does seem like one of the major advantages of a digital piano is being able to tweak it to perform the way you like it, rather than just having to accept what it does by default. James had mentioned calling Kawai to and talking with them about it, and I'm going to do that

Also, I like the idea you had about layering the built-in sounds with either Pianoteq or Roland SN. I've ordered a used Integra-7, and when that comes in, I'll be able to give that a try.


Jayson
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Has the OP looked at the string resonance or touch settings?


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We'll , it was actually the sound of an FA-08 , but that's basically the same as an Integra.

By the way , I am signing off , of the forum. Enjoyed my time here. Time to move on. All the best !

Cheers, J

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Any special reason, that you are leaving after more than 1000 posts?

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