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Scarlatti sonata #2201096
12/21/13 06:18 PM
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Are Scarlatti sonatas normally played 2 at a time? Because in diploma syllabuses, many time they say on repertoire lists: any two of following Scarlatti. Also, I have seen competition repertoire requirements that say things such as: Bach prelude and fugue or 2 Scarlatti sonatas. If the answer to my question is yes, then why?

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Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201098
12/21/13 06:25 PM
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Sorry I just realized I completely misread requirements. It says one of the following pairs of Scarlatti sonatas.

Edit: wait does this mean one pair of sonatas, or one sonata?

Last edited by A Guy; 12/21/13 06:26 PM.
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201109
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"One of the following pairs" means one pair, chosen from the following list of pairs. That would mean you couldn't mix and match sonatas between the pairs in the list.


Du holde Kunst...
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201131
12/21/13 08:04 PM
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Ok... So my first post remains an open question then smile thanks!

Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201133
12/21/13 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by A Guy
Ok... So my first post remains an open question then smile thanks!

If you don't think that your question has been answered yet, well the answer is NO grin.

Scarlatti didn't compose his sonatas in pairs, and there's no reason why any pianist (or harpsichordist) would play them in pairs - and hardly anyone does. Unless required by exams, usually to stop students picking two slow easy ones....

They bear no resemblance to Bach's WTC at all.


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: bennevis] #2201138
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Originally Posted by bennevis
slow easy ones....

I hate the use of this phrase. Why should a piece's tempo be an indicator of its difficulty?


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: Polyphonist] #2201147
12/21/13 08:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Originally Posted by bennevis
slow easy ones....

I hate the use of this phrase. Why should a piece's tempo be an indicator of its difficulty?

Because Scarlatti's slow sonatas are almost always technically easy.


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201148
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Technical complication is not the only factor in difficulty.


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: Polyphonist] #2201151
12/21/13 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Technical complication is not the only factor in difficulty.

Scarlatti's keyboard music is musically straightforward. The slow ones aren't like Beethoven's Hammerklavier slow movement. Not even like the Moonlight - I.

There is a huge variety of interpretation possible in the slow ones, but that's not the same as being 'musically difficult'.


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201153
12/21/13 08:42 PM
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For what it's worth, my teacher once advised me not to play only one Scarlatti sonata in a concert as they are usually played in "groups".


Heather W. Reichgott, piano http://heatherwreichgott.blogspot.com

Working on:
Cabaret (whole show)
12+ variations from classical ballets
Verdi: Stabat Mater
Copland: Appalachian Spring
Tangos and other fun music for piano duo

I love Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven and new music
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: bennevis] #2201154
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Originally Posted by bennevis
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Technical complication is not the only factor in difficulty.

Scarlatti's keyboard music is musically straightforward.

Not all of it. And a lot of people manage to screw up music no matter how straightforward it is. grin


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: hreichgott] #2201156
12/21/13 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted by hreichgott
For what it's worth, my teacher once advised me not to play only one Scarlatti sonata in a concert as they are usually played in "groups".

Well, in general it's not a good idea to program just two minutes of music by a composer in a full recital. There are exceptions, of course, but Scarlatti is not really one of them.


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: Polyphonist] #2201157
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Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Originally Posted by bennevis
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Technical complication is not the only factor in difficulty.

Scarlatti's keyboard music is musically straightforward.

Not all of it. And a lot of people manage to screw up music no matter how straightforward it is. grin

I screw the slow Scarlatti ones up all the time (partly because I tend to use them for sight-reading...... wink ).


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: bennevis] #2201158
12/21/13 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by bennevis
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Originally Posted by bennevis
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Technical complication is not the only factor in difficulty.

Scarlatti's keyboard music is musically straightforward.

Not all of it. And a lot of people manage to screw up music no matter how straightforward it is. grin

I screw the slow Scarlatti ones up all the time.

Exactly.


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201160
12/21/13 08:49 PM
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So now let me ask a follow up question: I need to learn 60 minutes worth of music for a competition: I have 57-58. My teacher wants a Scarlatti sonata I think. Would you advise to just play one, or to "shorten" the time length we write for the other pieces by, say, 30 seconds each, to accommodate for two Scarlatti pieces? And if I even make the competition first round, I need the pieces by July, so I don't have much time

Last edited by A Guy; 12/21/13 08:50 PM.
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: hreichgott] #2201161
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Originally Posted by hreichgott
For what it's worth, my teacher once advised me not to play only one Scarlatti sonata in a concert as they are usually played in "groups".

