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#2222850 - 01/29/14 11:32 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: TwoSnowflakes]  
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Originally Posted by TwoSnowflakes

If she were not otherwise so tactile, though, I would definitely find random hitting or touching to be unwelcome.

Yes, I think the fact that it was a complete, unexpected surprise (and in front of a lot of other people) was the main problem.


Poetry is rhythm
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#2222852 - 01/29/14 11:39 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Goals:
I want to set new goals for myself this time around.

1) Develop a more subtle interpretation. Last time my primary interpretive goal was to play as loudly as possible, and I broke a piano string. I'm a little more mature now.

2) Play it perfectly. Somehow I am very bad at perfecting pieces; it is something I would like to improve. Hopefully I will be able to achieve it with this piece.

3) Create a decent recording. All my recordings to this point have been obviously amateur and poor.


Poetry is rhythm
#2223293 - 01/30/14 08:18 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: phantomFive]  
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Originally Posted by phantomFive
Goals:
I want to set new goals for myself this time around.

1) Develop a more subtle interpretation. Last time my primary interpretive goal was to play as loudly as possible, and I broke a piano string. I'm a little more mature now.

2) Play it perfectly. Somehow I am very bad at perfecting pieces; it is something I would like to improve. Hopefully I will be able to achieve it with this piece.

3) Create a decent recording. All my recordings to this point have been obviously amateur and poor.


Originally Posted by phantomFive


2) Play it perfectly. Somehow I am very bad at perfecting pieces; it is something I would like to improve. Hopefully I will be able to achieve it with this piece.



Very great goals! I must say, however, that there is never "perfect" in music. wink If this perfection was possible, I probably wouldn't be playing piano today. smile Also, what is your definition of a good recording compared to a poor one? Everyone can answer this differently.

My progress: I must submit a recording of my audition by Friday, and I think I'm satisfied with my performance level of the piece. It's definitely nowhere near "virtuosic" or what have you, but it demonstrates to the university my current skill level which is ultimately what they want. After all, I'm going to major in music to learn and satisfy myself and my listeners with my music, not to beat anybody. smile I'll definitely post a video link this weekend!


Music Major/Premed (Sophomore)

1990 Yamaha G3

Currently studying:

Rachmaninoff - Moment Musical No. 4
Saint-Saens - Piano Concerto No. 2
Bach - French Suite No. 5
Chopin - Waltz in E minor (for fun!)
#2223296 - 01/30/14 08:20 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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TwoSnowflakes Offline
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Yes please do!

I'm about to meet my maker with my teacher in half an hour. Let's see how the prelude shaped up this week.

I posted this on another thread, but it also goes quite well here. But here's how I feel when I play the prelude these days:


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#2223328 - 01/30/14 09:42 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: TwoSnowflakes]  
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Originally Posted by TwoSnowflakes
Yes please do!

I'm about to meet my maker with my teacher in half an hour. Let's see how the prelude shaped up this week.

I posted this on another thread, but it also goes quite well here. But here's how I feel when I play the prelude these days:



Hahaha, hilarious! smile Do you have a video of you playing the prelude? I believe Griffen said you did earlier in this thread? Unless that was directed to phantom.


Music Major/Premed (Sophomore)

1990 Yamaha G3

Currently studying:

Rachmaninoff - Moment Musical No. 4
Saint-Saens - Piano Concerto No. 2
Bach - French Suite No. 5
Chopin - Waltz in E minor (for fun!)
#2223331 - 01/30/14 09:46 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: TwoSnowflakes]  
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Originally Posted by TwoSnowflakes
Yes please do!

I'm about to meet my maker with my teacher in half an hour. Let's see how the prelude shaped up this week.

I posted this on another thread, but it also goes quite well here. But here's how I feel when I play the prelude these days:


laugh ha does he play the piano strings like a harp next?
How did it go today?


Heather W. Reichgott, piano http://heatherwreichgott.blogspot.com

Working on:
Beethoven, Diabelli Variations
Corigliano, Gazebo Dances
Beethoven, Trio in E flat Op. 70 no. 2
Queen/Buc, Bohemian Rhapsody for piano trio

I love Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven and new music
#2223375 - 01/30/14 11:51 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Originally Posted by RyanThePianist

Very great goals! I must say, however, that there is never "perfect" in music. wink If this perfection was possible, I probably wouldn't be playing piano today. smile Also, what is your definition of a good recording compared to a poor one? Everyone can answer this differently.


Good points. I'll say then, a performance where I hit every note correctly. smile

And clarify that for a good recording, the audio equipment doesn't get in the way of what I am trying to convey musically.


Poetry is rhythm
#2223380 - 01/31/14 12:00 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: phantomFive]  
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Originally Posted by phantomFive

Good points. I'll say then, a performance where I hit every note correctly. smile

And clarify that for a good recording, the audio equipment doesn't get in the way of what I am trying to convey musically.


