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Judging from the type of music being presented at the time, and the prominence of the ring-tone, I think that in this case Zacharias was quite justified in simply stopping the performance midstream -- for me, the ring-tone absolutely wrecked the expressive sense of the piece at that point. And, I thought that he was spot-on in his explanation of his decision, and very reasonable in tone -- there simply are times when you should not grin-and-bear-it. For me, this was one of those times. I saw no sense whatever of a "prima donna" attitude in him.

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Originally Posted by Alan Lai
The 24 hour on-call is not even an excuse, as per your last sentence: set it to vibrate.

I actually turn my smartphone OFF during concerts. How many of the audiences do that?

I'm surprised that some members feel it's OK to have your cell phone on at all in the audience. "Vibrate" is no good either.

If you're on call or otherwise must have your phone on, don't come to the concert. (Even if it were mine.) ha
I didn't think my idea of concerts was so archaic. IMO if you absolutely need to have the phone on, you don't belong there.

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Originally Posted by Mark_C
IMO if you absolutely need to have the phone on, you don't belong there.

It's been 6 or 7 years since I've seen a live classical music performance, so count me as fully compliant with your wishes.

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Originally Posted by Mark_C
IMO if you absolutely need to have the phone on, you don't belong there.


Ditto.

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As a listener, I don't need a distractionless and silent atmosphere in order to enjoy the music, but I wouldn't fault a performer for stopping due to a noise, even a minor one. That's his choice.

The reaction of the offender's neighbors is sometimes funny, and often more distracting than the distraction itself. The stern glances, the sighs, the pearl-clutching... anyone get the sense that some people enjoy this a little too much? Occasionally some helpful individual will actually throw a "Shhh!" at some guy who's discreetly unwrapping a lozenge or convulsing as he tries to suppress a cough. Yeah, maybe he should have stayed home, but he didn't.

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How did people survive in the era before cell phones? That is, less than two decades ago.

How did we get to the stage where people think they are so important that they have to be contactable at all times 24/7?

Some people need a reality check.....


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Originally Posted by Old Man
Originally Posted by wr

There is always the possibility that the problem person in the audience is getting some perverse and pathological enjoyment from disrupting a concert. I've had the distinct impression a few times that when a person is making noise during a classical concert, it's coming from some kind of infantile need for attention on the part of a vastly over-entitled and self-absorbed idiot. They just can't bear that the person on stage is getting all that wonderful attention, and they are getting none at all. So they make disruptive noises.

That's quite a stretch. Maybe we should leave that sort of analysis to Mark C.

I think many of these disruptions come from people who are on call. I work in IT, and just like the medical profession, we are often on call 24x7. There is no option to simply leave the cell phone at home, because, in my own case, a response is required within 15 minutes or additional pages will begin escalating to upper management.

But the solution is as simple as Morodiene has said: Turn the damned sound settings to vibrate.


I was thinking of the coughers, not the cell abusers, because coughs had come up in the post I was responding to. I don't think the pathology of the cellphone noise-makers is quite the same (but it may be related).


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Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by Alan Lai
The 24 hour on-call is not even an excuse, as per your last sentence: set it to vibrate.

I actually turn my smartphone OFF during concerts. How many of the audiences do that?

I'm surprised that some members feel it's OK to have your cell phone on at all in the audience. "Vibrate" is no good either.

If you're on call or otherwise must have your phone on, don't come to the concert. (Even if it were mine.) ha
I didn't think my idea of concerts was so archaic. IMO if you absolutely need to have the phone on, you don't belong there.


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Originally Posted by bennevis
How did people survive in the era before cell phones? That is, less than two decades ago.

How did we get to the stage where people think they are so important that they have to be contactable at all times 24/7?

Some people need a reality check.....


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Originally Posted by Old Man
Originally Posted by Mark_C
IMO if you absolutely need to have the phone on, you don't belong there.