Many - probably most - concert pianists program them in odd-numbered selections, so that they can play fast-slow-fast-slow-fast in that order. You want to finish the group with a fast one, generally.

Like most piano sonatas.


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201163
12/21/13 08:50 PM
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Whatever you do, tell the truth about durations, or be prepared for them to call "time" before you get to the big finish.


Heather W. Reichgott, piano http://heatherwreichgott.blogspot.com

Working on:
Cabaret (whole show)
12+ variations from classical ballets
Verdi: Stabat Mater
Copland: Appalachian Spring
Tangos and other fun music for piano duo

I love Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven and new music
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201165
12/21/13 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by A Guy
So now let me ask a follow up question: I need to learn 60 minutes worth of music for a competition: I have 57-58. My teacher wants a Scarlatti sonata I think. Would you advise to just play one, or to "shorten" the time length we write for the other pieces by, say, 30 seconds each, to accommodate for two Scarlatti pieces?

What is the rest of your program?


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: Polyphonist] #2201167
12/21/13 08:56 PM
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I will list times along with repertoire so far:
Bach prelude and fugue in e major: 3:00
Beethoven sonata op 10 no 3
Mvmt 1- 5:00
Mvmt 2- 10:00
Haydn sonata hob xvi 50 complete- 15:00
Liszt hungarian rhapsody 8- 6:30
Chopin etude op 10 no 3- 4:30
Chopin ballade 3- 8:00
Prokofiev sonata 2 Mvmt 4- 4:30

Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201169
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I would get rid of the Liszt and finish the Beethoven. And I'd also replace the Prokofiev with something like the Opus 11 - partial sonatas are generally a bad idea.


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201170
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Well I found an extra minute for you: the 3rd Ballade is usually 6:30 or 7 min. Check your own duration though to be sure.


Heather W. Reichgott, piano http://heatherwreichgott.blogspot.com

Working on:
Cabaret (whole show)
12+ variations from classical ballets
Verdi: Stabat Mater
Copland: Appalachian Spring
Tangos and other fun music for piano duo

I love Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven and new music
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201171
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No, that's a practical choice, but my teacher and I have already started the liszt, I've completed notes, and both of us really like the piece.

Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201172
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It's still preferable to get rid of partial sonatas, ESPECIALLY partial Beethoven sonatas. They simply do not work.


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: Polyphonist] #2201173
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Originally Posted by Polyphonist
It's still preferable to get rid of partial sonatas, ESPECIALLY partial Beethoven sonatas. They simply do not work.


Who ever thought a partial sonata was a good idea? sick

Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201174
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Perhaps in longer recitals they wouldn't work. However, this competition is split up in two rounds: one is 25 minutes, and one is 35 minutes. The complete sonata is 22 minutes. If I added the complete sonata, I would have to get rid of one of the pieces I have, excluding the haydn, since its already complete. I'm required to have an etude, and I've already started practicing the test,

@hreich: thanks. I suggested it to my teacher, and she said it was 8 minutes on her timing

Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: Grandalf] #2201175
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Originally Posted by JoelW
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
It's still preferable to get rid of partial sonatas, ESPECIALLY partial Beethoven sonatas. They simply do not work.


Who ever thought a partial sonata was a good idea? sick

Apparently he did. laugh


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201176
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I feel as if partial sonatas work in this competition. I looked back at archived results, and many, if not most, finalists played partial sonatas.

Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201177
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Originally Posted by A Guy
Perhaps in longer recitals they wouldn't work.

Partial Beethoven sonatas do not work in ANY recitals.


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: A Guy] #2201178
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Originally Posted by A Guy
I feel as if partial sonatas work in this competition. I looked back at archived results, and many, if not most, finalists played partial sonatas.

Partial Beethoven sonatas?


Regards,

Polyphonist
Re: Scarlatti sonata [Re: Polyphonist] #2201179
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Originally Posted by Polyphonist
Originally Posted by JoelW
Originally Posted by Polyphonist
It's still preferable to get rid of partial sonatas, ESPECIALLY partial Beethoven sonatas. They simply do not work.


Who ever thought a partial sonata was a good idea? sick

Apparently he did. laugh


I prefer to play complete sonatas. However, I feel that a partial sonata is acceptable in this competition for reasons listed above...

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