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Hello PW. I think anrpiano nailed it.


But, a great pianist who can keep relatively still is all the more impressive to me.

Also it's not easy to subsequently control movement if you're not aware of it throughout the process. I'll catch myself taking deep breaths at the same passages each time, or more worryingly failing to breath. Must be more aware of that in future.

I am a spatial/kinesthetic learner, and back when I was in college, I often felt like never fully understood a piece of music unless I'd danced to it (and my friends and i danced to some pretty out-there music). I'll dance when I listen at home, not as much as I did when i was younger, but still it's not uncommon.

So I kind of see why some people might need to move around to connect with their deepest experience of the music. I often catch making odd and inquisitive faces while I play, when I had no idea I was doing anything of the sort, so I'm pretty sure there are people whose movements while playing began the same way.

People do tend to criticise this kind of movment though. I sometimes wonder what it must be like be a public performer who naturally understands their music via feeling it kinesthetically. You'd have to decide whether to worry about all the criticism this will forever garner you, versus remaining true to your natural mode of learning and understanding.

Could this is why Keith Jarrett and Glenn Gould are a couple of my favorite musicians? I've never thought of it from quite this angle.

peterws, I have read your post, here:

subject: what would put you off a pianist? [Re: Michael_99]

"and people who see or hear people who are "less-better" usually sit politely and say nothing but appreciate their struggle and remember the day or the time - when they were "less-better", too. (politely spoken)"

Great article you wrote there, Michael. But that last part isn`t usually true. Musicians are typically "dog eat dog" and are totally contemptious of those of lesser caliber than they see themselves to be. Which of course, isn`t what they always are. . . .but if they`re quick witted and clever, people accept them for that and forgive their other failings. To their face, that is!

Of course, nobody here is like that . . . . grin are they?

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peterws, thanks for the comments.

as always - I always travel slowly through the measures at 30 MM and at the level of pp.

Additionally, I often - politely - write between the lines - (politely spoken) ! ! ! ! !

cheers,

3B12RWS

It's in the Key of B and modulates to the Key of D.

Nice peace and nice playing.

On reflection, these extremely good and talented pianists do not stop being good simply because they have manerisms that are a bit out of the orinary. They still get bookings and still have a following. I guess at the end of the day we are going to listen to music. If we heard the same musician on the radio or on cd, we would simply enjoy the music and whatever way they play would not be relevant. When we go to hear a live performance, we see them and they play as beautifully as they do on radio or cd so you have to look beyond the manerisms and appreciate the music.

Well, I once saw a conductress in a local theatre. She was of course, conducting the smallish theatre orchestra, all amateurs/semipro.

She moved. Boy did she move!! Words fail me . . . can`t remember what I was supposed to be looking at. It happens.

All this nitpicking regarding mannerisms. - - it makes me think if those who would fault a woman for less than decorous behavior during childbirth. If you haven't been there you don't understand. And if the result is the successful delivery, of a child or a beautiful piece of music, who cares?

Well, hopefully playing piano isn't as traumatic on the body as childbirth!

All of these great piano works can be played without all the swaying and still be expressive. I have two concerns with them:

1) That their technique relies upon these extraneous movements which can mean added tension. Anything that you need to do while playing which is not a part of the actually process of pressing the key is superfluous.

2) If it is superfluous, then is is choreography to help the listener feel expression? One should be able to hear the expression, not be distracted by seeing someone flailing at the keys.

None of this is to say that these people aren't talented, expressive pianists. But if it is done by choice, I personally prefer them not to do it (and I do want to watch them play, so closing my eyes doesn't help).

I wasn't referring to affected movement made by choice but to inherent mannerisms which come naturally to some performers when they are really into the music.

The latter usually doesn't bother me, and it seems natural to them.

Here's my perspective. As a student, motion is an issue for me. Although I was self-taught when I played piano the first time round when young, so nobody told me to curve my hands or keep my arms "quiet" in the old fashioned way, I still ended up playing rather motionless. You could have put that penny on my wrists and it would have stayed. When I got back to piano I knew the physical side of piano was important, but could not get a teacher right away. Despite being careful, I got numb hands. So....

I am relearning. One of the biggest things I am learning is TO move, or rather, to allow movement. None of your joints should be locked and even a small motion that you think only involves a finger actually involves everything. If anything is locked up. it affects you. This is what I am learning about.

When I watch the video of Helene Grimaud to which I linked, I think I'm seeing a lot of this kind of release or coordination of the whole body. Even in some of what might be emotional swaying, (one in particular), there is release at the end of it. She may have a reason which is her own for doing these things.

People also feel things in different ways and for some of them it is also in their bodies. The violin counterpart of Lang Lang is Vengerov and in particular his face with exaggerated expression and those eyebrows! But if you see young Vengerov, he did this much more. It is part of who he his and how the expression of the music comes out. Would you rather that these musicians freeze everything, sit comparatively like statues, and for the music to no longer come out?

If it is actual "showmanship" in poor taste in order to sway the audience with your swaying - ok yes, I don't like that either (and it's insulting in a way). In fact, I was not bothered by anything that Helene Grimaud did at least in the video that I found. It seemed graceful and sometimes she was sitting quite still. I enjoyed what I heard, which matters the most I'd think.

It is also interesting to watch, before the piano part starts, the body movement of the violinists in the orchestra.