Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Adult Beginners Forum Achievement of the week - what got you excited?

Thank you good sir.

Me too, you work all day and six months later it needs cleaned again.

It sounds like everyone is doing great things with their AOTW. Mine all consist of cleaning up the yard and the Garden Of Weedin'.
I did get my F#m scales up to 150 so far. I only got 1/2 hr of bench time yesterday.

And you played beautifully as well.

My AOTW is the realization that I really can not play in front of other people.
It was quite a shock for me to play pieces for others that I had been playing with verve, energy, passion and dare I say,... even some accuracy! Only to find that when it came to the crunch the practice didn't get me through anywhere near as well as I would have liked. By the end of the day I was looking at my sheet music, seeing the notes and I had absolutely no idea what to do with my hands. It was as though my brain and my hands belonged to two completely different people who didn't speak the same language.

It's all well and good to say that the more you play for others the easier it gets, but I don't have many opportunities, and I keep flubbing the ones I do get...So I am turning to my buddies here for some serious advice because I really long to play for and with other folks --- but it just isn't working.

Suggestions?

"By the end of the day"? Goodness! - how LONG were you playing for? How were the first few pieces you played? Stamina comes with experience.

It's not necessary to remind you that the audience thought you were just fine, is it? :-)

Well, thank you but .....seriously, I'm sure the audience was well aware I was not fine!


The audience was very kind. You couldn't ask for better - but
my husband, who had been listening to it all come together really well all last week, couldn't believe what a hash I made of my stuff.(Though he didn't say a word until I started talking about it).


I personally wasn't playing all day - we were taking turns. I played 4 very short solo pieces. The first was "ok" the second had flubs, the third was note-right but without any of the expression I'd been able to put into it the day before, and the forth was a train wreck.

Anyway I don't really want to whine about it (well, yes, I do, but I won't) ..... I am looking for serious advice on what folks do when their minds go completely blank, when it just doesn't work....

Exalted Wombat, I can't believe I'm going to write what I'm about to write and address it to you, of all people. There's a major case of role reversal going on here.

But: it can't be denied that some people managed to play *much* better during the EPP than others. I messed up each and every one of the pieces I attempted, even though I'd played most of them in front of groups before (and usually better than I played them yesterday at the EPP). This is despite the fact that I had the advantage of getting to play on the same piano I play every day.

I know there are some kind souls out there who would be willing to tell me that I did just fine. But if they did that, we'd both know it was at least a partial white lie. And I think the same is true for casinitaly: what she did here during the EPP wasn't bad by any means, but we were all aware, as is she, that she can do better under different circumstances.

The question is: how do you translate what you can do under ideal circumstances to the more challenging situations? And unfortunately, as demonstrated rather decisively yesterday, I don't have a good answer to that question.

The best I can come up with is to play the same two or three pieces ten or twenty times a day, every day, for at least a week before any kind of public performance. Play them at half-speed, play them at actual performance speed, play them at double speed. Play them with the music, without it, with your eyes closed, with your gaze fixed on your hands, or while staring out the window. Play them with and without the metronome ticking in the background. Play them as many ways as you can think of, until you can play them without having to think at all.

That has seemed to work (mostly) for the three live recitals I did at my teacher's behest this year. But it didn't work for the EPP, because I had just come from an eleven-day scouting trip during which I hadn't played at all.

Oh, well. Better next time.

cas!! we have the same problem!! i play in front of my roomate (he doesn't have a choice and he's a long time buddy) but whenever i go to lessons, i EASILY do way worse than when im solo at home. i thoroughly believe we just need to play in front of people we aren't "comfortable" with but thats just it, i don't know how to accomplish that! haha

For example: i sat in my last lesson and my teachers like no thats the wrong note (he never tells me what note he always makes me figure it out lol) and i can read music fine.. and i just starred at it blankly, each second getting annoyed with myself that such a simple question felt like he was asking me to move the earth, shesh.

its really cool to see all the different achievements everyone here has. dedicated individuals!

To get used to playing for people. Might try playing at retirement homes?

Don't worry about it Cas....you're normal. That's all.

I wrote my little advice in the EPP thread. I always make mistakes. In fact never played without. However I do have experience of euphoric performances where I knew I played my my heart out. I was completely in the music with the music and with the moment. When it happens you know it and more importantly, your audience knows it. You get an applause and you know it in their face. Human faces are so dead honest. Some of them actually approaches you and tell you that they are moved and made them cry. To me that's the best feeling you can get in the whole world. In that moment my a few mistakes do not seem matter. I could have taken a moment before the attack there, touched the right note but the sound did not come out etc etc etc. Trying to play accurately is important when practice, but when perform it's more important to focus on the music you are making. In a way you need to get used to let go each mistake and focus on the next note and play the music the way you want. Do not stop. Do not dwell on it just focus on the beautiful place you want to show to your audience. This is something I tell myself all the time too.

Hi Cas, what you describe is high average. Unless a person has ice in their veins, your performance is pretty good. So well done. Advice? Lower your standards and your performance will rise. To expect an amateur that doesn't perform often to get near their best on performance day, is expecting too much.

You did fine. You are being overly critical of yourself. You rehearsed, you remembered most of your pieces, you got to the end of all of them it seems. Just getting to the end counts as an achievement for an amateur.

You (and others) have read my many reports about performing live. I do it all the time, and tend to be much more outgoing than the average person. Still, my mind still goes blank at times. I still have train wrecks. Maybe 10% of the time do I feel like I am near my potential. If I can get a performance note perfect, or with minor flubs, I count that as a success. So by my count you had three successes and one train wreck (which you likely still got to the end), which is pretty good after a very long day with travel, performing for virtual strangers, in a strange setting, on an unfamiliar piano.

