Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
What's Hot!!
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
(ad)
Piano Tuning
How to Tune Pianos
(125ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Piano Buyer Guide
Piano Buyer Spring 2017
(ad)
4th Finger Enigma Resolved!
Schumann's 4th Finger Enigma Resolved!
Who's Online Now
119 registered members (anotherscott, antzvu, AZ_Astro, ando, Agent88, 26 invisible), 921 guests, and 3 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#2253464 - 03/28/14 11:00 AM finger tips and key surface  
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
toddy Online content
2000 Post Club Member
toddy  Online Content
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
Portugal
It would have been nice to have one of the tackier 'ivory feel' key surfaces, but as it is, I have ordinary smooth acrylic key surfaces, as most pianos did until recently. Sometimes my finger slip on the surfaces.

But I do not think the problem is mostly to do with the key surfaces - if it were, my solution would be simple but expensive: replace a perfectly good DP for another with 'ivory/ebony' feel keys.

I think, though, the problem is mostly my fingers - especially as it's much worse sometimes, other times not even noticeable. I notice that in the evening it's usually more slippy, so my fingers are probably drier, then.

Does anyone else have this problem? If so, is there something you can put on your fingers to solve it. Some possible solutions:

1. Hands in bowl of hot water (what Glenn Gould used to do, but for different reasons)

2. Vinegar (seems to clean/cure most things and also hardens conckers)

3. Some kind of moisturing cream....Nivea?

4. Yoghurt (also touted as a panacea)

5. Other.

Last edited by toddy; 03/28/14 11:01 AM.

Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / NI K9 Ult. / Focusrite Saffire 24
W7, i7 4770, 16GB / Yamaha HS7s / HD598

Prudence is a rich ugly old maid courted by Incapacity. He who desires, but acts not, breeds pestilence.
William Blake, The Marriage of Heaven & heck
(ad) ROLAND

Click Here

#2253469 - 03/28/14 11:10 AM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,056
lolatu Offline
1000 Post Club Member
lolatu  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,056
UK
I found with my old acrylic key tops that a light dab of hair fibre putty on the fingertips worked wonders - mainly to stop fingers slipping off the black notes in quick runs. This seemed to be a problem after recently washing my hands with soap, as that would leave the skin smooth and dry, hence slippy on the smooth keys.

[Linked Image]

Main ingredients are water and "petrolatum", which seems to be a theme among hair products.


Kawai CA95 / Steinberg UR22 / Sony MDR-7506 / Pianoteq Stage + Grotrian / Galaxy Vintage D / CFX Lite
In the loft: Roland FP3 / Tannoy Reveal Active / K&M 18810
#2253471 - 03/28/14 11:13 AM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,110
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Morodiene  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,110
Boynton Beach, FL
I think most of your solutions would add to the problem by drying out the hands more. Get a good hand cream and apply it regularly to keep your hands from drying out - especially if you are in a drier climate.


private piano/voice teacher FT

[Linked Image][Linked Image][Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
#2253475 - 03/28/14 11:17 AM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
toddy Online content
2000 Post Club Member
toddy  Online Content
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
Portugal
What you describe sounds similar to what happens to me. But whether this curious product is available in Portugal. Hair fibre putty?? Anyway, thanks for the tip - I'll look out for it.

By the way, you seem to imply that ivory keys solved the problem. Did they, for you?


Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / NI K9 Ult. / Focusrite Saffire 24
W7, i7 4770, 16GB / Yamaha HS7s / HD598

Prudence is a rich ugly old maid courted by Incapacity. He who desires, but acts not, breeds pestilence.
William Blake, The Marriage of Heaven & heck
(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#2253478 - 03/28/14 11:20 AM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: Morodiene]  
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
toddy Online content
2000 Post Club Member
toddy  Online Content
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
Portugal
Originally Posted by Morodiene
I think most of your solutions would add to the problem by drying out the hands more. Get a good hand cream and apply it regularly to keep your hands from drying out - especially if you are in a drier climate.


So, you think a simple hand moisturiser would help? I'll definitely try that.

If that doesn't work, I'll look out for this putty stuff - even though I'm not sure what it is. It it kind of punky?.....You don't get so many punks or goths here.


Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / NI K9 Ult. / Focusrite Saffire 24
W7, i7 4770, 16GB / Yamaha HS7s / HD598

Prudence is a rich ugly old maid courted by Incapacity. He who desires, but acts not, breeds pestilence.
William Blake, The Marriage of Heaven & heck
#2253485 - 03/28/14 11:35 AM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,056
lolatu Offline
1000 Post Club Member
lolatu  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,056
UK
Originally Posted by toddy
By the way, you seem to imply that ivory keys solved the problem. Did they, for you?

I think they help a bit - maybe 25% of the problem if I were to estimate a number! Haven't had my new piano very long, so it's hard to judge.

Originally Posted by toddy
If that doesn't work, I'll look out for this putty stuff - even though I'm not sure what it is. It it kind of punky?.....You don't get so many punks or goths here.

I think it's pretty standard stuff that you should find if you browse the haircare section of your supermarket. However it's just what I happened to have around and found it worked. Other products might work just as well.


Kawai CA95 / Steinberg UR22 / Sony MDR-7506 / Pianoteq Stage + Grotrian / Galaxy Vintage D / CFX Lite
In the loft: Roland FP3 / Tannoy Reveal Active / K&M 18810
#2253486 - 03/28/14 11:36 AM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,110
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Morodiene  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,110
Boynton Beach, FL
Sometimes this happens to me, like if I've been doing the dishes or cleaning and my hands get dried out. Even on ivory feel or real ivory it's a bit slippery. Lotion seems to do the trick for me.


private piano/voice teacher FT

[Linked Image][Linked Image][Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
#2253495 - 03/28/14 11:50 AM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
toddy Online content
2000 Post Club Member
toddy  Online Content
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
Portugal
Interesting - thanks for the replies.

I went on a fact finding mission into the bathroom and found a tub of cream that I hadn't seen before. 'Hidratante' it says so I assume it's some kind of moisturizer. Yes - it seems to help.

And also, doing the dishes might be part of the problem. 'Housework hands' as they used to say. So yeah - a tub of good moisturizer will probably do the trick.


Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / NI K9 Ult. / Focusrite Saffire 24
W7, i7 4770, 16GB / Yamaha HS7s / HD598

Prudence is a rich ugly old maid courted by Incapacity. He who desires, but acts not, breeds pestilence.
William Blake, The Marriage of Heaven & heck
#2253569 - 03/28/14 03:33 PM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 3,931
Charles Cohen Offline
3000 Post Club Member
Charles Cohen  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 3,931
Richmond, BC, Canada
FWIW (and really off the wall) --

If the DP isn't worth a whole lot of money, you could "texture" the keys with sandpaper. My _guess_ is that 100-200 grit would gently roughen the surface, and give you better grip.

I wouldn't do this on a DP I expected to sell. And I haven't tried it on my own DP (Casio "Ivory Feel" surface already embossed).

. Charles



. Charles
---------------------------
PX-350 / microKorg XL+ / Pianoteq / Lounge Lizard / Korg Wavedrum / EV ZXA1 speaker
#2253656 - 03/28/14 06:59 PM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 163
ADWyatt Offline
Full Member
ADWyatt  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 163
Toddy, the good news is that I have the perfect solution (or at least the one that works for me). The bad news is that I live in the USA and you live in Portugal, and so you may not be able to buy the product I use.

I had exactly the same problem as you, and since I play with fingers curled as though they're holding onto a tennis ball, I needed only one small slip on the ivories, or one little misstep on the black keys, to send me flaming down.

The product I found that takes care of this very nicely is called "SORTKWIK" which I purchase at my local Wal-Mart. Although it wouldn't seem to work, as it advertises itself as a fingertip moistener, it states that it is "The easy, clean way to get a better grip." After swiping all ten fingers in this pink solution, I slowly rub the fingertips of both hands together until they have a nice gripping feel.

Wal-Mart office workers use this product to quickly sort through papers, and they never have to wet their fingers. And I never have a problem on the keyboard using it.

However, if you should find this product I would warn you to take two precautions in using it. First, it would be a very good idea to wash your hands thoroughly before eating after you've used SORTKWIK. I would imagine that it's not dangerous if a small amount of it is transferred orally (although it cautions against contact with the eyes), especially as there are no warnings regarding ingestion. Secondly, I think it would be a very good idea to clean your piano keys regularly, perhaps every two days, to keep residue from the product accumulating. Of course, you will have to use a non-abrasive cleaner to prevent scratches to the key surfaces.

