Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.7 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Find a Professional
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Advertise on Piano World

(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Who's Online Now
123 registered members (amyram, AndrewJCW, AlphaBravoCharlie, 604Rakuda, amad23, ArturC, 36251, ando, 8ude, 30 invisible), 1,716 guests, and 5 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 5 1 2 3 4 5
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227426
02/23/08 04:15 PM
02/23/08 04:15 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 999
The Midwest
George K Offline OP
500 Post Club Member
George K  Offline OP
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 999
The Midwest
Ignore this bubble post. cool


[Linked Image]
Piano & Music Gifts & Accessories (570)
Piano accessories and music gift items, digital piano dolly, music theme party goods
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227427
02/23/08 05:14 PM
02/23/08 05:14 PM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,288
Cincinnati
mikhailoh Offline
4000 Post Club Member
mikhailoh  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,288
Cincinnati
Quote
Originally posted by Monica K.:
George, this statement bothered me the most of the whole story. As you point out, Bohemia is within their rights to replace OR repair the piano, so as much as the new piano seems like the best option (I'm leaning with everybody else here), when push comes to shove they have the right to insist on repairing the piano. frown
They may have a legal right to insist on repairing the piano, but then they are asking the purchaser to accept a piano that is worth far less in resale than it should be. And for THREE cracks in the same soundboard? What will they do when the fourth adn fifth ones show up?

Repairing such a major flaw is, IMO, unacceptable. If this is how they handle the situation, could you ever with good conscience recommend anyone consider a Bohemia? I could not.


Michael

====

He is so solemn, detached and uninvolved he makes Mr. Spock look like Hunter S. Thompson at closing time.'
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227428
02/23/08 09:08 PM
02/23/08 09:08 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,051
K
kenny Offline
7000 Post Club Member
kenny  Offline
7000 Post Club Member
K

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,051
Quote
Originally posted by George K:
Ignore this bubble post. cool
Here George.
You may borrow my bubble.

[Linked Image]

Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227429
02/23/08 09:19 PM
02/23/08 09:19 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 999
The Midwest
George K Offline OP
500 Post Club Member
George K  Offline OP
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 999
The Midwest
Kenny, thanks. It's nice to know that someone's got my back.

If you know what I mean....


[Linked Image]
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227430
02/23/08 09:21 PM
02/23/08 09:21 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,051
K
kenny Offline
7000 Post Club Member
kenny  Offline
7000 Post Club Member
K

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,051
George you just crack me up.
You crack everyone up.
In fact you crack everything up . . .

Opps . . . sorry. . . shocked . . . didn't mean to crack a joke.

Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227431
02/23/08 09:52 PM
02/23/08 09:52 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 677
divadeb Offline
500 Post Club Member
divadeb  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 677
George, I don't think I'd be comfortable with a repair. In my opinion, a warranty on such a significant issue should be resolved in a way that leaves the consumer feeling relaxed and confident about the company's intentions. I would feel more comfortable if, after examination, they offered *you* the choice between repair and replacement, but I'd be very uncomfortable with the idea that they should be the ones to make that decision.

Do keep us posted. There's a significant audience watching the resolution of this situation.


Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig.

www.divadeb.com
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227432
02/23/08 10:07 PM
02/23/08 10:07 PM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,047
United States
Frank_W Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Frank_W  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,047
United States
Time for a new piano. There simply is no other acceptable option.


Compassion, Love, Strength, Peace, Dignity, Balance, Order
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227433
02/23/08 10:13 PM
02/23/08 10:13 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,171
Wisconsin
markjpcs Offline
3000 Post Club Member
markjpcs  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,171
Wisconsin
George,

This is 100% BS on your dealer's part and on the part of Bohemia.

My first Estonia 190 which I fell in love with at the dealership had a small dent in the soundboard that I did not notice at the dealership. Two or three months passed until I noticed it. It was not a crack but just a dent near the rim where someone must have used just a little too much pressure on a clamp or something during the manufacturing process.

I call my dealer (Cordogan's in Chicago) to express my concern with the long term ramifications of this dent. Their response was simply "Whatever you want to do Mark. If you want a different piano, you can come select a new one from inventory or wait until the next shipment arrives". I waited until the next shipment arrived. Six months after I took delivery I went down and fell in love all over again. No questions asked, no charge, I had a new piano in my living a week later.

Look for a PM from me.

If Bohemia will not replace this piano or refund you your money 100% I will join Mik and the Bohemia name and your dealer (yes I know who they are) will be poison for the rest of my life.

I recommend Bohemia to people looking for new pianos as well as Estonia and other brands depending on various factors. I am pretty influential when it comes to pianos when people ask what to buy.

My own Mother-In-Law bought a Bohemia on my recommendation, her playing and hearing for herself and other factors. She insisted that I play it for her more than she played it herself so she could hear the difference in sounds to the other brands on the floor. She then chose to bust her budget and get the Bohemia. She was looking at smaller less expensive new and and even used pianos at the time.

