Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Adult Beginners Forum Classical Sonata Analysis

Portato has a slur over it.

Well, yes. Yes, you should ... would love to hear you play it, if you do.

I will try this trick with the thumb (never even thought of it.) I'd been trying to just bring all fingers in my LH close to the fall board, to minimize the stretch. I can hit all the notes this way, but still an awkward stretch.



Oh, and please help yourself to a piece of cake, everyone. It is in celebration of my recent admittance to the 1000 post member club.

I am still working on my acceptance speech for the banquet tonight. Can't think of anyone to Thank ...

How is the Beethoven going?

Actually fine, Thank you for asking. Of course you knew I was going to have trouble with the next two chords.

OK Smarty, what are you going to suggest here?

As I was saying earlier, I will be going slowly. But I think I am starting to get ansy about moving along. I've spent a good deal of time on this bit. Beginning to sound nice.
I have not been learning a lot of new material lately. Just this and one other. But, both are hard. I need to pick up the pace a little bit. I will, but not yet .

Which two chords are we talking about?

OK, let me just take a look. I thought you knew.

We are up to M33, right? M35, LH Gb, Db, Bb (sorry 1 chord)

I'll just drop one. Which one? Can I roll it? I haven't been working at this much, but know its coming. I'd prefer to stop working here at a logical point and pick up elsewhere. I was intending to ask about this.

Can you suggest, where to stop and where to go next?

Yes.


52 seems a logical place to stop, being a sectional division. Where to go next - perhaps the trio?

I'm seeing measures and sections but this thread is confusing. Has analysis of a piece started again? Liszt and Beethoven?

Greener is working on the Liszt transcription of the third movement of the Beethoven 5th Symphony.

I see. Thanks for explaining.

There was a lot going on in April so I only caught up to this thread last night. This is the ABF and by definition we're all trying to learn and patch holes in what we know. Mine are in the area of names of pieces, composers, genres, musical form etc. There is actually a lot there potentially for learning and discussing where this thread first started up again. I made a kind of list of anyone is interested. The discussion as it has evolved now, even if we find the score in IMSLP, I'm not sure we can do much with it as a group except watch. But potentially there are things that fit right in the purpose of the ABF and this thread.

Shall I post my ideas?

Yes, please.

This could help us, also in choosing next themed recital theme, yes? possibly? Seems anything 20th century related will run into copyright issues. So, maybe we will need to go back to Bach the beginning.



K, thanks ... I'll report back in a couple of months

keystring, I think you would get more participants in discussing your proposed topics if you started a new thread or threads for them.

Let me look briefly at keystring's post, which confused me a little:


So - you don't know enough pieces? Or you have trouble remembering the names of those you do know? Or something else?


Same question. Does this mean you want to become familiar with more composers?


Same question again; I'm not clear on what it means that "genres are a hole in your knowledge."

Ok, here goes

Where this thread starts up again, Polyphonist takes up a post by Dire Tonic with a link to a performance. Dire's point had been voices being brought out. It's followed by:



If this were the Pianist forum, everyone would be expected to be up on everything in there and just grab a point or two. But it's the ABF, and we're learners. The thread started to help us get at some rather basic things. As such, that beginning is quite rich.

- The announcer in the clip tells us that it's "Moments musicaux no. 3" by Schubert. I looked it up and found this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_moments_musicaux_(Schubert)

So we have Schubert doing something with a piece by Beethoven. Already we have for exploration: the nature of Schubert's music (and Schubert), that of Beethoven's music (and the composer); the original by Beethoven, the particular "Moment musical" by Schubert pertaining to it - getting at what's in each in order to see (hear) how one relates to the other. Remembering that we are learners, and some of us may know close to squat about any or several of these things.

Like many people who came to formal music education late in life, I have barn-size doors in some areas, mixed with major strengths in others. For me, for whatever reason in my life, it's in the area of composers, pieces, genres. When I was small entire passages swam through my head which I might hum or pick out at will, but no names attached themselves to them. That subject area is in here: Schubert, Beethoven, the particular pieces, comparing them, and who knows.

Here is another that I grabbed yesterday:

It piqued my interest in Godowsky. (Again my weakness with names, people, works etc.) Ofc I can looking him up on my own and find more of what he did. Discussing particular arrangements that people find especially good could be the subject of a separate thread.

Polyphonist, what is a "paraphrase" musically?

I highlighted this yesterday while going through this year's part of the thread:

Listening to those particular lines is my own homework - it's been set out for me. But now we have another composer - Brahms. I'm familiar with Brahms in a general vague kind of way, and before going deeply into music, I sang in a "Brahms choir" for a year. But like everything else, it's vague and spotty.

Is it possible, if you are deeply familiar with works, to bring out examples of works and passages by Brahms that are most like this Schubert in question, so we can really hear what a "luscious Brahmsian setting" means?

Here's one that I set up as "homework" for myself:


That score is still up there and I will definitely be bringing this to the piano.

Finally there is the "number 5" of Moments musicaux that Greener is working on, where we see exploration of various passages as areas of playing difficulty. That can't lead to much discussion by the group, but are there things about the 5th "Moment" that would be a good area to explore?

PianoStudent88 wrote this morning about starting new threads. My thought presently is that some of it is good for new threads, while some of it actually expands or brings out elements in this discussion.

So that's it, in the raw.

Sorry for not answering right away, Greener. I freelance, and right after posting I was hit with two projects, with both clients calling them urgent - so that's what I was doing. This is my "break".

I don't see Beethoven coming into the equation. It's Godowsky arranging a piece by Schubert.


An arrangement, typically a complicated one, of a work or group of themes.


I wasn't thinking of any Brahms works in particular. I meant that that particular passage exemplifies a quasi-Brahmsian style.

You wrote about it very recently.

But where does Schubert come into that one?

It doesn't - you've just witnessed my weakness. I mix up names. I don't know if it is part of that background I'm overcoming where I'm catching up to lots of things name-wise, or a disability with names in general, because I've been known to say that the traffic light has turned blue instead of green. Liszt turned into Schubert. For a long time they were just "many names". I wouldn't mix up Beethoven and Mozart, because each of them have a strong musical association for me. Other names still do and you just caught one such slip.

I've had a strange idea that might help you. Why not take a theme from each composer and get to know it very well. Then, when you hear that composer's name, you can associate it with that theme, and use the themes to distinguish them. That would turn a linguistic issue into a musical issue, which it seems it would be easier for you to resolve.

Then again, this might all be nonsense, in which case please inform me and I will remove it.