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This is why X-stands should be avoided #2226077
02/04/14 11:40 PM
02/04/14 11:40 PM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,510
Hamamatsu, Japan
Kawai James Offline OP
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Kawai James  Offline OP
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Hamamatsu, Japan
Good afternoon folks,

As many of you are aware, I am not terribly keen on using an X-stand to support DPs or any kind of keyboard instrument. Not only does the X shape restrict leg room and access to pedals, but the stands themselves are often very unstable - potentially even dangerous!

I saw a great video in a post on The Keyboard Corner and just had to share it here:



I have to say, the player did a fantastic job!

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
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Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226081
02/05/14 12:00 AM
02/05/14 12:00 AM
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 48
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Vansh Offline
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Wow...pretty good reflexes!

Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226084
02/05/14 12:14 AM
02/05/14 12:14 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 26,904
Oakland
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BDB Offline
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Nice catch!


Semipro Tech
Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226105
02/05/14 01:37 AM
02/05/14 01:37 AM
Joined: Feb 2014
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Lockheart Offline
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And barely even broke rhythm!

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Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226128
02/05/14 03:10 AM
02/05/14 03:10 AM
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 579
Spanish living in UK
evamar Offline
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evamar  Offline
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Spanish living in UK
Wow, that IS a professional player with great reflexes.


Serious since Dec 2013. March 2014, Kawai CA95!

Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted

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Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226137
02/05/14 03:31 AM
02/05/14 03:31 AM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,368
Sweden
TheodorN Offline
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TheodorN  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,368
Sweden
He he, great save! James, you've got a point being against X-stands. Even if they maybe seldom collapse from under your hands, those things just won't stand still. When I tried playing a piano on an X-stand, it just made me dizzy looking at the keybed to see where to put my fingers.

Last edited by TheodorN; 02/05/14 08:59 AM.

My YouTube channel

Casio PX-5S. Garritan CFX. Prod. Voices: Grand 2 Gold, Concert Grand Compact, Est. Grand, Studio Grand LE. NI Giant. Galaxy II Blüthner Baby Grand. AcousticSamples C7. AK Studio Grand. Sampletekk Black. Kontakt 5. Reaper.
Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226184
02/05/14 07:46 AM
02/05/14 07:46 AM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,409
Vught, The Netherlands
Dave Horne Online content
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Dave Horne  Online Content
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Vught, The Netherlands
I had a very close call with an X stand back when I was in the military. We were setting up on stage and the stand broke, well, actually a bolt either broke or it came out, and my hand was in the perfect place to be severely cut or worse.

My hand was in the scissor part of the collapsing stand with the weight of the piano as well. Fortunately nothing serious happened.

Friends don't let friends use or buy X stands.

I learned my lesson.


website | mp3 files | Yamaha AvantGrand N3 | Roland RD 2000 | Sennheiser HD 598 headphones
Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226197
02/05/14 08:22 AM
02/05/14 08:22 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 16,524
Boynton Beach, FL
Morodiene Offline
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Boynton Beach, FL
Gotta love the thrill of a live performance! Just about anything could go wrong. But dont add to the possibilities by getting an X stand.


private piano/voice teacher FT

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Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226198
02/05/14 08:24 AM
02/05/14 08:24 AM
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,675
Portugal
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toddy Online content
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,675
Portugal
They're ok so long as you remember to do the wing nut up. Mine's still doing sterling service holding up my synth - and has been since 1982. And I remember buying the cheapest possible one at the time (I'd overspent on the Korg PolySix itself). Must be one of the few things of that vintage that hasn't broken. Possibly the only thing, now I come to think about it - apart from my mum's wicker basket and my dad's army trunk. They're family heirlooms.

edit: that guy's one heck of a player - a veritable keyboard hero smile

edit 2: the real problem with X stands is that they look so silly - like being on stage with an ironing board. But those kinds of things didn't matter when you were young, did they?

Last edited by toddy; 02/05/14 08:34 AM.

Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

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Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226211
02/05/14 08:53 AM
02/05/14 08:53 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,085
uk south
D
dire tonic Offline
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Joined: Jul 2011
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uk south
Oh come off it, that collapse is obviously part of the act!

See my X-stand mod which effectively transfers most of the weight to the slightly oversized (i.e. forced in) vertical struts of wood.

No more yaw!

Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226217
02/05/14 09:04 AM
02/05/14 09:04 AM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,368
Sweden
TheodorN Offline
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Posts: 2,368
Sweden
This is more than an X-stand, more like a UX-stand (a U with an X inside), with the extra legs at the ends. It also means it's more stable, the piano is not shaking all the time.

Last edited by TheodorN; 02/05/14 09:04 AM.