Anyway you should insist on a new piano or a 100% refund.

Nothing else my friend. Nothing else.

Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227434
02/23/08 10:49 PM
02/23/08 10:49 PM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,645
An Indiana University
U S A P T Offline
1000 Post Club Member
U S A P T  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,645
An Indiana University
I'd let the dealer take the piano and have good faith that it will be rectified. The piano world operates very slowly and very deliberately -- dealing as it does with 300-year old technology.

I trust that this will all come out to your satisfaction.


Full-Time Music/Entrepreneurship Major: (Why not compose music AND businesses?)
Former Piano Industry Professional
************
Steinway M
Roland Atelier AT90R
************
All Posts are Snarky Unless Otherwise Noted
************
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227435
02/23/08 11:03 PM
02/23/08 11:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,862
Kansas
apple* Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
apple*  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,862
Kansas
Gosh George,

i surely hope that Bohemia just replaces your piano. i realize that it may not be quite like yours, in that all pianos have their own character and soul. There are too many unknowns with the acceptance of that piano repaired, as replacement. If it turns out the repair is lasting and will not devalue the piano that is one thing, but you will not know that for many years.

I encourage you to contact Bohemia directly. Perhaps the representative for American sales is familiar with Piano World. I cannot imagine any other solution except a dollar amount refunded to you so you can make your own choice and perhaps chose a tested piano.

I'm very sorry you have to deal with it. I think this dramatic of a flaw is a first, at least in my book.

Please keep us posted on developments. I know how excited you were to purchase that beautiful piano.


Kenny... this is no time to crack jokes. eek


accompanist/organist.. a non-MTNA teacher to a few

love and peace, ├Ľun (apple in Estonian)
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227436
02/23/08 11:05 PM
02/23/08 11:05 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 2,419
Columbus, Ohio
Dwain Lee Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Dwain Lee  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 2,419
Columbus, Ohio
George, if I had just purchased a piano a year ago, and took care of it in the manner it sounds like you have, and it developed a problem like this, I'd be very unhappy. If the soundboard developed one small crack, I'd grouse about it but accept a shim/repair as necessary - but for three distinct cracks so soon, I'd expect either a new soundboard, or a completely new piano from the manufacturer. I hope that the manufacturer deals honestly and fairly with you. I don't know anything about this particular manufacturer, but I hope they realize the potential effect - good or bad - that having your problem discussed on as widely read a piano forum as this could have on the company's reputation. Let's hope they do the right thing.

Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227437
02/24/08 01:02 AM
02/24/08 01:02 AM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 742
bachophile Offline
500 Post Club Member
bachophile  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 742
simply not acceptable. its their good name on the line.

if need be i will turn to the local dealers and enquire as to their policy in such a case.

u want to sell pianos...? first be a mensch.


"I don't know much about classical music. For years I thought the Goldberg Variations were something Mr. and Mrs. Goldberg did on their wedding night." Woody Allen
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227438
02/24/08 01:16 AM
02/24/08 01:16 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4
NC
Jodi_G Offline
Junior Member
Jodi_G  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4
NC
George, I would not be comfortable with a repair. Three cracks within a year?? No, that calls for a replacement. I've heard such good things about this company, I sure hope they come through on this. Their name is on the line, IMO.


~ Jodi
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227439
02/24/08 02:08 AM
02/24/08 02:08 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 6,966
The Evergreen State (WA)
jodi Offline
6000 Post Club Member
jodi  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 6,966
The Evergreen State (WA)
Wow, George. These cracks would freak me out too. I hope you can get this matter resolved to your satisfaction.

smile Jodi

Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227440
02/24/08 02:45 AM
02/24/08 02:45 AM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,546
US
sophial Offline
3000 Post Club Member
sophial  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,546
US
Quote
Originally posted by Jodi_G:
George, I would not be comfortable with a repair. Three cracks within a year?? No, that calls for a replacement. I've heard such good things about this company, I sure hope they come through on this. Their name is on the line, IMO.
Yes, second that.

Sophia

Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227441
02/24/08 03:28 AM
02/24/08 03:28 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,654
New York City
Phlebas Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Phlebas  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,654
New York City
As someone who will be in the market for a new grand in the next couple years, and who has played and liked Bohemias, you can bet I'm following this thread very closely.

They should definitely replace the piano. One crack? OK, try to repair it. One crack in one year? Replace it. Three cracks in one year? Forget about it. It's a no-brainer.

Good luck, and like I said, I will be following this one.

By the way, I wouldn't be too bothered by the upright as a loaner.

Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227442
02/24/08 03:37 AM
02/24/08 03:37 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 14,245
Louisiana
Jolly Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Jolly  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 14,245
Louisiana
While we sometimes engage in Walter Mitty fantasies about how much impact this board has on the piano industry, the fact is that having a good name on the board can help sell pianos. Witness the Estonia sales that were consumated because of a loud and vocal following on PianoWorld.

