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Re: Kawai MP11
brooster #2281341 05/26/14 04:43 PM
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I'm using a pair of Behringer ms16 powered studio monitors . I got them used for $50 off criagslist, but new they're $80 so that's quite affordable. For the money I think they're good, but of course, the sky's the limit on what you could spend for better quality. Best to establish what you're willing to spend first and then get suggestions in that budget. smile


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Re: Kawai MP11
brooster #2281416 05/26/14 07:48 PM
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What do people thing of the Kraft Music Studio Bundle? Is it better for someone who doesn't know much about studio equipment to go with a bundle or buy things separately? I know the bundle choices are not always the best quality choice. But, to get things started, are they horrible choices?

http://www.kraftmusic.com/kawai-mp11-professional-stage-piano-complete-studio-bundle.html

Last edited by dynamobt; 05/26/14 07:51 PM.

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Re: Kawai MP11
dynamobt #2281449 05/26/14 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted by dynamobt
What do people thing of the Kraft Music Studio Bundle? Is it better for someone who doesn't know much about studio equipment to go with a bundle or buy things separately? I know the bundle choices are not always the best quality choice. But, to get things started, are they horrible choices?

http://www.kraftmusic.com/kawai-mp11-professional-stage-piano-complete-studio-bundle.html


That looks like a pretty nice bundle, in my opinion. I'd prefer a table stand instead of a z-stand (for leg room), and the FC-7 expression pedal may not be necessary for players who wish to focus on piano, but apart from that it's a very complete package.

Ah, congrats to FarmGirl on the MP11 too - my apologies for not clearly stating that the instrument does not feature built-in speakers on the Kawai MP website/owner's manual.

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Re: Kawai MP11
dynamobt #2281455 05/26/14 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by dynamobt
What do people thing of the Kraft Music Studio Bundle? Is it better for someone who doesn't know much about studio equipment to go with a bundle or buy things separately? I know the bundle choices are not always the best quality choice. But, to get things started, are they horrible choices?

http://www.kraftmusic.com/kawai-mp11-professional-stage-piano-complete-studio-bundle.html


I got this bundle. I haven't used the expression pedal as of yet, but it may come in handy more for my MOX6. The stand is what I'm using now and it works OK, I just have to use it with an adjustable bench and not the one it come with because that doesn't happen to be a good height for me. So really the only thing you possibly may upgrade later on is the bench, but it's a good deal. Oh, and the USB stick they give didn't work well with the MP11, but it certainly can be used elsewhere.


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Re: Kawai MP11
brooster #2281471 05/26/14 09:39 PM
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Good to know the bundle isn't a bunch of junk. I know nothing of sound equipment. Yet, if I ever need a digital piano, I like the idea of a semi-portable stage piano instead of a cabnet model. I really have no reason to buy a digital piano right now. I can play whenever I want at home on my Mason & Hamlin. But the MP 11 is such a dynamite instrument I'm half tempted to buy it anyway. Then that moment of insanity vanishes. Besides, I know that digitals will only get better and better with time. I admit to be somewhat fascinated by these choices.


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Re: Kawai MP11
brooster #2281599 05/27/14 02:38 AM
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Thank you everyone. I will get 501s. I bought something called home bundle from the website and it did not come with speakers. I thought it would come with a built in speakers. Not a big deal. I love the sound. It sometimes gives me illusion as though I'm playing good.

Re: Kawai MP11
FarmGirl #2281632 05/27/14 04:08 AM
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Originally Posted by FarmGirl
Thank you everyone. I will get 501s. I bought something called home bundle from the website and it did not come with speakers. I thought it would come with a built in speakers. Not a big deal. I love the sound. It sometimes gives me illusion as though I'm playing good.


The Tannoy monitors will not disappoint you. I love mine to death. Make sure you buy XLR cables to go with them, as I don't think they come with them!

I mean no offense by this, but the fact that you bought this not even knowing it didn't come with speakers is amusing. I find it funny because you ended up with something far more professional and refined than anything with built-in speakers. I'm sure you did your research, but if this was a happy accident I think you did very, very well. Enjoy!