Good goal to strive for. I'm currently doing this by mastering slow practice note perfect first, and then increasing my speed slowly. If I make a mistake, I repeat and make up my own practice exercise to drill that part into my mind until I get it.

I see. Recording quality is a great problem among pianists... my audition for university will be from my phone actually, which surprisingly has better quality than my laptop. XD


Music Major/Premed (Sophomore)

1990 Yamaha G3

Currently studying:

Rachmaninoff - Moment Musical No. 4
Saint-Saens - Piano Concerto No. 2
Bach - French Suite No. 5
Chopin - Waltz in E minor (for fun!)
#2223394 - 01/31/14 12:32 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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LOL we never got to the prelude. We're putting finishing touches on the Haydn's first two movements, and after we combed over the first movement and played through the second movement (for recital this weekend), we were totally out of time.

I did record the first section of the prelude a while back. It's a slower tempo than I play it now. I will try to get me playing the whole thing, though the third section is still not up to tempo.

#2223618 - 01/31/14 01:20 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Originally Posted by RyanThePianist

Recording quality is a great problem among pianists... my audition for university will be from my phone actually, which surprisingly has better quality than my laptop. XD

Even with a phone, you can still experiment with microphone placement and getting good variation in dynamic levels. Maybe find a 'recording studio' app that allows you to adjust compression levels.

Also, you can get a USB microphone for $30 on Amazon that will give you better results if your phone compresses your dynamics too much (the 'semper forte' effect). If you are auditioning for a university, it's good to have the dynamic range come out, because that's something they will likely listen for. Think about it, you're paying how much just to apply for the university?


Poetry is rhythm
#2223833 - 01/31/14 08:41 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: phantomFive]  
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Originally Posted by phantomFive
Originally Posted by RyanThePianist

Recording quality is a great problem among pianists... my audition for university will be from my phone actually, which surprisingly has better quality than my laptop. XD

Even with a phone, you can still experiment with microphone placement and getting good variation in dynamic levels. Maybe find a 'recording studio' app that allows you to adjust compression levels.

Also, you can get a USB microphone for $30 on Amazon that will give you better results if your phone compresses your dynamics too much (the 'semper forte' effect). If you are auditioning for a university, it's good to have the dynamic range come out, because that's something they will likely listen for. Think about it, you're paying how much just to apply for the university?


Too late! Audition is due tomorrow. iPhone 4 quality will suffice I guess.

Last edited by RyanThePianist; 01/31/14 08:41 PM.

Music Major/Premed (Sophomore)

1990 Yamaha G3

Currently studying:

Rachmaninoff - Moment Musical No. 4
Saint-Saens - Piano Concerto No. 2
Bach - French Suite No. 5
Chopin - Waltz in E minor (for fun!)
#2223892 - 01/31/14 10:45 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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phantomFive Offline
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Originally Posted by RyanThePianist
Originally Posted by phantomFive
Originally Posted by RyanThePianist

Recording quality is a great problem among pianists... my audition for university will be from my phone actually, which surprisingly has better quality than my laptop. XD

Even with a phone, you can still experiment with microphone placement and getting good variation in dynamic levels. Maybe find a 'recording studio' app that allows you to adjust compression levels.

Also, you can get a USB microphone for $30 on Amazon that will give you better results if your phone compresses your dynamics too much (the 'semper forte' effect). If you are auditioning for a university, it's good to have the dynamic range come out, because that's something they will likely listen for. Think about it, you're paying how much just to apply for the university?


Too late! Audition is due tomorrow. iPhone 4 quality will suffice I guess.

Then stop by Radio Shack lol. Whatevs


Poetry is rhythm
#2224909 - 02/03/14 12:02 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: phantomFive]  
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I'm hoping to join this group/thread if it's not extinct; have been reading through for helpful hints. My teacher seemed to green light this piece today, but sometimes he backtracks, so I'll know for sure next week. I got up to the double staff part (not sure what to call it) in high school, decades ago, so some of the "which hand goes under/over" on the first page is still there.

My question: which edition did you prefer, and why? So far, I've got the Alfred/Murray Baylor, which has some possibly helpful pedaling, phrasing, and sostenuto hints, but also generates a lot of glare due to the coating on the pages. Also the one in "59 Piano Solos You Like to Play," which every piano household probably owns (battered, worn, hidden away; who bought this?) but not something to bring to lessons.

Thank you - hope I get the green light next Sunday!