My YouTube channel

Casio PX-5S. Garritan CFX. Prod. Voices: Grand 2 Gold, Concert Grand Compact, Est. Grand, Studio Grand LE. NI Giant. Galaxy II Blüthner Baby Grand. AcousticSamples C7. AK Studio Grand. Sampletekk Black. Kontakt 5. Reaper.
Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226239
02/05/14 10:01 AM
02/05/14 10:01 AM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 4,805
San Jose, CA
Jeff Clef Offline
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San Jose, CA
I was a rabid X-stand hater... but, out of some sense of serendipity, I picked up a new one at Guitar Center: a ProLine double-X three-tier stand, having found the make to provide a few other pieces which were sturdy and serviceable (a conductor's music rack, guitar stand, etc). I guess I have to eat my former words; it is quite stable, the racks are at the right height, and the pedals can be located further forward (toward the player), so that the stand legs don't get in the way of the feet. The back side has enough places for cable runs--- too often overlooked--- and it was cheap, about $130. And I broke my previous table-style stand, trying to get the keyboard at the right height.

I can only suppose these devices have come a long way since the bad old days. True, it is only customizable to a point, and I can see myself doing better one of these days. But, what it does, it does well. I don't know that I can say as much for myself these days.


Clef

Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226243
02/05/14 10:02 AM
02/05/14 10:02 AM
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 234
Psychonaut Offline
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Psychonaut  Offline
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Nice recovery! My double-decker Z-stand is as solid as the Rock of Gibraltar:


[Linked Image]


Yamaha P120, MO6, Steinberg MR816, Galaxy Vintage D, Komplete 8 & various other VIs, Reaper
Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226245
02/05/14 10:07 AM
02/05/14 10:07 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 623
D
Dwscamel Offline
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That's the best save I've ever seen.


Beethoven - Op.49 No.1 (sonata 19)
Czerny - Op.299 Nos. 5,7 (School of Velocity)
Liszt - S.172 No.2 (Consolation No.2)

Dream piece:
Rachmaninoff - Sonata 2, movement 2 in E minor
Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Psychonaut] #2226248
02/05/14 10:12 AM
02/05/14 10:12 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,085
uk south
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dire tonic Offline
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uk south
Psychonaut, is that stand the same brand as this one? 'On-stage' is the badge name.

This seemed like a decent price in the uk, I might buy it at a later date.

Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: dire tonic] #2226295
02/05/14 11:45 AM
02/05/14 11:45 AM
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 234
Psychonaut Offline
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Psychonaut  Offline
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Posts: 234
Originally Posted by dire tonic
Psychonaut, is that stand the same brand as this one? 'On-stage' is the badge name.

This seemed like a decent price in the uk, I might buy it at a later date.


Yeah, it's an On-Stage Z stand. The one you linked to seems similar to mine, though mine is two-tier. I don't remember the exact model # I bought, and can't see it when I look at it, but I believe it's this one:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...pe=&gclid=CPaRwKe2tbwCFchhfgod_wYAGA

It's really solid. They make good stuff.


Yamaha P120, MO6, Steinberg MR816, Galaxy Vintage D, Komplete 8 & various other VIs, Reaper
Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226303
02/05/14 12:03 PM
02/05/14 12:03 PM
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,429
Boston, Massachusetts
M
Marko in Boston Online blank
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Marko in Boston  Online Blank
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Posts: 1,429
Boston, Massachusetts


This is a very cool stand. (Bonus if you can name the model # of the Roland DP)




KAWAI ES7 | ROLAND RD-800 | YAMAHA CP4 | YAMAHA STAGEPAS 400i | PRESONUS R65 & T10 | SHURE SRH1540 | SENNHEISER HD650 | K&M OMEGA
Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Kawai James] #2226449
02/05/14 05:05 PM
02/05/14 05:05 PM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,409
Vught, The Netherlands
Dave Horne Online content
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Dave Horne  Online Content
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,409
Vught, The Netherlands
There's a very expensive keyboard stand that uses an electric motor to raise and lower the keyboard in question to the exact height. I'm sure this is used in professional locations where the keyboard sees many users.

I've looked online and I can't find it.

Does anyone here remember ever seeing this online or at NAMM?


website | mp3 files | Yamaha AvantGrand N3 | Roland RD 2000 | Sennheiser HD 598 headphones
Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Dave Horne] #2226462
02/05/14 05:22 PM
02/05/14 05:22 PM
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 736
Scott Hamlin Offline
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Scott Hamlin  Offline
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Originally Posted by Dave Horne
There's a very expensive keyboard stand that uses an electric motor to raise and lower the keyboard in question to the exact height. I'm sure this is used in professional locations where the keyboard sees many users.

I've looked online and I can't find it.

Does anyone here remember ever seeing this online or at NAMM?


SolidStand?
http://solidstand.com/
[Linked Image]


Re: This is why X-stands should be avoided [Re: Psychonaut] #2226469
02/05/14 05:31 PM
02/05/14 05:31 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,085
uk south
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dire tonic Offline
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dire tonic  Offline
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D

Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,085
uk south
Originally Posted by Psychonaut
Originally Posted by dire tonic
Psychonaut, is that stand the same brand as this one? 'On-stage' is the badge name.

This seemed like a decent price in the uk, I might buy it at a later date.


Yeah, it's an On-Stage Z stand. The one you linked to seems similar to mine, though mine is two-tier. I don't remember the exact model # I bought, and can't see it when I look at it, but I believe it's this one:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...pe=&gclid=CPaRwKe2tbwCFchhfgod_wYAGA

It's really solid. They make good stuff.


- do you happen to know what the minimum height of the lower support is? Also, is the adjustment in fixed slots or continuous?

cheers!

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