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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213115 01/11/14 09:37 PM
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You're going to play a piece for the left hand alone?


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
earlofmar #2213134 01/11/14 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Originally Posted by earlofmar


I plan to single handed (no pun intended) bring down the high standard of the next quarterly recital with my next offering.
You're going to play a piece for the left hand alone?


LOL!

I kind of agree that the more advanced pianists - even the non-professional - are kind of in a no-man's land. I personally love the friendliness of the ABF, but I also don't feel right posting recordings here expect when there's themed recitals that contain some music that would be beyond other ABFers. I'm sure there are others who feel the same way, but we know we are far from what we would consider a "real" pianist due to time constraints or other limitations we have.

I think there's a more competitive feel on the PC, and that's fine for those that like that. I'm a very competitive person, but since I know I'm not able to be as good as I can, I'm rather embarrassed to post my recordings. I've gotten to know and respect many ABFers and the encouragement that I get here can't be beat. Just because I'm advanced doesn't mean I don't need encouraging words too! smile


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
Morodiene #2213144 01/11/14 11:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Morodiene


Just because I'm advanced doesn't mean I don't need encouraging words too! smile


Well it's out of context but you did ask for it.......thanks for all your wonderful posts, I often come across you name in historical posts giving out words of wisdom. One of the few teachers who come to the ABF to teach, so thanks for being a voice of experience and reason.


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213177 01/12/14 12:41 AM
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Originally Posted by -Frycek
And there are some if us who aren't beginners. We don't qualify for that indulgence. Marginal players like me. We just aren't very good and probably never will be. We'd be torn to shreds on PC. But because we love the instrument as much as the gifted, we need an outlet too. I just don't want anyone to have agonize over whether to post on an ABF recital or not. I just want to keep it friendly, anything goes, unrated as it is now.

Frycek, I am a big fan of your posts (and your playing, btw!) and usually find myself in in complete agreement with you. But I think you've grabbed the wrong end of the stick here.

I’ve read the PC thread and don’t see why you feel so alarmed. They’re not trying to compete with the ABF quarterly recitals. People aren’t being asked to choose one over the other. It doesn’t seem to me that there’s any reason for ABF to change how we manage our recitals, or for ABFers to agonize over participating in them. People who like aspects of both the PC and ABF recitals are certainly free to participate in both. They are different animals. (The recitals, I mean, not the players!)

I doubt that PC introducing e-citals will suddenly cause anyone here to shake the dust of ABF off their shoes and head for the PC hills – but, even if some did, what would it matter? It's not like we need to fill X number of performance slots. People do or don’t participate in recitals for all sorts of reasons. Some are wildly committed to posting a recording every quarter; others, like me, have only done one or two. It’s never threatened the recitals or the health of our community.

Perhaps I am just completely missing the point, but this whole thread feels like a bit of a tempest in a teapot. Please know that I mean no offense, but I simply can’t get my head around what is worrying you so.

Last edited by piano_deb; 01/12/14 12:44 AM.

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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213238 01/12/14 05:06 AM
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I've read this thread and I can't figure out what the point is for the life of me! Critique, no critique? Too many recitals? Can't decide if one belongs to ABF or PC? etc.

Personally, I don't find the themed recitals distracting because I can only take part in some of them anyway, as most are just too difficult. And as for the quarterly recitals, my pieces are selected among the easiest and shortest ones I'm working on - the ones I can somehow manage to record without wasting too much of my practice time - so it's not particularly stressful. Nobody should feel compelled to participate every time.

Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
sinophilia #2213240 01/12/14 05:09 AM
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Originally Posted by sinophilia
I've read this thread and I can't figure out what the point is for the life of me!


It was a slow news day


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
Morodiene #2213264 01/12/14 07:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Morodiene
[quote=Polyphonist][quote=earlofmar]

... Just because I'm advanced doesn't mean I don't need encouraging words too! smile




Weeks ago I was moved when I heard you play the memory of Panda. I don't know what directed me to that post, but I'm glad something did.

Last edited by Rerun; 01/12/14 07:42 AM.

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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213266 01/12/14 07:45 AM
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This is specifically the part of this discussion that disturbed me. The notion that those who are attempting more advanced pieces are somehow perverting the purpose of the recitals. I couldn't care less about what they do on PC. I do care about what is allowed here. So far everything and everyone are allowed and I hope it stays that way.