Bartok, 6 Romanian Dances, Sz56; Beethoven Sonata #5, 10/1, C minor; Mozart, Divertimento piano trio, B-flat major, KV254; Paderewski, Menuet in G, 14/1
#2224954 - 02/03/14 02:18 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: ElaineAllegro]  
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Originally Posted by ElaineAllegro
I'm hoping to join this group/thread if it's not extinct; have been reading through for helpful hints. My teacher seemed to green light this piece today, but sometimes he backtracks, so I'll know for sure next week. I got up to the double staff part (not sure what to call it) in high school, decades ago, so some of the "which hand goes under/over" on the first page is still there.

My question: which edition did you prefer, and why? So far, I've got the Alfred/Murray Baylor, which has some possibly helpful pedaling, phrasing, and sostenuto hints, but also generates a lot of glare due to the coating on the pages. Also the one in "59 Piano Solos You Like to Play," which every piano household probably owns (battered, worn, hidden away; who bought this?) but not something to bring to lessons.

Thank you - hope I get the green light next Sunday!



This thread is definitely NOT dead. smile

I have "59 Piano Solos You Like to Play" also! I follow the pedaling in that edition. smile However, it's not very specific on how to pedal the middle section. I personally pedal after every quarter beat, but I pedal after two beats on the first two measures or so.


Music Major/Premed (Sophomore)

1990 Yamaha G3

Currently studying:

Rachmaninoff - Moment Musical No. 4
Saint-Saens - Piano Concerto No. 2
Bach - French Suite No. 5
Chopin - Waltz in E minor (for fun!)
#2225030 - 02/03/14 08:49 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Ha, I have that book, too, but I didn't even think to look in it. I have that one as well as 60 Progressive Piano Pieces You Like To Play.

Anyway, I first downloaded the Godowsky edited version, and then ultimately purchased the Peters edition, which is the one I'm using now.

I like it, except for one wrong note on the first page.

#2225112 - 02/03/14 11:03 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Originally Posted by RyanThePianist
I have "59 Piano Solos You Like to Play" also! I follow the pedaling in that edition. smile However, it's not very specific on how to pedal the middle section.


"59 Piano Solos You Like to Play" was first published by G. Schirmer, New York in 1936. It is anthology of the original Schirmer editions of those popular pieces. The "Prelude" was published in 1898 - six years after it was composed and around the time the piece was gaining popularity in the United States and Europe. The 1898 Schirmer edition was "edited and fingered" by Louis Oesterle (American, 1854 - 1932). Quite frankly, it's the only edition I've ever used of the Prelude (since 1958) - and perhaps that has been a serious oversight on my part. ha I've always assumed that the lack of pedal markings in the middle section were consistent with the way Rachmaninoff composed the piece. Does anyone here have access to an early Russian edition of the Prelude??



Mason and Hamlin BB - 91640
Kawai CA-65
YouTube channel - http://www.youtube.com/user/pianophilo
#2225142 - 02/03/14 11:55 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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I'll ask my teacher, who learned this prelude early and in the Soviet Union, if she has her old music.

I know initially she wanted me off the pedal in certain small points during the middle section, but in general she wanted me to pedal through the middle section. And now, I'm pedaling slightly through the parts she initially wanted no pedal on.

#2226274 - 02/05/14 12:02 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: ElaineAllegro]  
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Originally Posted by ElaineAllegro
I'm hoping to join this group/thread if it's not extinct; have been reading through for helpful hints. My teacher seemed to green light this piece today, but sometimes he backtracks, so I'll know for sure next week. I got up to the double staff part (not sure what to call it) in high school, decades ago, so some of the "which hand goes under/over" on the first page is still there.

My question: which edition did you prefer, and why? So far, I've got the Alfred/Murray Baylor, which has some possibly helpful pedaling, phrasing, and sostenuto hints, but also generates a lot of glare due to the coating on the pages. Also the one in "59 Piano Solos You Like to Play," which every piano household probably owns (battered, worn, hidden away; who bought this?) but not something to bring to lessons.

Thank you - hope I get the green light next Sunday!




I also have the Murray Baylor edition. However, I'm not so sure that I'll be practicing from this yet. I'm simply reading through. I am very interested in finding out what others are using and why. I had a very bad experience once with Clair de Lune in which I found several errors. I had already put a lot of work into the piece before i started discovering the errors. Not a good thing! frown



Carl

#2226277 - 02/05/14 12:10 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Here's the Godowsky edition on imslp: http://imslp.org/wiki/Special:ReverseLookup/11125

#2226278 - 02/05/14 12:10 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Update: there was so much to cover in my last piano lesson that we hardly had time to talk about when my teacher plans to start me on the Prelude. I still have hopes it will be this month.

However, I did learn that I am the first student my teacher will be teaching the Prelude to. He's putting quite a bit of preparation time in. So it's a pretty big deal for both of us!



