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Hello.
I appreciate all of your input very much.

Earlier, I posted here asking very broad question which I understand some
consider not worth answering...now after reading past similar questions, I can
see and am sorry I didn't do my homework beforehand... And to those who
took the time and wrote in, I really appreciate your input. Thank you~!

Now, I actually narrowed down my choices...I think...
It came down to Kawai MP10.(or MP11)
Unfortunately, not many places carry that model in the stores.
I went to try the digital console style ones which has similar key action
and I loved it!!

Just out of curiosity, I tried CP209...I couldn't believe it was a digital
piano!!! I was blown away with that RM3 wooden action and so I can't
remember if I tried/liked the Grand Feel key action on other models...
Does CP209 have same key action as MP10? (can't tell if RM3 Wooden-Key,
Graded-Hammer Action w/ Let-Off is the same as RM3 Grand Wooden-Key
action with Let-off??)

I am little confused...I know that Grand Feel key action is the newest latest
technology and so in theory, its the closest thing to a real thing??

Since I am in the hobby pianist range, I am not sure which feel I should go for
if I want to eventually move back to acoustic maybe 10yrs or so down the
road...
At the same time, since I will more than likely stay in the hobby pianist field,
should I just get the MP10 instead of MP11...?

Is MP11 sooo much better than MP10??

Any input is appreciated...
Thank you in advance!

I have not played an MP10 or an MP11 (yet - I will play the latter today!!!), but the GF action is the latest and greatest from Kawai, and form my understanding the best out there now. I have played the RM3 II action with graded hammer and let-off and found that to be awesome compared with acoustic grand pianos. The CP209 appears to have RM3 and not RM3 II, not sure what the difference would be there. Also the CP209 may lack triple sensors, which will affect things where fast repetition of notes is required. I'm not sure on the distinctions, but I know Kawai James would be able to clarify this more.

I think the big draw for the CP209 is the look of a grand piano. If you don't necessarily need the grand piano cabinet, then going with something like the CA65/95 would probably be better for you (and be a bit nicer to your wallet as well). That has the GF action which is the best Kawai has to offer. I think the 95 has better speakers than the 65.

Now if you're looking for something in a slab style, or you don't care much about having a furniture-like cabinet, the MP11 is the way to go. That also has the GF action.

If you can compare the feel of the CA65/95 to the CP209 you should notice a difference. In the end, it comes down to what you like the most.

Speaking from a bit of experience, (!) I`ve found that it doesn`t matter too much which keyboard you use to play pretty much whatever. Yamaha GHS is generally regarded as naff, and I`d concur with that. But it gets the job done for me, so really, I don`t think you`d have any problem with many of Kawai`s offerings keyboard wise. . . .I`d go for the sound every time. Stop worrying and wondering. Get playing!

MP11. The third sensor in particular does matter. The longer keys may be more a matter of preference although the GF clearly has an advantage also in that respect.

I wouldn't be surprised if the sound generator in the MP11 is audibly better than that in the MP10. But I can't know since I've not yet played an MP11.

Watched YouTube video for mp11.
Looks/sounds awesome.
GF is very very good.
Good system to play through, I would call a must.
From what I know, and saw on the video, the mp11 is a screaming no brainer, slam dunk buy.

I was unimpressed by the tone of the MP10, Its action I found sluggish and rubbery. The GF action is better - faster and more poised. I imagine the tone of MP11 will be at least slightly improved. I definitely think you should get the MP11. The price difference is negligable.

I would spend the extra money for the MP11.

You don't mention any price difference between the two and if that is the case, I don't see a reason to opt for MP10. For me personally, the price difference would have to be extremely huge.

GF is the latest, but there are lots of different flavors of actions (both real and digital) so it's not clear that everyone will say it's the greatest or most similar to an acoustic. The key length is longer, which shoud be a win, but if you change one thing in an action, you change everything so it is possible that there are other aspects of GF that you like less than RM3.

There were several people who tried GF when it first came out and said they liked RM3 more. They are a minority, but you may be in that group.

The CP209 you tried has a lot of other features that may distract you from the actual action. I find it hard to compare actions if I'm not going straight from one to the other and if there is a big difference in the soundsThe same thing may have happened to you.

pnbgnr8, as others have noted, the CP209 utilises the original 'RM3 Grand' keyboard action. This keyboard action was also used used in the CA93/CA63 console models and MP10 stage piano.

The 'Grand Feel' ('GF') keyboard action is similar to 'RM3 Grand', however it features triple sensor key detection, longer keys, a longer key pivot, and counter weights in almost every key. This action is currently available in Kawai's latest CA95/CA65 and CS10/CS7 console models, and the new MP11 stage piano.

Given the choice between the MP10 and MP11, I would almost certainly opt for the latest model...however I'm obviously somewhat biased.

I hope this helps.

Kind regards,
James
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So James, is the GF better (more acoustic like) than the VPC1s RM3II? Not sure I'm following this correctly lol

How many times do you need this spelled out for you? Get the MP11...

M.P. Eleven

Thank you everyone for chiming in~!

I think...I might try to go for the MP11...I have to check with my hubby as far as funding is
concerned...(might help convince him by showing this thread)

I will probably try to go back to the store one more time to make sure which action I really like.
(I think they had console ones at the store but didn't check if those were the latest models...might
have been the older model...looked pretty worn out...)

As far as the differences in key actions...thank you for clarifying. Just by looking at Kawai's site,
it was little bit confusing for me to figure out...

I really appreciate your input! I hope I can get my hands on it pretty soon!
Thanks~!

Yes. The GF action has longer keys and a longer pivot point than the RM3II action so is - in theory - more acoustic-like.

Kind regards,
James
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For what its worth, I looked at it this way for me. Let say I have the new MP11 10 years and its $300 more than the MP10. Will the $30 / year break me? Lets say I have it 5 years and it jumps to $60 /year difference in cost. Same answer, so I bought the MP11. Should be here by next week.

OP: everyone wants you to get the MP11 because they(we)'re excitable schoolboys (and girl) who like reading about people getting the latest gear. Like Christmas by proxy. If you have infinite money and nothing much else to spend it on, then you might as well go for the latest and greatest. But if you were blown away by an older model like the CP209, doesn't that tell you that you will be just as happy with an older model? ("Old" is relative, and doesn't mean bad. Digital piano technology advances at a snail's pace, so 2 or 3 years is nothing. Some here swear that DPs have been in a downward spiral since the CLP 990 in 2001.)

Really, the difference between the MP10 and MP11 is not that great, and unless you've been using a comparably high-level model already, or have a peer group of digital piano buffs to whom you need to show off, you're not going to notice the difference. Save your money and get a good deal on the MP10.

(Incidentally, I'm not sure how you did your narrowing down, but you do realise that the MP10/11 is a professional stage piano? If you're neither a professional nor going to be using it for gigging, there's a good chance there would be better choices for you.)

James: I checked out the band in your You Tube link. Was that you on keys, on a Nord? Pretty nice playing. :-)

I would love to have either one and can afford either. Approximately 70 lbs., however, is too heavy for me (plus case = 80-100 lbs.?). With my investment in such a nice keyboard, I would want to be able to take it with me for casual gigging with musician friends. Pulling 90+ lbs. in and out of my car is a bit much. This is the only reason I would consider something like the Yamaha CP-4 (38 pounds) or even the CP-40 (36 pounds) over the MP11. Even the MP7 will probably weigh 45-50 pounds. I would rather have the MP7 over either Yamaha, but again, every pound counts.

Yeah! <-- That part always makes me smile.



Thank you! I'm not much of a player, but I have fun and that's the main thing.

Cheers,
James
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