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Bach's inventions: Complete #2240948
03/03/14 09:54 PM
03/03/14 09:54 PM
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 75
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BOREGARD Offline OP
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Can anyone recommend a complete edition (name, publisher, perhaps ISBN) containing all of Bach's inventions? Or is there more than one book? Looking for a text(s) that allows easy page turning without bending/braking the text's spine, perhaps spiral-bound.

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Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2240974
03/03/14 10:57 PM
03/03/14 10:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 7,639
Olympia, Washington, USA
John v.d.Brook Offline
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I teach using the Henle Edition.


"Those who dare to teach must never cease to learn." -- Richard Henry Dann
Full-time Private Piano Teacher offering Piano Lessons in Olympia, WA. www.mypianoteacher.com
Certified by the American College of Musicians; member NGPT, MTNA, WSMTA, OMTA
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241008
03/04/14 12:49 AM
03/04/14 12:49 AM
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Posts: 9,328
New York City
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Polyphonist Offline
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+1 to the Henle.


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241234
03/04/14 12:54 PM
03/04/14 12:54 PM
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Posts: 17,026
Boynton Beach, FL
Morodiene Offline
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While I love Henle, I own the Alfred edition of this which is spiral bound. What is nice about it is that in light grey it offers suggestions on ornaments or it writes out notated ornaments, which is great for someone who may not be accustomed to Baroque ornamentation. It does make for a "messier" looking score, so perhaps better for reference as a companion to the Henle? Though not spiral-bound, Henle's binding is very durable and I've never had issues with cracking and splitting.


private piano/voice teacher FT

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Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241243
03/04/14 01:08 PM
03/04/14 01:08 PM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 965
Miguel Rey Offline
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Miguel Rey  Offline
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thumb Henle

For accuracy, quality, easy read & perfectly lays flat. They do have some ornament explanation in the comment section and preface.




Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241274
03/04/14 02:17 PM
03/04/14 02:17 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,230
Orange County, CA
AZNpiano Offline
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My old Henle edition of the Inventions/Sinfonias is holding up pretty well except for the cover page. You can't beat its clarity of print and paper quality. Kind of expensive, though.

However, for my students, I actually recommend the Alfred edition. It has more practical hints, editorial suggestions for articulations, historical insights, performance suggestions, and written-out realizations of ornaments that Henle lacks.

Both editions offer fingerings, but I usually end up changing most of them, anyway.


Private Piano Teacher and MTAC Member
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: AZNpiano] #2241485
03/04/14 09:47 PM
03/04/14 09:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9,328
New York City
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Polyphonist Offline
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Whatever you do, do not get the Alfred edition.


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241486
03/04/14 09:51 PM
03/04/14 09:51 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 848
New York City
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Hrodulf Offline
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Joined: Feb 2009
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I got the dover edition which reprints the Bach-Gesellschaft Ausgabe. It also included the sinfonias, partitas, english suites, french suites, and goldberg variations.

I can't compare it to the Henle since I don't have the Henle of that but it wasn't spiral bound. It was affordable however.


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Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241489
03/04/14 09:54 PM
03/04/14 09:54 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 848
New York City
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Hrodulf Offline
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Here it is.

http://www.amazon.com/Keyboard-Music-Dover-Piano/dp/0486223604

There's a few spiral bound editions on amazon but they're edited by Busoni and Czerny, so if you're ok with a lot of expression marks, that might be an option for you. The Gesselschaft edition provides a cleaner score.

Last edited by Hrodulf; 03/04/14 09:57 PM.

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Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: Polyphonist] #2241498
03/04/14 10:06 PM
03/04/14 10:06 PM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,254
Down Under
currawong Offline
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Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Whatever you do, do not get the Alfred edition.
I'm not sure that's terribly helpful, unless you say why not. Especially as two other posters have said they use it - and explained their reasons.


Du holde Kunst...
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241499
03/04/14 10:07 PM
03/04/14 10:07 PM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9,328
New York City
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Polyphonist Offline
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My reasons are exactly the same as theirs.


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241504
03/04/14 10:18 PM
03/04/14 10:18 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 848
New York City
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Hrodulf Offline
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Joined: Feb 2009
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New York City
Or you can print it off IMSLP and have it spiralbound at kinkos.


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Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: Polyphonist] #2241537
03/04/14 11:07 PM
03/04/14 11:07 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,230
Orange County, CA
AZNpiano Offline
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Orange County, CA
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
My reasons are exactly the same as theirs.

What's wrong with suggested realizations of ornaments?

Or historical insights and notes on performance practices?



