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Originally Posted by Kawai James
The ES7, CN34, and CN24 all utilise the same RHII action.

I wonder how this will price vs. the ES7 In the U.S., the ES7 is $1999. Apart from the speakers, the MP7 looks like a nice step up... same action, better piano sound, and a lot more in the way of additional sounds and MIDI functionality. It would seem that the MP7 either has to sell for more than $1999, or the ES7 price should be reduced...?

Originally Posted by Kawai James
Originally Posted by IMOL
Unfortunately, the only disappointment is that personally and I think many others expected at least a small improvement on weight.


Yes, that's a fair criticism. However I think it would be tough to deliver a sub-20kg 88-key MP without switching to a plastic construction and using an AC power adaptor. Such actions would be at odds with the 'no compromises' philosophy of the MP instruments.

I would love to see Kawai maintain the MP7 as is as a no-compromise version of what it is, but also offer, say, an MP-7L (Lite) which is the same board with the necessary physical compromises as you describe to get the weight as low as possible. I think total sales of the two combined would be higher as a result, but it would be interesting to see the mix of sales between the two. (Of course, relative price would play a factor there as well.) Though I know that one of the challenges of plastic chassis is that the initial fabrication cost is high, so you have to be pretty confident in being able to project the sales volume to justify it.

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For me the mp7 can be what I´ve been looking for. I seems to have what the CP4 haven´t when it comes to organ and drawbars. And the MIDI functionality of the Mp7 seems so be very good. To bad it doesn´t have the XLR-out.

Here in europe the MP11 is a little bit cheaper than the Roland RD800 so it will be interesting to see what the price of the MP7 will be.

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And it´s just a little bit bigger than the cp4, 1352 x 339 x 171 mm, and 21kg.

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For someone who would use the MP7 primarily as a piano, how does the different setup (zones vs sections) between the MP6/7 and the MP10/11 impact the user? The MP7 surely has a ton of stuff I would never use but it does have the best piano sample/tone generator of all the portable DP's. The MP10 setup is kind of nice with a section just for piano. I wasn't thrilled about the aesthetics of the DP but after reading the manual, I get it.

I will work on the manual for the MP7 I guess in the meantime.

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Originally Posted by anotherscott
I wonder how this will price vs. the ES7 In the U.S., the ES7 is $1999. Apart from the speakers, the MP7 looks like a nice step up... same action, better piano sound, and a lot more in the way of additional sounds and MIDI functionality. It would seem that the MP7 either has to sell for more than $1999, or the ES7 price should be reduced...?


I wouldn't underestimate the appeal of built-in speakers, especially if they are powerful enough to accommodate solo gigs. Some people would pay a premium for that functionality alone. For me, if the MP7 had internal speakers (with no additional weight penalty wink ), it might be the perfect DP for me.

As it is, I've always felt that the ES7 was a little overpriced here in the States, particularly when measured against the Roland FP-50. The new MP7 may have a (much) better sound engine, but it still has to compete with the PX-5S, the RD-300NX and the CP4/40.

Last edited by voxpops; 03/10/14 12:54 PM.

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Quote
For me, if the MP7 had internal speakers ..., it might be the perfect DP for me.


Me too.

I was comparing numbers of the MP6, MP10, and MP11 (Kraft Music, U.S.):

MP10 to MP11 = $500 cost increase. Add $500 to MP6 price ($1500) and the MP7 could sell for $2000

MP6 to MP10 = $800 cost increase. Subtract $800 from MP11 price ($2800) and the MP7 could sell for $2000.

To me it seems like the ES7 is a different target market for people (like me) who want a simple digital piano with great sound and touch, without a bunch of electronics that we will never use. As such it has speakers. The MP7 is screaming to be hooked up to additional audio equipment - targeted to performers with a more complex rig and some who would say on-board speakers are a waste of space and weight since they always end up using externals anyway.

Of course I would love to see a price drop in the ES7, or an ES8 wink

The ES7 (especially with the stand) would look great in a living room, a church or a wedding, and would work well for small gigs.

(Unfortunately for me) the MP7 is 2 generations ahead in sampling technology, otherwise the ES7 would be a no-brainer. I don't know when the ES7 came out with respect to the UHI technology, but that DP with that technology would have been ideal.