It's been 6 or 7 years since I've seen a live classical music performance, so count me as fully compliant with your wishes.

Thank you. Good for you!

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What would I do?

If I was the performer: Keep on playing.
If I was a random member in the audience: Chuckle, and keep on listening.
If it was my cell phone ringing: Wishing for a hole to open up and swallow me.

But seriously: There is only one way to listen to music without distractions: Lock yourself in a sound proof room, put on headphones, and listen to the music from a digital source. Good luck enjoying the experience.
Or if you want to make music without distractions: Buy a house without neighbors, soundproof it, turn off all doorbells and phone signals, and play. Good luck finding such a place.

What I mean to say: Music without distractions is almost impossible. In concerts, you have coughers, sneezers, phone ringers, and program rustlers. On vinyl records, you have cracks and sizzles. On CDs you have drop outs. When listening from a Walkman, iPod, smartphone or other portable device, you have the noise of the street or the train, or other people talking.

Music does not exist in a vacuum. To pretend otherwise is unhealthy in my opinion.


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Originally Posted by bennevis
How did people survive in the era before cell phones? That is, less than two decades ago.

The same way they survived in the era without pianos. That is, less than four centuries ago.

Meaning: They survived, but they did not have one thing that makes life easier or more enjoyable. Why would anybody want to live in a world without pianos or cell phones?

Oh wait - I know. People who complain about cell phones in concerts. Or neighbors who ring my doorbell and tell me my piano playing is a "terrible annoyance". These people exist, and I have to deal with it.


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I'm surprised so many see this as a black and white issue.

I doubt many performers would stop the first time a cell phone goes off if it is turned off quickly. It becomes more of a problem when one goes off several times or is not quickly turned off.

Not to imply a pianist is wrong if they choose to stop the first time a cell phone goes off. Every person has a different tolerance for interruptions. I also don't think coughs or paper rustling fall into the same category as a cell phone.

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Originally Posted by patH
Why would anybody want to live in a world without cell phones?


I would love to live in a world without cell phones. I hate having people think I should be available 24/7. I particularly hate "texters". I hate the fact that cell phones can now do everything.......except make a clear phone connection! When a cell phone rings in a concert or theatre, I dearly want to smash it with a hammer in front of the stunned owner.

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I despise cell phones ringing in concert halls as much as anyone, but would not go as far as stating that if you must have your cell phone on, you do not belong in a concert hall. We simply need to extend etiquette and courtesy to cell phone use. Unfortunately, being "reachable" is often mandated by real life circumstances and not necessarily an individual's sense of entitlement and indispensability.
I have to have my phone on at all times (nuclear code and such laugh ), but I actually ALWAYS leave it on vibe and I put it upside down in my lap and on the rare occasion that it did go off, I do my best to cover it so its screen light does not bother others. I know many people who do the same. If you have kids either alone at home or in the care of a sitter, it would be irresponsible not be reachable, but it has to be made clear that you are to be contacted only in case of emergency. In other words, you can have it both ways but you have to acquire strategies to deal with it politely, just like you learnt to roll spaghetti around your fork and cover your mouth when you cough. The problem is that people continue to be stubbornly oblivious of their phones. Going Luddite about it is not a practical solution.
As far as I am concerned, performers have the right to react the way they see fit. Losing their cool might help raise awareness and should not be held against them.

I have to say that cell phones are not the most common disturbance. Rather, people who need to comment about everything to their hard of hearing neighbors is the worse.
At a recent performance of the New York Philharmonic, an older guy behind me kept pointing out 'Ana' in the violin section to his ?wife. "Ana plays so well". "She is not playing (? Artie). Yes she is, right there. But she is not playing the solo part"... And so it went on, in a faux whispering mode. Meanwile, three amazing cellists were trying to get into Penderecki's complicated concerto grosso, and my phone rested in utter silence.

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Originally Posted by Andromaque
....I have to have my phone on at all times....