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Re: Kawai MP11
dynamobt #2281638 05/27/14 04:19 AM
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Originally Posted by dynamobt
Good to know the bundle isn't a bunch of junk. I know nothing of sound equipment. Yet, if I ever need a digital piano, I like the idea of a semi-portable stage piano instead of a cabnet model. I really have no reason to buy a digital piano right now. I can play whenever I want at home on my Mason & Hamlin. But the MP 11 is such a dynamite instrument I'm half tempted to buy it anyway. Then that moment of insanity vanishes. Besides, I know that digitals will only get better and better with time. I admit to be somewhat fascinated by these choices.


Well, I washed down my recent Steinway with this purchase and I love playing both, so I certainly wouldn't discourage you!


2012 NY Steinway Model B | Kawai MP11 | Nord Stage 3 Compact | Moog Sub 37 | Behringer DeepMind 12 | Sequential Circuits Prophet 6 | Korg Prologue
Re: Kawai MP11
FarmGirl #2281689 05/27/14 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by FarmGirl
Thank you everyone. I will get 501s. I bought something called home bundle from the website and it did not come with speakers. I thought it would come with a built in speakers. Not a big deal. I love the sound. It sometimes gives me illusion as though I'm playing good.


I'm so glad you like it. I really am enjoying mine since it is my only piano for the summer.

Wait until you want to record on it! No more dogs and husbands doing stuff in the background...at least, we won't know of it LOL! smile


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Re: Kawai MP11
brooster #2281723 05/27/14 09:38 AM
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James:

Any word on a new software update to resolve the aforementioned issues with parameters randomly changing values?

I've been using the Panel Lock button which works as a good temporary solution.


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Re: Kawai MP11
Morodiene #2281744 05/27/14 10:43 AM
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I thought I would mention that if anyone wants to upgrade their headphones to a pro studio monitoring set, the AKG 271 MKll which normally sells for $199 is on Amazon for $120. The AKG phones top out at $1500 so these are relatively inexpensive.

I've had the older AKG 271 for several years and they still sound wonderful and are very comfortable. I've just had to stitch up one of the leather ear pads.

I can't image working with the Kawai MP pianos using cheaper headphones.


Re: Kawai MP11
fastlanephil #2281836 05/27/14 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by fastlanephil
I thought I would mention that if anyone wants to upgrade their headphones to a pro studio monitoring set, the AKG 271 MKll which normally sells for $199 is on Amazon for $120. The AKG phones top out at $1500 so these are relatively inexpensive.

I've had the older AKG 271 for several years and they still sound wonderful and are very comfortable. I've just had to stitch up one of the leather ear pads.

I can't image working with the Kawai MP pianos using cheaper headphones.



I use Sony MDR-V6 studio monitor cans. Are these inadequate?


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Re: Kawai MP11
fastlanephil #2281865 05/27/14 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by fastlanephil
I thought I would mention that if anyone wants to upgrade their headphones to a pro studio monitoring set, the AKG 271 MKll which normally sells for $199 is on Amazon for $120. The AKG phones top out at $1500 so these are relatively inexpensive.


I've been doing a LOT of headphone research in the last several days and I think it would be prudent to sound a word of warning about this low price on amazon, and other similar offers. Apparently there are a lot of counterfeit and gray market headphones being sold on various internet sites, including amazon. On amazon, these are almost always being sold by amazon marketplace sellers who are not authorized distributors for the brands of headphones they are selling. The prices are usually much lower than the usual prices from the music stores like Sweetwater, Kraft, B&H, etc.

I don't know if this specific offer for the AKG K271 is for bogus headphones or not, but the seller is one of those unauthorized dealers selling a lot of name brand headphones at bargain basement prices. I would be wary of such offers -- the counterfeit headphone market is something that is really happening.

