Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Adult Beginners Forum Help: Do Re Mi vs C-D-E-F-G (plus other questions)

Hi,

I am from the Philippines and I'm an absolute beginner in piano. I am rather old at 41yrs old but I am very interested to learn the piano. I have a few questions though, namely:

1) What are the advantages/disadvantages of learning the piano by using the Do Re Mi method as against the C-D-E-F-G?

2) I am also currently studying acoustic guitar (1month now). Will it be a bad idea to learn Piano and Guitar at the same time? I have around 2hours practice time each day and I'd like to devote an hour for guitar and an hour for piano.

3) How would you know if a music teacher is a good one? I initially started thinking of doing self study with the piano but I've read that I might learn bad habits if i don't get a piano teacher who would teach me the proper way to play. Is this true?

4) If in case I do decide to just do self study, what are the bad habits that I should look out for in playing the piano?

5) If in case I do decide to go self study, what online sites are great for this? Is there any site which are equivalent to jamplay or guitartricks for guitars? It is ok for me to pay so as long as it is a really good site but it would still be better if it would be free. (someone pointed out that another good free resource is Lypur's youtube site - Furmanczyk Piano Academy)

6) What beginner book would you suggest? Is Alfred's Basic All in One book the best there is? In our country, the popular book being used by piano teachers is John Thompson's Modern Course for the Piano: First Grade Book. Is Alfred's better than Thompson?


Note though that I do not intend to turn into a pro. I only do this for myself as I find it relaxing and I love the music that I hear. Hopefully, I can play fluently some day during parties and family gatherings.

Thanks and sorry for all the questions

Well to jump in on number one what are you going to call the sharps and flats?
Better to learn the proper names for the keys. There are only 12 possibilities after all.

what do you mean?

Aren't there both sharps/flats for both do/re/mi and C-D-E? I'm really a beginner so please enlighten me.

There is a Do sharp and C sharp right?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Do-Re-Mi

If you want to learn to play the piano (or the guitar), learn the C-D-E method.

Yes. Not only that, you will likely injure yourself.

Psychonaut - can you expound on this ? Why is it better to learn the C-D-E method as against the Do-Re-Mi if I want to learn to play piano?

Thanks

I am just another beginner, but some obvious reasons are that a lot of written material and video tutorials will refer to the letter names. For example, the C major scale isn't commonly called the Doe-major scale. A C7 chord isn't called a Doe-7 chord in the literature or in a video tutorial.

In the English language, yes. In other countries you will hear and read "Do 7" and "Do majeur". The RCM repertoire books are bilingual, and you will see this all the time. Same if you turn to radio to the French channel, where you'll hear the announcer say that this piece was in "La mineur".

Is there anything more to Do-Re-Mi vs C-D-E except note names, something that justifies calling them separate "methods"? I remember being taught Do-Re-Mi in elementary school but since starting the piano I use C-D-E. They kinda merged now I do not have trouble using either. So I do not think it's very critical but then again I'm a beginner.

There are two Do-Re-Mi's. One of them is just the note names as used in some countries, and there is no difference. The other is "movable Do solfege" which is used to express scale degrees, as in the Sound of Music.

Yes, of course there is. Many European countries use the do-re-mi system rather than the C D E system.
My first piano teacher didn't speak English and my lesson were in Italian. We spoke of "bemolle" for flats and "diesis" for sharps.

This is certainly the "proper" way to learn here it Italy.

That being said, if you are in a primarily English environment the CDE system is more common (and frankly I find it easier).

As mentioned above, in Italy and many other European countries we use do-re-mi. I find it more intuitive because it starts from what I perceive as the "first note" (C) and not from the middle (A). Also, if you're doing solfège, it's easier to sing syllables than single letters. I started on the piano using English method books, so I got used to A-B-C very quickly, but I can't help thinking that letters are quite dull and not musical at all.

In the end, it makes no difference whatsoever.

About bad habits, teachers, etc.

IMHO, if you are free to do what feels more natural for you, and you're not taught a specific "method", you might very well end up using the most efficient gestures and play in a way that's the most suitable for your body and your hands. But you need to be very careful and avoid tension at all times. When difficulties arise, try different approaches until you find the best one for you, the most natural. But even with a teacher, you still need to pay attention, you can't just think that they will do everything for you. Your teacher won't be able to watch you all the time, and he/she certainly doesn't feel what's going on in your body. Some may be convinced that a certain way of playing fits all, which might be even more dangerous than learning alone.