No, you don't. smile

And, I would say that for someone who does need to be so totally accessible, or nearly so, and wants to go to concerts:

Make a sacrifice. Stay in the hall only for every other piece or something like that. Be in the hall for some of the pieces, go out to the lobby or wherever when you can, check your messages and make whatever calls you might need to, go back into the hall at the next break, and so on. That means you'll only be inaccessible for 5 minutes or 10 minutes or 20 minutes or whatever at a time. Of course that would mean you'd never be able to hear a live performance of a Mahler Symphony or the Hammerklavier etc., but heck, life has its sacrifices.

BTW: That's what I do.
I won't plan to go to a concert if I know I'll be needing to be so accessible, but sometimes unexpectedly it happens. In those cases, that's exactly what I do.

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P.S. Some other venues besides concerts are apparently taking proactive measures against these things.

I mentioned this discussion to my wife, who works in a New York hospital. The hospital has a series of special presentations, sort of like "grand rounds," and people are required to show their phones being off before entering the auditorium. There are signs at the entrances that say "Cell Phones Off," and attendants who make everyone show their phones and that they're off.

I wondered if this doesn't cause congestion at the entrance. They run it in a way that it doesn't. I wondered if people rebel or show great anger over this. They don't. And remember, these are hospital personnel, mainly doctors, who you might think are some of the main people who "have to have their phones on at all times."

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Originally Posted by Andromaque
Unfortunately, being "reachable" is often mandated by real life circumstances and not necessarily an individual's sense of entitlement and indispensability.


Since you are so important, perhaps you can have the artist perform at your house or your next "occupy" function. Stay home.

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Well, that's about it for me.

I've been lurking and occasionally posting on this forum for several years, but can no longer justify the time it takes to wade through these threads when so much of it is just pompous and/or hostile hot air.

To the dwindling number who stick to being civil and constructive, I hope you'll keep it up.

Jim

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Originally Posted by Andromaque
I despise cell phones ringing in concert halls as much as anyone, but would not go as far as stating that if you must have your cell phone on, you do not belong in a concert hall. We simply need to extend etiquette and courtesy to cell phone use. Unfortunately, being "reachable" is often mandated by real life circumstances and not necessarily an individual's sense of entitlement and indispensability.
I have to have my phone on at all times (nuclear code and such laugh ), but I actually ALWAYS leave it on vibe and I put it upside down in my lap and on the rare occasion that it did go off, I do my best to cover it so its screen light does not bother others. I know many people who do the same. If you have kids either alone at home or in the care of a sitter, it would be irresponsible not be reachable, but it has to be made clear that you are to be contacted only in case of emergency. In other words, you can have it both ways but you have to acquire strategies to deal with it politely, just like you learnt to roll spaghetti around your fork and cover your mouth when you cough. The problem is that people continue to be stubbornly oblivious of their phones. Going Luddite about it is not a practical solution.
As far as I am concerned, performers have the right to react the way they see fit. Losing their cool might help raise awareness and should not be held against them.

I have to say that cell phones are not the most common disturbance. Rather, people who need to comment about everything to their hard of hearing neighbors is the worse.
At a recent performance of the New York Philharmonic, an older guy behind me kept pointing out 'Ana' in the violin section to his ?wife. "Ana plays so well". "She is not playing (? Artie). Yes she is, right there. But she is not playing the solo part"... And so it went on, in a faux whispering mode. Meanwile, three amazing cellists were trying to get into Penderecki's complicated concerto grosso, and my phone rested in utter silence.


This is completely reasonable. The only reason to object to this post is to promote an extremist viewpoint. Anyone is entitled to the view that cellphone use is excessive and abusive but it makes more sense to meet people halfway to find a workable solution. The problem is not the cellphones, it's the inconsiderate users. And people do forget, which makes clear communication and warnings prior to a concert extremely useful. If that's not enough and someone's phone is still going off then it's a clear case of douchebaggery.

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