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So I'm absent for a while and then....BOOOM... there's the MP7 (finally) ! Really like it. Nice layout, nice improved design and finally the RH2 in a MP6 successor package with (surprise) non-compromised HI-XL AP's ! Few questions still though; out of curiosity:

1) apart from the HI-XL sampling for the AP's - are any of the "other" sounds that we're available on the MP6 before also improved in sample quality / length ?

2) I noticed there are a few tweaks to the organ patches and presets have been shuffled in order. Completely 'new' however seem to be the synth/pad sounds. Are those indeed a whole new bank of synth patches and are they simply new sample sets, or perhaps even generated waveforms ?

Much has been improved in action, AP sound , handling, routing and effects (and addition of audio-in!); just trying to figure out what other sounds have been enhanced / improved by exchanging sample sets or giving them more memory space.

Overall ; very nice package and with this robust classy design IMHO 21kg is fair. Otherwise it would have been more plastic , which you may - or may not like. I personally don't. With an added 3 pedal unit and other stuff in your back , you'll still have to do some heavy lifting though. Casio remains unbeatable in that respect. But look what you get in return ;-)

JFP #2244464 03/10/14 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by JFP
1) apart from the HI-XL sampling for the AP's - are any of the "other" sounds that we're available on the MP6 before also improved in sample quality / length ?


Yes, the EPs and a number of other sounds are also much improved.

Originally Posted by JFP
2) I noticed there are a few tweaks to the organ patches and presets have been shuffled in order. Completely 'new' however seem to be the synth/pad sounds. Are those indeed a whole new bank of synth patches and are they simply new sample sets, or perhaps even generated waveforms ?


I'm less familiar with the synth side of the MP7, but I'm pretty sure this has been boosted too, partly thanks to the more powerful tone generator and ability to adjust more finegrain ADSR parameters.

Originally Posted by JFP
Much has been improved in action, AP sound , handling, routing and effects (and addition of audio-in!); just trying to figure out what other sounds have been enhanced / improved by exchanging sample sets or giving them more memory space.


It's the latter - much more memory compared to the MP6.

Cheers,
James
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One small but important improvement for synth players seems to be the inclusion of portamento.

Last edited by voxpops; 03/10/14 09:25 PM.

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The video mentioned something about an Organ Mode to make it easy to play organ sounds on a weighted keyboard. Does anyone know what this means? I could be wrong but it looked like maybe it made use of the third sensor (i.e. you don't have to press the key the whole way down?)


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Originally Posted by Musical Dan
The video mentioned something about an Organ Mode to make it easy to play organ sounds on a weighted keyboard. Does anyone know what this means? I could be wrong but it looked like maybe it made use of the third sensor (i.e. you don't have to press the key the whole way down?)


Yes, this relates back to what I mentioned a little further up about synth playing (and conveniently responds to Turnabout's comment at the same time...).

Here's the relevant extract from the owner's manual (page 45):

[Linked Image]

To flesh this explanation out a little more, the RHII action has 3 velocity sensors (s1, s2, s3), and all three are utilised when playing piano sounds in order to accurately measure the speed at which notes are played and released.

However, organs are typically velocity insensitive (i.e. their character/volume does not change depending on the speed at which notes are played). Therefore when selecting the MP7's tonewheel organ mode, the keyboard automatically selects a fixed touch curve. As such, we no longer need to use all three sensors to measure velocity, so can instead freely select which sensor (s1, s2, s3) should be used to trigger the note.

This makes the keyboard action feel very 'fast', and allows authentic organ-style playing on a weighted action that would otherwise be more difficult to achieve.

I hope this helps.

Cheers,
James
x


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ando #2244533 03/11/14 12:30 AM
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Originally Posted by ando
The MP7 covers more bases than the MP11, from what I can see...

That's what I see too, the MP7 will be a bigger cash cow than the MP11.


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MP7 just got posted on the Kawai US site:
http://www.kawaius.com/main_links/digital/MP7/mp7.html

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Originally Posted by anotherscott
Originally Posted by Kawai James
The ES7, CN34, and CN24 all utilise the same RHII action.