M&H also comes to mind as a board favorite, and the sales that fed off of advice to give the brand a test-drive.

Hey, I even know of a guy who probably helped sell a Nordiska, or two. wink

I've suggested Bohemia to people looking for good value and an alternative to the Japanese. Their uprights have been particulary good, and they are also a favorite recommendation by a former R-K dealer at Piano Facts.

My personal opinion would lead me to be hopeful that Bohemia will do the right thing, and make the customer happy....after all, George has probably helped them sell a Bohemia, or two...


www.coffee-room.com

Over 1.4M (and counting) posts where pianists discuss everything. And nothing.
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227443
02/24/08 04:25 AM
02/24/08 04:25 AM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,559
Sandy Eggo, California
O
OperaTenor Offline
2000 Post Club Member
OperaTenor  Offline
2000 Post Club Member
O

Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,559
Sandy Eggo, California
As a generality, sound board cracks are no big deal. Well, if the sound board in question is at least 50 years old, maybe. :rolleyes:

George, I'm in the camp that says they need to replace your piano. There's no reasonable excuse for a one year-old piano to have developed the cracks your photos show - no good reason at all. It has to be a defect that warrants replacement instead of repair.

Having been in the customer service business, I know how much long term good will [and therefore profit] is sown by keeping the customer happy. Anyone with half a brain would realize you could never look at your piano in the same light again, regardless of the extent of any repair effected on it. And that shift in perception is for all the right reasons.

I hope for the best for you, George.


Happiness is a freshly tuned piano.
Jim Boydston, proprietor, No Piano Left Behind - technician
www.facebook.com/NoPianoLeftBehind
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227444
02/24/08 04:51 AM
02/24/08 04:51 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,618
Geneva, Switzerland
PoStTeNeBrAsLuX Offline
2000 Post Club Member
PoStTeNeBrAsLuX  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,618
Geneva, Switzerland
Michael:
You might be able to live with one shimmed crack to keep the sound you love - but three? No way. Your choice of new piano is the only acceptable resolution.

Indeed. I sincerely hope that the manufacturer/distributor takes on its/their responsibilities and replaces the piano toot sweet. They can recondition/rebuild it in their own time and then sell it for what it's worth, rather than the client (who paid 'new piano' money) having to take the fall for what is obviously an instrument with an inherent instability, at least as it is now.

Michael B.


There are two rules to success in life: Rule #1. Don't tell people everything you know.
Re: Bohemia Grand - Soundboard Crack - Followup #227445
02/24/08 07:37 AM
02/24/08 07:37 AM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,288
Cincinnati
mikhailoh Offline
4000 Post Club Member
mikhailoh  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,288
Cincinnati
Quote
Originally posted by Jolly:
While we sometimes engage in Walter Mitty fantasies about how much impact this board has on the piano industry, the fact is that having a good name on the board can help sell pianos. Witness the Estonia sales that were consumated because of a loud and vocal following on PianoWorld.

M&H also comes to mind as a board favorite, and the sales that fed off of advice to give the brand a test-drive.

Hey, I even know of a guy who probably helped sell a Nordiska, or two. wink

I've suggested Bohemia to people looking for good value and an alternative to the Japanese. Their uprights have been particulary good, and they are also a favorite recommendation by a former R-K dealer at Piano Facts.

My personal opinion would lead me to be hopeful that Bohemia will do the right thing, and make the customer happy....after all, George has probably helped them sell a Bohemia, or two...
Good points.

We know for sure about hundreds of pianos purchased with advice from here. But there are what? Over 25,000 REGISTERED users on this board. That does not include all the people who come and look for advice, find it and never register or make a post. How many other purchases are influenced that way? I think itis very likely to be more than the ones we know of.

Edit: Make that 29,841 registered users!


Michael

====

He is so solemn, detached and uninvolved he makes Mr. Spock look like Hunter S. Thompson at closing time.'
Page 2 of 5 1 2 3 4 5

Moderated by  Ken Knapp, Piano World 

(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq Bechstein
Shop our Store for Music Lovers!
PianoSupplies.com is Piano World's Online Store
Please visit our store today.
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
New Topics - Multiple Forums
"Weaponizing" Off-Topic posts in large threads
by Gombessa. 10/17/19 12:30 PM
Impact Method....without Impact Hammer?
by Duaner. 10/17/19 12:04 PM
Yamaha AvantGrand N1X - Hands On Part Deux
by Gombessa. 10/17/19 11:55 AM
Philip Glass look out!!
by Peyton. 10/17/19 11:49 AM
Remove swirl marks, polish gloss ebony finish?
by TurboMatt. 10/17/19 10:48 AM
What's Hot!!
Our August Newsletter is Out!
------------------
Mason & Hamlin Piano Factory Tour!

-------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
Forum Statistics
Forums41
Topics194,575
Posts2,880,278
Members94,688
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers


Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2019 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1