I am planning to upgrade my Sony 7506 headphones for use with my Kawai MP11. The Sony's are among the most counterfeited models, though mine are genuine. They're very good for low-priced headphones, but I'm looking for something more high-end, either the Sennheiser HD 598 or the AKG K701. Both of these highly-rated headphones can be had at bargain prices from unauthorized sellers. But as this is a situation of "caveat emptor" ("buyer beware"), I am going to bite the bullet, pay more, and purchase my new headphones from an authorized seller who guarantees that the product is genuine.

Re: Kawai MP11
Morodiene #2281998 05/27/14 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Morodiene
Any word on a new software update to resolve the aforementioned issues with parameters randomly changing values?


Yes, we have prepared beta software versions for the MP11 and MP7 that should resolve this issue, in addition to raising the Line Out volume, and some other tweaks requested by users related to temperament setting and 'fast' key modes on the MP7.

I am happy to send this beta version to you, however as you are already in correspondence with Alan (at Kawai America), I recommend emailing him so that he has your email address and can provide the software to you directly.

Kind regards,
James
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Re: Kawai MP11
Kawai James #2282014 05/27/14 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Originally Posted by Morodiene
Any word on a new software update to resolve the aforementioned issues with parameters randomly changing values?


Yes, we have prepared beta software versions for the MP11 and MP7 that should resolve this issue, in addition to raising the Line Out volume, and some other tweaks requested by users related to temperament setting and 'fast' key modes on the MP7.

I am happy to send this beta version to you, however as you are already in correspondence with Alan, I recommend emailing him so that he has your email address and can provide the software to you directly.

Kind regards,
James
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Thank you, James, I have sent Alan an email. smile


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Re: Kawai MP11
Morodiene #2282048 05/27/14 11:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Morodiene
Originally Posted by Kawai James
Originally Posted by Morodiene
Any word on a new software update to resolve the aforementioned issues with parameters randomly changing values?


Yes, we have prepared beta software versions for the MP11 and MP7 that should resolve this issue, in addition to raising the Line Out volume, and some other tweaks requested by users related to temperament setting and 'fast' key modes on the MP7.

I am happy to send this beta version to you, however as you are already in correspondence with Alan, I recommend emailing him so that he has your email address and can provide the software to you directly.

Kind regards,
James
x
Thank you, James, I have sent Alan an email. smile


This is very good news, thank you. I have also sent an email to Alan to obtain the update. I'm especially intrigued by the mention of "tweaks...related to temperament setting", which is no doubt a response to requests of mine. Also, raising the Line Out volume is a necessary and important adjustment and it is very good news to hear that this has been done. Kudos to Kawai for being so responsive to user input!

I have found many ways to tweak the acoustic piano sound on my MP11, and the sound is getting better and better as this process progresses. Today I discovered that the "octave" parameter can be used creatively to greatly enhance the fullness, richness, and warmth of the acoustic piano sound! Fortunately, the MP11 has enough polyphony to do this without any bad side effects. The MP11 is easily the best digital piano I've ever had the pleasure to play!



Re: Kawai MP11
Savante #2282681 05/29/14 10:37 AM
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I am trying the MP11 out for our church. Can anyone share your settings or things that you have found to improve the piano sound? I played it for the first time in service last night with default settings. Coming from a Yamaha digital, the sound seems too bright and thin. Comments from the congregation were that it is too keyboard sounding and tinny. Any assistance on creating a warmer, less harsh sound would be appreciated.

Re: Kawai MP11
brooster #2282762 05/29/14 01:32 PM
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I have the MP7. Yes the default piano sound is a little bright and thin. It helps to use EQ to boost the bass a little and reduce the highs. You can also try some of the mellow settings (either via voicing in the Virtual Technician or using the Mellow Grand sound). I believe there is also an additional brightness control somewhere in the MP11 that is not in the MP7. I did briefly try layering two different piano sounds to fatten the sound, (didn't much like the results), but I'm not sure if that's possible with the MP11.