Carl

#2226285 - 02/05/14 12:17 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Ha, that's awesome. I don't think I'm the first student my teacher taught it to, but my teacher has been extremely excited about it because it was one of "those pieces" she really felt was emblematic of her piano childhood, so for the first month or so, she just lapsed into nostalgia.

#2226345 - 02/05/14 02:31 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: TwoSnowflakes]  
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Thanks for the link. I can assume you didn't find any errors in the Godowsky version. What made you decide on the Peters edition?



Carl

#2226866 - 02/06/14 10:59 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Just started to play this piece this morning. I've just learn the beginning bars before Math Exercises smile. I'll take my time to complete this beautiful masterpiece smile.


#2226893 - 02/06/14 12:00 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: griffin2417]  
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Originally Posted by griffin2417


Thanks for the link. I can assume you didn't find any errors in the Godowsky version. What made you decide on the Peters edition?



For pieces I end up studying, I always buy a score from my local music store even if I've downloaded it online. The Peters edition was what they had in the non-compendium version of Rachmaninoff. At the time I didn't think it would be anytime soon I'd be ready for other Rachmaninoff, but it looks like there are several other preludes I might be able to dive into.

I now have two copies of it: the Peters, and it also appears in the prelude collection I just got from Boosey and Hawkes. Well, three if you count the original download of the Godowsky.

#2227257 - 02/07/14 01:20 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Progress Report, 2/6/14 9:18PM PT

Status: Practicing

Problem area: center section, is not even. The triplets sound almost random in rhythm. frown

Attempted solution: Practice section very slowly, carefully aligning the bass notes with the treble, and making the other notes as even as possible.

Mood: Optimistic.

Last edited by phantomFive; 02/07/14 01:20 AM.

Poetry is rhythm
#2228677 - 02/09/14 09:28 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: phantomFive]  
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I'm excited to be officially joining this thread. My teacher agreed we could add this to the mix.

I saw a lot of helpful hints here about getting through section 2 (agitato), but not too much on section 1. I'll share his suggestions in case anyone else finds them helpful.

This week's assignment (maybe this month's or season's, depending on progress) is to go through the page 1 chords slowly without pedal, pressing down from the surface of the keys using wrist motion; be sure all the notes are audible and equal weight, except voice the top note of the RH; and <aargh> try to make the top notes within the slurs sound like melodies by shifting along the keys from one chord to the next (no lifting). (Lots of detail; this doesn't come naturally to me.) He suggested playing everything mf for now, and adding dynamics when everything is crystal clear.

If anyone has other suggestions for page 1, I would appreciate it.

This piece totally justifies having bought a grand with a Sostenuto pedal!

#2228804 - 02/10/14 04:45 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Here is a version played by Rachmaninoff himself. For those who are interested, it was recorded on a Bechstein with the Ampico system.



Story: when I was originally learning this, I played it rather slow, but someone came to my house, heard me and said, "wow, that sounds good." Even with all my mistakes and slowness. I said, "what? You should hear Rachmaninoff!" and I played this recording for them. However, the person couldn't even pay attention to it.

Moral of the Story: even if you can't play as well as Rachmaninoff, playing live music for someone can be much more captivating than a recording. You don't need to be anywhere near perfect to give your listeners enjoyment.

Last edited by phantomFive; 02/10/14 04:46 AM.

Poetry is rhythm
#2228901 - 02/10/14 10:29 AM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: ElaineAllegro]  
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Glad you're joining in ElaineAllegro. I'm still waiting for the green light from my teacher. Also, thanks in advance for sharing tips you pick up in studying this piece! I'm meeting with my teacher this week and hope to get a clearer idea when he plans to get me started. I'm hoping very soon this month.



Carl

#2228994 - 02/10/14 02:10 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
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Congrats, Elaine! Welcome!

When we're all good and ready with our pieces, we should have an All Rachmaninoff Prelude Op 2, No 3 Recital. It'll be fantastically repetitive, but fun. smile

Though I'm wondering if, after finally finishing, if I'll EVER want to hear this piece again! LOL!

#2228996 - 02/10/14 02:14 PM Re: Prelude in C-sharp minor - Post your progress! [Re: RyanThePianist]  
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,994
TwoSnowflakes Offline
1000 Post Club Member
TwoSnowflakes  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,994
Oh you asked for page one suggestions. I think I mentioned it upthread, but take a fingering and stick with it. Learn this inside and out and don't do much of anything else until that's done, with all the jumps secure. Once you can put the fingers and jumps on autopilot, you'll have a whole lot more brain to spare on expression.

This goes for lots of pieces, but for this one in particular, it really helps.

Then I miiiight suggest learning the third section. While the first section is fresh. For me, I waited so long because the second section took me such a loooooong time to get a handle on, I was not in "chord acquisition mode" anymore, and found it slower going than had I just basically treated it as an immediate extension of the first section.

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