Just my opinion.

Either method can work no doubt. I'm just now learning solfege and finding it very difficult after a lifetime of CDE. In my theory class we sing in solfege and going up and down the scale makes my mind trip up. Especially more than one octave. There are syllables for all the half steps. I can see where it eventually helps with intervals but I wouldn't say it's ideal for piano.

I'm a very young 42 years old, and started seriously at 40, so not far off...



I'm Spanish and use the Internet to learn new pieces. It's almost impossible to find tutorials using the Do-Re-Mi, so I have had to get used to the C-D-E instead. If you want to teach yourself you might have to do the same thing. It's quite confusing at first, but you'll get used to it in a couple of weeks.


Cannot comment as I'm only learning piano, but it seems that quite a lot people are learning several instruments at the same time.


It is. Word of mouth is the best way, I'm sure that you can find people who is learning piano, or whose kids are, and can recommend you a teacher. You can also ask about his/her studies and experience, and many give a free first lesson, so you can also check if you can "click". I started learning with a teacher, just to make sure that I would get the basics, and then it came to a point where it simply wasn't worthy because being dyslexic I was just hiting my head against the music sheet without being able to advance. Since then I'm self taught. She was very nice and a good teacher for others, but with no experience with dyslexic people and I felt I was wasting my time.


For me posture, hands, strenght, and making sure that you are using an adjustable stool and that it's at the right height for you. That's ergonomics and if not right it might hurt your back and joints. Then as per piano playing, a bit of help with fingering, sense of rythm, introduction to basic music theory and start getting the difference of expressions so that you recognise when the piece sounds flat even though you hit the right notes. But fingering for instance is many times a matter of trial and error. It seems that because I'm dyslexic and my funny space and direction sense I'm a bit "original" about fingering, but I understand that everyone will end up finding the right fingering.


I really like Lypur's videos, he's a very nice guy putting a lot of effort into transmitting his knowledgment. Good piano and theory lessons... and free!
Then there are also lots of tutorials for specific songs and pieces in YouTube. Just make sure that you do both the piano and music theory so that you'll understand the music and piano lingo. Then also learn some pieces you like so that you can see progression. If you feel that you are actually getting to play something you'll get motivated to continue learning.


Albert's is very popular. I tried to follow if but I have given up sight reading because of my dyslexia, so somebody else can comment on this.
I follow Piano4All, which is a very good and cheap piano course for self learning, very practical too.



That is exactly my goal: to play for myself the music I like... and occasionally to "torture" others into listening to my playing

There are many people here who are self learning very successfully. They don't usually speak up because (I think) then the people who think you HAVE to have a teacher start becoming unglued and the topic starts going downhill.

However, it's certainly possible to teach yourself without causing injury, it's done successfully all the time.

Using a teacher is certainly a good way to learn but it is not the only way.

This is the top of the page of a Canadian RCM book, on scales. This should answer some of the questions about names.

@1 I believe it's better to work with relative pitch and I think the do-re-mi system would fit that. c-d-e instead seems to refer to absolute pitches instead of relative.

But I usually do harmonic analysis and rarely do note counting. In harmonic analysis I use I-II-III etc in relative pitch.

@3 yes learning bad habits should be avoided. Maybe you can tell from the feedback that you get.

Thanks for all the replies.

What are the top 5 bad habits that I should watch out for? (or more if you can tell me more). How do i also solve this?

I've read that you should use a chair wherein you can adjust the height but what should be the proper height? Any diagrams that could help? Thanks

One basic rule of piano seating is that you want to be at a height where your elbows and your hands on the keyboard should be in the same perfectly horizontal plane. Or more simply, you want each forearm to be horizontal, not tipping upward or downward.

Also you want to be seated far enough back that your right hand can reach toward the left end of the keyboard (crossing in front of your body), and your left hand can reach toward the right.

Some people like to always sit with their navel pointing at the D just above middle C. That way you can develop a consistent proprioceptive sense of where all the other keys sit in relation to that fixed center.