"Well, you may be right. Surely there have been some longer pieces represented there, like Chopin's first Ballade. But most pieces are short and relatively simple, and many are outside the classical repertoire. Probably the initial intention with the ABF quarterlies was to give relatively inexperienced players to present their stuff. And lately some of us old foxes have entered the scene and spoiled everything.

The piece I have been considering to study is maybe not as technically difficult as the Chopin Ballade, but it is more or less in the same league and a pretty long piece. I would think twice before submitting it for the ABF recital. I'm just afraid that many of the other participants would find it annoying."


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213279 01/12/14 08:44 AM
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A number of years ago, someone actually proposed using a grading scheme on ABF quarterly recitals. The poster thought of it as a way to make comments more uniform and more useful. S(he) thought that most comments on the recital lacked content, that most of it was meaningless praise phrases. S(he) created a template of grades that one could assign to all performances.

Fireworks erupted. Full disclosure: I was one who challenged the whole notion of grading ABF performances. I understood that poster's frustration with fairly useless "attaboy" "attagirl" back-patting. I simply felt that any attempt to supplant that with a ranking system would be pure poison on this forum. I still think that.

When I review someone's playing, I do it with some seriousness. I want to be able to make what I think are appropriate suggestions. I offer praise, but I usually take the time to make some gentle critical points as well. That's risky. Some people don't want a critique at all. They just want a pat on the back for all the work they put in. For this reason, I don't review many performances. I listen to more than I write about, simply because of the amount of time it takes to say something serious (but sensitive) about someone else's hard work.

I'm not particularly worried about competition from PC. As others have noted, some people can happily float between the two forums. Others may attempt that straddle, but soon find that they have a real home in one or the other. That discovery process is good. Might the ideas and notions that govern PC bleed over to ABF, destroying the atmosphere of the ABF recitals? Frankly, I doubt it. After many years, this place has a firm sense of self.

Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213281 01/12/14 08:53 AM
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I was following the thread on PC and didn't see any cause for concern about the issues you are raising here.



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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213284 01/12/14 09:07 AM
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For some of us...the only comments we really are hungry for are wild applause and unconditional approval. That's not saying we don't know the mistakes and limitations of our ability but we need encouragement to perform. Our teachers critique the piece adequately. Since performance anxiety can only be mastered by performance...the more opportunity the better. Beginner recitals, mixed recitals, pop recitals, Chopin, etc. are all good to have as choices. Encourage is what we do well on ABF.


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
Piano*Dad #2213287 01/12/14 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Piano*Dad


I'm not particularly worried about competition from PC. As others have noted, some people can happily float between the two. Others may attempt that straddle, but soon find that they have a real home in one or the other. That discovery process is good. Might the ideas and notions that govern PC bleed over to ABF, destroying the atmosphere of the ABF recitals? Frankly, I doubt it. After many years, this place has a firm sense of self.


This is very reassuring. I"d just hate to see restrictions (official or otherwise) placed on what we are allowed to submit. (If I remember correctly there is already a fairly generous size restriction for technical reasons.)


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213442 01/12/14 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by -Frycek
This is specifically the part of this discussion that disturbed me. The notion that those who are attempting more advanced pieces are somehow perverting the purpose of the recitals. I couldn't care less about what they do on PC. I do care about what is allowed here. So far everything and everyone are allowed and I hope it stays that way.

"Well, you may be right. Surely there have been some longer pieces represented there, like Chopin's first Ballade. But most pieces are short and relatively simple, and many are outside the classical repertoire. Probably the initial intention with the ABF quarterlies was to give relatively inexperienced players to present their stuff. And lately some of us old foxes have entered the scene and spoiled everything.

The piece I have been considering to study is maybe not as technically difficult as the Chopin Ballade, but it is more or less in the same league and a pretty long piece. I would think twice before submitting it for the ABF recital. I'm just afraid that many of the other participants would find it annoying."

Well, I understand your concern better now – but I believe the poster you quoted might be a bit overconcerned about this issue. In my view, the inclusion of longer, more complex pieces by some “old foxes” hasn’t “spoiled” anything. It’s doubtful that ABF’s recitals will change in any significant manner, or that we will loose the warm and welcoming approach that makes ABF so comfortable for young pups, old foxes and “marginal players.” smile (Quoting you, but I would never describe your skills as marginal!)

As Piano*Dad and WiseBuff point out, we have a pretty firm sense of self in this forum – and we are all about encouraging one another.