I've mentioned using crib sheets with just the first couple of bars written out in short hand. If I can get the first few notes out, the muscle memory often kicks in, so even if the mind is blank the hands remember what to play. Personally, I find sheet music to be near useless when under pressure, but others may find it to be useful.

As an aside, it isn't as scary on piano vs. flute. On flute, nerves can mean that no sound comes out! The more a person strains for an embouchure, the more tension, the less chance of any sound. There have been times that I had to apologize and put down the flute and go to whistle, because there was little chance of flute music that day.

/edit to add: Congratulations to The Hound on passing the grade 8 exam. That is quite the achievement.

Yup....I ignorantly forgot that too. The guy deserves recognition. Congrats to da Hound.

Cheryl one more thing before I forget. The symptoms of not being able to associate score to notes are very common. First people learn the music with the score, memorize it by associating the note to the keys at first, then pretty soon people start associating the sound to the keys. If you do not do occasional slow practice to confirm the notes to the sounds to the keys, you will completely lose the link between the notes and keys. You think you memorized but your memory is fragile. Since its solely based on the sound, any strange sound (wrong note / different piano / out if tune etc) will easily throw you off. Have you heard of performers do extra slow practice a day before the performance. That's what they are doing. To verify the connection of notes, keys and sound. Ok I will shut up now. Please don't take me wrong. I usually refrain from advising others because I'm nobody. Just I like you guys too much to hold it in.

farmgirl i think i understand what you are trying to convey. to confirm, when i play extra slow and say aloud the note name as i play it, is that what you are talking about?

all this talk of performance anxiety one should remember that performing anything in public, be it a speech, a joke, or a piano recital is a skill some of us will be able to work on but perhaps for some it will never come.

A good example that springs to my mind is Anthony Phillips which if you have heard of him I would be surprised, although he does have an extensive back catalogue. Anthony was one of the founding members of the rock group Genesis, the band at one point were probably the biggest in the world and earned gazillions. After the first two albums Anthony developed such stage fright he became physically ill and was forced to leave the group missing out on all the success. The good news was he found a niche, he could record brilliant works and people would buy his albums but he never toured.

Like Casinintaly I have very few people to play to and I totally fall to pieces if I have to show my work. Therefore when I record for a recital or the piano bar it takes multiple attempts before I can capture one that I think is good enough. As an idea perhaps we could have a separate monthly thread similar to the piano bar, could be called "First Take" where we attempt to perform our pieces in only the first recording forcing us to play through mistakes or pauses.

Would it work to have live online performances? Say at a set time. People can play. Skype? Call it the Saturday Night Piano Bar Live. Put yourself down on the thread for a time. It's reserved.
Or would that help?

EarlofMar, again, what you describe is average. It is the exceptional musician that can record well on one take. No recording artist does it that way any more. There are few amateurs and almost no beginners in that group. If you want to record your first take and upload it to the piano bar, some folks do that, so go right ahead.

Just to be clear, Casinitaly did not fall apart. She did very well for an amateur with limited performance experience. I know about falling apart on stage, and what she described I see as a good performance, not a bad one.

For my recital pieces, a dozen takes is average, usually over the course of several days. Sometimes the end result is still rough. Others describe similar. All of this is part of the beginner journey. Beginners tend to sound like beginners. There are enough exceptional folks on this forum, it sometimes makes the average folks feel inferior.

One reason recording advances us as musicians, is because we are aiming higher. That's the entire point of polishing to performance level. The red-dot adds stress. The end result, usually after many takes, hopefully is close to our best. Obviously, my best or your best will pale in comparison to the best from a pianist with more skill.

A small percentage of people can never overcome their stage fright. They have terrible symptoms and every trick in the book is not enough to get them to performance level. It might be 5% to 10% of musicians. Casinitaly is clearly not in that troubled group or she would have never made the trip, and never made it through one piece much less four.

Hi cas, I thought you did pretty well though. I enjoyed your music at the party. Everybody made errors.

When playing for others, most people get adrenaline in their body. Muscles get more tensed. The piece is played at a much higher pace. The higher pace and the tension in the hands and fingers results often in mistakes.

So I think if you play at 20% lower speed in public, you might actually play at your normal speed.

Also when performing in public, some part of the brain is busy with other things than playing piano. Let's say, the brain is performing at 80%. And when it's get difficult, the brain can switch to old habits or old solutions and so switching back to and old, not so good play. As if it chooses the most old rememberings. So it could be that the achievement of the last two weeks of practise before performing, is totally vanished at stage.

What helps for me to concentrate better is to count when playing.

Saranoya, I beg to differ. You did an outstanding performance under those circumstances. You were tensed, your fingers were shaking. They didn't move like you wanted to, but somehow you manage to hit the right notes though. When I watched your play, I asked myself, how is that possible, if my fingers would shake like that, I would never hit any right note.


The Hound, congrats for your grade 8 exam. That's pretty good!

This is why I stopped playing flute. I don't remember strained embouchure though. For me it was 1) surprise vibrato caused by my heart pounding 2) dry mouth with my tongue stuck so articulation became impossible and finally 3) inability to breathe properly limiting sound production, and eventually consciousness.

It just wasn't meant to be!

cas--at least you didn't pass out!!

Excellent! Congratulations on your Distinction!

From here on we will expect you to make very distinguished posts.

The Hound: sorry I missed your VERY impressive AOTW !! Congratulations on such a splendid success!!!