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Re: Kawai MP11
jaxplanner #2282777 05/29/14 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by jaxplanner
I am trying the MP11 out for our church. Can anyone share your settings or things that you have found to improve the piano sound? I played it for the first time in service last night with default settings. Coming from a Yamaha digital, the sound seems too bright and thin. Comments from the congregation were that it is too keyboard sounding and tinny. Any assistance on creating a warmer, less harsh sound would be appreciated.


Every piano will sound different in every setting, because different equipment accentuates different aspects. Your old Yamaha had been tweaked to suit the system, now you must do the same for the MP11.

You can first start with a piano sound that is closer to your desired sound: perhaps the Pop Mellow Piano sound, and then in the Virtual Technician you can adjust the Voicing to Mellow 1 or 2, and then beyond that you can change the Brilliance parameter (instructions can be found on p. 50 of the manual).

Also, you may want to adjust the Touch Curve setting to Heavy, which would require you to really press down harder/faster to get more of a bright sound.

Be sure to store this setting for the particular sound so that each time to call up that voice you get those settings.

Once you have done these things, you can still alter the EQ, which would affect the entire piano (not just that particular sound). These adjustments should get you the exact sound you like.


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Re: Kawai MP11
jaxplanner #2282804 05/29/14 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by jaxplanner
I am trying the MP11 out for our church. Can anyone share your settings or things that you have found to improve the piano sound? I played it for the first time in service last night with default settings. Coming from a Yamaha digital, the sound seems too bright and thin. Comments from the congregation were that it is too keyboard sounding and tinny. Any assistance on creating a warmer, less harsh sound would be appreciated.


I have been working extensively with this, and have managed to achieve very satisfactory results with a lot of experimentation. All the tweaks mentioned by Morodiene are important options to play with. Personally I have found that using several parameters, rather than just one or two, to dial in the best tone works best. That way I use each paramater gently, rather than big offsets from the defaults. I have had best results with the Concert Grand sound, but I do roll off the high end a bit, using several parameters. The "Brilliance" parameter works well to take the edge off the brittle treble without smothering and deadening the sound too much. But I also use this in conjunction with a little EQ, and sometimes with the voicing and touch curve parameters too -- though I like to avoid the touch curve parameter if I can because the settings are a bit too much and compress the velocity range of the instrument more than I like. I wish there were in a couple settings in between Normal and Heavy -- the difference between the presets is too great.

For thickening up the bit-too-thin sound I have begun working with the Octave parameters and this has been working quite well. This is a form of layering, though not nearly as effective as can be achieved on the MP7. Still, it can be made to work pretty well. I am getting good results from setting the "Octave" to "On", "Oct. Level" to 64, "Oct. Range" to zero, and "Oct. Detune" to zero. This gives a subtle layer on the unison, which fills out the sound quite nicely.

You can also experiment with the Cutoff setting, though I find myself usually leaving it at zero on the acoustic pianos. I do use it extensively to tweak the tone of the EPs.

You can fill out the overly-thin sound a bit with the envelope parameters too -- I add +2 to the amp decay and +2 to the amp release. So far I leave the filter envelope parameters at default levels.

If you're not set in stone on trying to sound just like an acoustic grand piano, there is another very effective way to fill out the piano sound which is to add a subtle layer of a well-tweaked EP. The factory EP settings are way overly "effected" (somebody is much too in love with the "autopan", which I always turn off!). First you will have to work to get a good basic EP sound. For me, this has taken a lot of tweaking, but the basic samples are actually excellent so it is possible, with patience and persistence, to get excellent EP sounds. Then layer that with your acoustic piano (without the Octave setting) perhaps somewhere about 80% AP and 20% EP, or even 85-15. There are lots of possibilities in this direction.

The usual caveats apply -- your sound system and listening environment have a huge effect on the overall sound. I find I need different settings for my headphones (Sony 7506) and my monitors (Mackie HR824). Sometimes I even need different settings for the morning than for the evening! (I'm not sure what that's all about!)

The basic message is: Don't accept the factory defaults! This instrument has a huge number of very effective user-adjustable parameters. If you use them, keep experimenting, and keep listening, you can get great results!

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