Private Piano Teacher and MTAC Member
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241559
03/04/14 11:52 PM
03/04/14 11:52 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 848
New York City
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Hrodulf Offline
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Joined: Feb 2009
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New York City
Bach wrote out ornaments sometimes. I don't know why. See prelude 10 book one well tempered clavier.


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Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: AZNpiano] #2241613
03/05/14 01:54 AM
03/05/14 01:54 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9,328
New York City
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Polyphonist Offline
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Originally Posted by AZNpiano
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
My reasons are exactly the same as theirs.

What's wrong with suggested realizations of ornaments?

It's a substitute for doing your homework and figuring out the music yourself. Sometimes there is a reason why Bach didn't write out his ornaments, and it's not that he was lazy.

If students don't think Bach is worth their time, then they had better give all the music books away and take up a different hobby...


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: Polyphonist] #2241641
03/05/14 01:40 PM
03/05/14 01:40 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,230
Orange County, CA
AZNpiano Offline
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AZNpiano  Offline
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Posts: 8,230
Orange County, CA
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Originally Posted by AZNpiano
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
My reasons are exactly the same as theirs.

What's wrong with suggested realizations of ornaments?

It's a substitute for doing your homework and figuring out the music yourself. Sometimes there is a reason why Bach didn't write out his ornaments, and it's not that he was lazy.

If students don't think Bach is worth their time, then they had better give all the music books away and take up a different hobby...

I see the suggested ornamentation as a starting point of discussion and teaching, rather than the definitive THIS IS THE ONLY WAY TO DO IT answer to how to treat the ornaments.


Private Piano Teacher and MTAC Member
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241648
03/05/14 01:58 PM
03/05/14 01:58 PM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 292
Utah
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PianistOne111 Offline
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Utah
FYI he Alfred editions write out the ornaments in gray away from the main system, kind of like an ossia. I use them a lot and when I don't like the Alfred ornaments I just change it; no big deal.


One111
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: AZNpiano] #2241785
03/05/14 05:39 PM
03/05/14 05:39 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 6,521
South Florida
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Gary D. Offline
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Gary D.  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 6,521
South Florida
Originally Posted by AZNpiano
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Originally Posted by AZNpiano
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
My reasons are exactly the same as theirs.

What's wrong with suggested realizations of ornaments?

It's a substitute for doing your homework and figuring out the music yourself. Sometimes there is a reason why Bach didn't write out his ornaments, and it's not that he was lazy.

If students don't think Bach is worth their time, then they had better give all the music books away and take up a different hobby...

I see the suggested ornamentation as a starting point of discussion and teaching, rather than the definitive THIS IS THE ONLY WAY TO DO IT answer to how to treat the ornaments.

So do I.

I'm in favor of having two very different editions for serious students, one that is quite "prescriptive" (making a lot of suggestions).

But isn't the real point here how WE, as teachers, USE these editions? We should also be pointing out why of the "answers" given are not the ONLY answers, and why other "answers" might be better.


Piano Teacher
Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: Gary D.] #2241809
03/05/14 06:23 PM
03/05/14 06:23 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 848
New York City
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Hrodulf Offline
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Hrodulf  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 848
New York City
Originally Posted by Gary D.
Originally Posted by AZNpiano
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Originally Posted by AZNpiano
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
My reasons are exactly the same as theirs.

What's wrong with suggested realizations of ornaments?

It's a substitute for doing your homework and figuring out the music yourself. Sometimes there is a reason why Bach didn't write out his ornaments, and it's not that he was lazy.

If students don't think Bach is worth their time, then they had better give all the music books away and take up a different hobby...

I see the suggested ornamentation as a starting point of discussion and teaching, rather than the definitive THIS IS THE ONLY WAY TO DO IT answer to how to treat the ornaments.

So do I.

I'm in favor of having two very different editions for serious students, one that is quite "prescriptive" (making a lot of suggestions).

But isn't the real point here how WE, as teachers, USE these editions? We should also be pointing out why of the "answers" given are not the ONLY answers, and why other "answers" might be better.


I can say that I use some of the Henle fingerings but I change a few so even Henle's suggestions are not the last word.


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Re: Bach's inventions: Complete [Re: BOREGARD] #2241984
03/06/14 02:01 AM
03/06/14 02:01 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9,328
New York City
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Polyphonist Offline
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Joined: Mar 2013
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If an unfingered Henle edition exists, I purchase that one; for example, in the case of Bach's Well-Tempered Clavier, there are two versions available, one with fingering and one without. If no such unfingered edition exists, I purchase whatever is available, but take no fingering for granted, except that of the composer - most composers write in fingering very infrequently, therefore when they do there is probably a good reason for it.


Regards,

Polyphonist
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