I wonder how this will price vs. the ES7 In the U.S., the ES7 is $1999. Apart from the speakers, the MP7 looks like a nice step up... same action, better piano sound, and a lot more in the way of additional sounds and MIDI functionality. It would seem that the MP7 either has to sell for more than $1999, or the ES7 price should be reduced...?

Originally Posted by Kawai James
Originally Posted by IMOL
Unfortunately, the only disappointment is that personally and I think many others expected at least a small improvement on weight.


Yes, that's a fair criticism. However I think it would be tough to deliver a sub-20kg 88-key MP without switching to a plastic construction and using an AC power adaptor. Such actions would be at odds with the 'no compromises' philosophy of the MP instruments.

I would love to see Kawai maintain the MP7 as is as a no-compromise version of what it is, but also offer, say, an MP-7L (Lite) which is the same board with the necessary physical compromises as you describe to get the weight as low as possible. I think total sales of the two combined would be higher as a result, but it would be interesting to see the mix of sales between the two. (Of course, relative price would play a factor there as well.) Though I know that one of the challenges of plastic chassis is that the initial fabrication cost is high, so you have to be pretty confident in being able to project the sales volume to justify it.


This is an excellent idea. The lighter case could be marketed as a "road" or "tour" model. Might work. smile

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And on Kawai Australia too: http://kawai.net.au/digital/MP7
(along with MP11)
If what google says is correct, it is priced similar to US

Last edited by Marcos Daniel; 03/11/14 01:36 AM.

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Originally Posted by anotherscott
...an MP-7L (Lite)...

Since I don't gig, I would be very happy with an MP-11SH (Super Heavy) that has built-in speakers grin

Edit: Tomorrow is Musikmesse, and no one has put up a thread yet?

Last edited by doremi; 03/11/14 01:53 AM.

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ando #2244550 03/11/14 02:45 AM
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Originally Posted by ando
The MP7 covers more bases than the MP11, from what I can see. The only compromise seems to be the GF action - but the RHII action is still quite good. It will be interesting to see how they are priced in Australia. If they can keep it reasonable, I can see myself going for the MP7.


My thoughts as well. The Yamaha CP4 is the other main contender. I wish the MP7 was a light as the CP4. Balanced outs would have been nice as well - considering the "no compromises" philosophy.
Price point will probably be the main deciding factor, as I think both boards should have nice sounding pianos. If I can pick one up retail for under $2k AUD, there would be a good chance this would be my choice, though of course I wouldn't purchase it without trying it first.

Kawai James, any idea how long it will take to arrive in Australia?


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Originally Posted by Musical Dan
Kawai James, any idea how long it will take to arrive in Australia?


According to Kawai Australia's facebook: "Limited stock available in-store from late March!"

Cheers,
James
x


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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Originally Posted by Musical Dan
The video mentioned something about an Organ Mode to make it easy to play organ sounds on a weighted keyboard. Does anyone know what this means? I could be wrong but it looked like maybe it made use of the third sensor (i.e. you don't have to press the key the whole way down?)


Yes, this relates back to what I mentioned a little further up about synth playing (and conveniently responds to Turnabout's comment at the same time...).

Here's the relevant extract from the owner's manual (page 45):

[Linked Image]


To flesh this explanation out a little more, the RHII action has 3 velocity sensors (s1, s2, s3), and all three are utilised when playing piano sounds in order to accurately measure the speed at which notes are played and released.

However, organs are typically velocity insensitive (i.e. their character/volume does not change depending on the speed at which notes are played). Therefore when selecting the MP7's tonewheel organ mode, the keyboard automatically selects a fixed touch curve. As such, we no longer need to use all three sensors to measure velocity, so can instead freely select which sensor (s1, s2, s3) should be used to trigger the note.

This makes the keyboard action feel very 'fast', and allows authentic organ-style playing on a weighted action that would otherwise be very difficult to achieve.

I hope this helps.

Cheers,
James
x


Thanks for the explanation smile

Last edited by Musical Dan; 03/11/14 02:54 AM.

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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Originally Posted by Musical Dan
Kawai James, any idea how long it will take to arrive in Australia?


According to Kawai Australia's facebook: "Limited stock available in-store from late March!"

Cheers,
James
x


Sounds perfect.... My Birthday is late March!!! I hope I can convince my wife!


Kawai MP7
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