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
piano_deb #2213472 01/12/14 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by piano_deb
Originally Posted by -Frycek
This is specifically the part of this discussion that disturbed me. The notion that those who are attempting more advanced pieces are somehow perverting the purpose of the recitals. I couldn't care less about what they do on PC. I do care about what is allowed here. So far everything and everyone are allowed and I hope it stays that way.

"Well, you may be right. Surely there have been some longer pieces represented there, like Chopin's first Ballade. But most pieces are short and relatively simple, and many are outside the classical repertoire. Probably the initial intention with the ABF quarterlies was to give relatively inexperienced players to present their stuff. And lately some of us old foxes have entered the scene and spoiled everything.

The piece I have been considering to study is maybe not as technically difficult as the Chopin Ballade, but it is more or less in the same league and a pretty long piece. I would think twice before submitting it for the ABF recital. I'm just afraid that many of the other participants would find it annoying."

Well, I understand your concern better now – but I believe the poster you quoted might be a bit overconcerned about this issue. In my view, the inclusion of longer, more complex pieces by some “old foxes” hasn’t “spoiled” anything. It’s doubtful that ABF’s recitals will change in any significant manner, or that we will loose the warm and welcoming approach that makes ABF so comfortable for young pups, old foxes and “marginal players.” smile (Quoting you, but I would never describe your skills as marginal!)

As Piano*Dad and WiseBuff point out, we have a pretty firm sense of self in this forum – and we are all about encouraging one another.


+1 to the post.
As someone who feels passionate about ABF (I was welcomed in with open arms and grew together with my friends), nothing more disturbing than sensing hint of conflict within the forum. I don't share any concern about the new themed recitals. I just see it a sign of growth as a community.

I also would like to encourage everyone to give benefit of doubts to what you read on the forum. We have a limited communication in the forum - we don't see and hear each other when we speak. We don't even know true names and background many times. So communication here is not unlike the one I experienced as a non-native speaker of English. I had to learn hard way that "I could be wrong". In fact many times perception of wrong done by others were my misunderstanding. Lets look at the action of the poster quoted by Frycek. He painstakingly listened to everyone's recording and provided very nice well thought out comments. I think he is a very caring person. I think he is just stating what he thinks. As Deb mentioned that I don't think anyone in ABF minds anyone pitting a big work but it makes sense to post it in PC if someone wants feedback. Many people there teach (used to teach, going to teach) piano for living.

Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213512 01/12/14 04:59 PM
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earlofmar and Rerun:

Thank you so much for that. I wasn't fishing for compliments by any means, and the people here on ABF have always been so encouraging. That's why I like it so much, and love to contribute in any way I can. wink


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213545 01/12/14 05:47 PM
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The ABF is a big tent, and that big tent is well staked down. No one, beginner or advanced, should feel they can't submit to a recital. ABF is a big tent.

As for the proliferation of themed e-citals, they may well be a waxing and waning phenomenon. Right now there are a slew of them on offer, but I'd bet they'll die down after awhile, then resurge again at some future time, etc. A number of people have already alluded to the self-limiting nature of having a lot of recitals going at the same time.


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
earlofmar #2213551 01/12/14 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by earlofmar
Originally Posted by Morodiene


Just because I'm advanced doesn't mean I don't need encouraging words too! smile


Well it's out of context but you did ask for it.......thanks for all your wonderful posts, I often come across you name in historical posts giving out words of wisdom. One of the few teachers who come to the ABF to teach, so thanks for being a voice of experience and reason.


A big +1 to this. Thanks, Morodiene. (P.S. As a chemist, I automatically think of conjugated double bonds in molecules when I see your screen name. grin )


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
earlofmar #2213564 01/12/14 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by earlofmar
Originally Posted by Morodiene


Just because I'm advanced doesn't mean I don't need encouraging words too! smile


Well it's out of context but you did ask for it.......thanks for all your wonderful posts, I often come across you name in historical posts giving out words of wisdom. One of the few teachers who come to the ABF to teach, so thanks for being a voice of experience and reason.



I second that emotion! smile




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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
Stubbie #2213565 01/12/14 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Stubbie


A big +1 to this. Thanks, Morodiene. (P.S. As a chemist, I automatically think of conjugated double bonds in molecules when I see your screen name. grin )


As a non-chemist, I have no idea what this means. But thanks, I think laugh


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Re: Possibly Disturbing Ecital Trend Needs Discussion
-Frycek #2213667 01/12/14 09:45 PM
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Is it a new/recent thing for Pianist Corner to hold recitals? was it only Adult Beginners Forum before that? I'm a recent arrival and perhaps naively I assumed that both groups held recitals regularly...


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