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I was just wondering what people think about the difference in quality, touch, price etc?
This is a recent video of me on the Bosendorfer which I found beautiful to the touch. The bass was incredible (skip to around 2:00-2:10 when I first properly touch the bass notes)
The most obvious characteristics of a Bosendorfer imperial are the loud volume, the long sustain, and the extra bass notes. It is such a fun piano to play, you can feel the sound in your chest. The first few notes you play feel electric. The bass is solid. That said, the delicious volume comes at the cost of subtlety at the softer side of the dynamic range. It can be a frustrating instrument to try to play softly.
The Steinway D is also an excellent instrument with a strong bass, which you will miss in the shorter model (though no piano matches the bass of the Bosie). The strength of Steinway is the scale design, which lets you bring out 'color.' You might notice how clearly the melody shines when you play. It has the sound of a powerful and intimidating virtuoso, like Liszt or Rachmaninoff. Horowitz really showcases the beautiful elements of the piano in this recording:
having a piano with great bass, or as some techs would say "balls" is very good, but in a sense a very superficial trait that should not dictate all by itself a choice between piano over another.
in a musical context, a piano with amazing bass but lacking tone in the 4,5,6 octave will not sound as good as a piano that sings but lacks bass power.
If comparing to a steinway D, I never heard one that had a bass that doesn't do the job. Actually, any 9 foot piano will have more than sufficient bass. Some better than others, and yes, perhaps the Bosendorfer excels.
The point is, music is not written for the bass. A piano is not a bass guitar. Check out other pianos and pay closer attention to the octaves of the piano where most music is being played.
A steinway B or any 6-7 foot piano is possibly the perfect size for a home. But that depends if you are buying for a home or a hall...
I agree with Noam. As a left-hander, I have had to rein in my left hand on nine-footers all my life. I personally would not be impressed by marketing that boasted of a piano as having more bass than a Steinway D.
More important is that Bösendorfers and Steinways just don't sound the same. Play them both and see which one you prefer.
Well, the Bösendorfer Imperial literally has more bass than most other models of pianos.
There are a number of factors that go into the sound of the lowest notes on pianos. Length is just one of them. I have heard longer grands with what I consider to be poorer bass notes than some shorter grands. But as Damon Runyon put it, the race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, but that's how the smart money bets!
You're focusing on volume of the bass, but don't ignore the most important part. Clarity of tone is very difficult to get, but Bosendorfer does it well. On some pianos, the overtones of the bass notes (not always an octave above the note you want) sound louder than the actual fundamental. The bass of every piano is a series of compromises, and you have to choose which ones you want to make.
So these are the things to take into consideration when looking at a bass piano.
For someone who has tried as many different 9' grands as I have during my many visits to trade fairs, factories etc, it would be impossible to single out one maker.
One would have to be slightly narcissistic or at least have a bit of a 'brand fetish' to argue otherwise...
One of the finest 9' in memory were neither Steinway or Bosie.
First, both the D and the Imperial are fantastic, but different, pianos.
I am happy that the discussion has led away from the bass on the Imperial. Yes, the bass is there if it is needed, but the strength of the Imperial, IMHO, is the clarity and control throughout the entire register, particularly if the instrument is well prepped.
I have to disagree with the comment that the Imperial lacks the ability to play softly. That is not my experience at all. Again, this only holds true if the piano is well prepped.
My experience with dissimilar concert grands is that there is a place that has a pair which live in different rooms. They are both maintained similarly, and have about equal wear on the hammers. Both have had concerts since I have been maintaining them. In both rooms, I have heard the same complaint: People saw the recording mikes, assumed they were for amplification, and said the sound was turned up too loud.
There was a two-piano concert once, and one piano was moved on stage with the other. As I tuned them, the differences were really apparent, but those differences disappeared when the pianists performed.
So my conclusion, as I have often stated, is that the most important difference in pianos of similar quality is the quality of the maintenance. The rest is a matter of personal preference, and it rarely gets past the pianist to the audience. For that reason, brand name may be important when you are buying a piano, but most people are not buying concert grands, just listening.
BDB Couldn't agree more. Maintenance and personal preference.
Re Norbert's comment "One would have to be slightly narcissistic or at least have a bit of a 'brand fetish' to argue otherwise... wink " (in singling out one brand) Sorry Norbert but I cannot agree. All you need is a strong preference for a certain sound.
I have to disagree with the comment that the Imperial lacks the ability to play softly
It's very possible that I attempt to play more softly than you (not a criticism, just trying to understand why our perceptions are different here). I do tend to play weakly sometimes.
I have to disagree with the comment that the Imperial lacks the ability to play softly
It's very possible that I attempt to play more softly than you (not a criticism, just trying to understand why our perceptions are different here). I do tend to play weakly sometimes.
It could also be that Rich has played Bosie Imperials whose actions were better regulated. In fact I would be surprised if that was not the case.
I have to disagree with the comment that the Imperial lacks the ability to play softly
It's very possible that I attempt to play more softly than you (not a criticism, just trying to understand why our perceptions are different here). I do tend to play weakly sometimes.
It could also be that Rich has played Bosie Imperials whose actions were better regulated. In fact I would be surprised if that was not the case.
The tech who regulated mine claimed to be one of the best techs around. Surely that was true!
It was interesting to hear that no current Bosendorfer Imperial (or possibly my 1905 Ibach!) can be regulated to play anything like as softly as any Steinway D.