While SORTKWIK is made in the United States, a similar product, made just for finger gripping, might be available in the stationary isle of any large department store. Hope this helps.

#2253679 - 03/28/14 07:56 PM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
toddy Online content
2000 Post Club Member
toddy  Online Content
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
Portugal
Charles, sanding the keys might result in a better grip, as fake ivory probably would. But I really want to keep the piano in it's present good condition. Anyway, I'm almost sure that the fingers themselves are the main culprits here - and much easier to deal with. lolato estimates ivory keys help 25%, though I reckon it maybe less.

I've started using a moisturizer as Morodiende suggests, and it works. I'll certainly look out for the products mentioned by lolato and WDWyatt mention. Yours, WDWyatt sounds as if it's manufactured specifically for this kind of problem, so would be interesting to try.

Thanks for all the ideas - I think they'll be useful - and not only for me.


Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / NI K9 Ult. / Focusrite Saffire 24
W7, i7 4770, 16GB / Yamaha HS7s / HD598

Prudence is a rich ugly old maid courted by Incapacity. He who desires, but acts not, breeds pestilence.
William Blake, The Marriage of Heaven & heck
#2254989 - 03/31/14 07:11 PM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,056
lolatu Offline
1000 Post Club Member
lolatu  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,056
UK
I just did a direct side-by-side comparison between the Kawai CA95 (ivory / wood feel) and my old Roland (smooth keytops), and found the Roland's smooth surface is actually grippier! It's the case for both white and black keys, but more so with the black keys. This is counterintuitive and (not being a tribologist) I don't have a good explanation.

The texture on Kawai's ivory-feel white keys is barely perceptible (you can maybe just about feel it if you run your nail over the surface). The black keys (of which the whole of the visible part is a lump of moulded plastic) have a more pronounced texture - not like wood grain, just kind of generic rough.

So I retract my estimate of 25% improvement in grip. I don't have a Roland ivory-feel to test, so maybe that's different. Anyway I am now of the opinion that ivory-feel does nothing to improve grip and is probably detrimental.


Kawai CA95 / Steinberg UR22 / Sony MDR-7506 / Pianoteq Stage + Grotrian / Galaxy Vintage D / CFX Lite
In the loft: Roland FP3 / Tannoy Reveal Active / K&M 18810
#2254999 - 03/31/14 07:49 PM Re: finger tips and key surface [Re: toddy]  
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
toddy Online content
2000 Post Club Member
toddy  Online Content
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,963
Portugal
Well mow me down! I'm still of the opinion that it's mostly down to the condition of your fingers and from what you're saying, acrylic is as good as anything.

Hand cream seems to do the trick, for now, anyway. Also slightly counter-intuitive because it is kind of oily, itself and slips around on your fingers. But it works!


Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / NI K9 Ult. / Focusrite Saffire 24
W7, i7 4770, 16GB / Yamaha HS7s / HD598

Prudence is a rich ugly old maid courted by Incapacity. He who desires, but acts not, breeds pestilence.
William Blake, The Marriage of Heaven & heck

Moderated by  Piano World 

Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World)
our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, Digital Piano Dolly, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.


Free Shipping* on Jansen Artist Piano Benches, Cocoweb Piano Lamps, Hidrau Hydraulic Piano Benches
(*free shipping within contiguous U.S. only)
(ad)
Pearl River & Ritmuller
Ritmuller Pianos
(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq 6 Out now
(ad)
Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restorations and sales
ad
Pierce Piano Atlas


New Topics - Multiple Forums
European Piano Party 2018 in Germany?
by patH. 10/18/17 05:26 PM
Home made tape deck Electone - awesome!
by Doug M.. 10/18/17 04:15 PM
Best computer based learning program...?
by Pologuy. 10/18/17 02:41 PM
VIII Piano Composition Competition Fidelio via Internet
by fideliovconcurso. 10/18/17 02:23 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums44
Topics182,366
Posts2,665,534
Members88,990
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Check It Out!
There's a lot more to Piano World than just the forums.
Click Here to
Explore The Rest of Piano World!!
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2017 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0