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ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, CP209, CE220, yamaha, korg ..?
#2060851 04/07/13 03:26 PM
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Can somebody continue on the work of this guy? At least with a grid and graph like this, it makes the job much easier in being able to identify the models:

http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/2052582/Re:%20Does%20anyone%20drive%20Ivory%20II.html#Post2052582

What's the difference between these models? I do know that the MP6 is a stage piano and that it doesn't come with any speakers.

I went here:
http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/2052582/Re:%20Does%20anyone%20drive%20Ivory%20II.html#Post2052582

and

http://www.kawaius.com/main_links/digital/09_dpmain.html
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uYTP0rLEoU
and
http://azpianonews.blogspot.com/2011/01/kawai-mp6-digital-piano-awesome-piano.html

What I want is primarily the sound first and then touch. How would you rank these and what are their prices (after getting good speakers for the MP6 with stand and peddle.)

I see that the CA95 is a notch up from the CA65

My budget is around max $2000, or slightly above, or below..

I don't know which is better to be honest, even after reading the reviews is this is why I'd like to see a chart of what the guy started off with. Though I'm not a piano player, I believe I have good ears for music and picky. I did hear from the youtube link above that one player prefers the touch of the MP6 over the MP10 as he found the MP10 to be a little soggy, plus it costs more? But I've read about the keys breaking in the MP6?

My kid will be playing classical piano. I want a piano where she won't outgrow, basically, we're only going to buy one piano and that's it. I'm thinking of getting rid of the AP-620 and start all over again. I'm researching this for myself and for a friend.

What about the Yamaha and other brands?

Can somebody give me a ranking of some of the important attributes?

Right now, I'm confused between the ES7 vs. MP6 and CA95, then again, I don't know anything about the Yamaha and Korg models.
The Yamaha sounds yummy and the Korg sounds like a steinway?

Thanks.

Last edited by pianoworldanon; 04/07/13 06:32 PM. Reason: added cp209
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Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, yamaha, korg ..?
pianoworldanon #2060858 04/07/13 03:44 PM
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ES7 uses one of Kawai's latest 3-sensor plastic actions. It has their proprietary PHI sound engine (with improved resonance) - which means it is a mid-ranking Kawai sample set. It has 256-note polyphony (which is ample).

MP6 has essentially the same action as the ES7, but with 2 sensors, making it slightly less capable when fast note repetitions are required. It has the same basic sound engine as the ES7, but with older resonance technology. It has 192-note polyphony (still ample). The MP6 is also designed to be a MIDI controller, and has more sounds available than the ES7. It is essentially designed as a stage piano.

The CA65/CA95 share Kawai's latest and greatest sample set that utilizes more memory than the MP6/ES7. It should therefore be more expressive and more dynamic. It also has a superior wooden action. You would need to check the prices paid thread to see what the going rate is for these two.


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Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, yamaha, korg ..?
voxpops #2060863 04/07/13 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by voxpops
ES7 uses one of Kawai's latest 3-sensor plastic actions. It has their proprietary PHI sound engine (with improved resonance) - which means it is a mid-ranking Kawai sample set. It has 256-note polyphony (which is ample).

MP6 has essentially the same action as the ES7, but with 2 sensors, making it slightly less capable when fast note repetitions are required. It has the same basic sound engine as the ES7, but with older resonance technology. It has 192-note polyphony (still ample). The MP6 is also designed to be a MIDI controller, and has more sounds available than the ES7. It is essentially designed as a stage piano.

The CA65/CA95 share Kawai's latest and greatest sample set that utilizes more memory than the MP6/ES7. It should therefore be more expressive and more dynamic. It also has a superior wooden action. You would need to check the prices paid thread to see what the going rate is for these two.


Where does the CE220 fit in? Is the CA95 wood action superior to the 3 sensor plastic action of the ES7? Just making sure..

Thanks.

Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, yamaha, korg ..?
pianoworldanon #2060870 04/07/13 04:11 PM
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The CE220 is a lower cost |and therefore specification) version of the CA series. Think of it as a CN33, but with the older AWA Grand Pro II wooden key action.

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, yamaha, korg ..?
Kawai James #2060888 04/07/13 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
The CE220 is a lower cost |and therefore specification) version of the CA series. Think of it as a CN33, but with the older AWA Grand Pro II wooden key action.

Cheers,
James
x


How many sensor does the CE220 have? And I don't even know how to compare the CN33, CN34 to the above... and what about the sound compared to the CA95?

Last edited by pianoworldanon; 04/07/13 04:34 PM.
Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, yamaha, korg ..?
pianoworldanon #2060971 04/07/13 06:29 PM
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CE220's keyboard action is of the older, two-sensor variety.

The CN34 is a more modern version of the CN33, with a three-sensor keyboard action and more powerful tone generator. However, the core piano samples are largely the same.

The CA95's tone generator and 'XL' (extra long) piano samples utilise more memory and are therefore more expressive than that of the CE220.

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, CP209, yamaha, korg ..?
Kawai James #2060980 04/07/13 06:49 PM
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James,

What about the CP209 -- I assume this is the best from Kawai and how does it compare to the CA95? If you had all the money in the world and just wanted only sound and touch, which would you like as a gift assuming both are upright pianos (which isn't the case).

I ask this question because the CP209 seems to use the older hammer while the CA95 uses the newest wood type, Grand Feel. Is the Grand feel better? Well, better in terms of classical.

Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, CP209, yamaha, korg ..?
pianoworldanon #2061029 04/07/13 08:43 PM
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The CP209 is a very impressive instrument, both in terms of functionality and appearance. However, for 'pure piano', the CA95 is superior, as it offers more expressive piano sounds, higher quality effects, reverb, and resonances, and a more advanced keyboard action.

To summarise the Kawai wooden key actions, the order of realism is:

Grand Feel > RM3 Grand II > RM3 Grand > AWA Grand Pro

Kind regards,
James
x

Last edited by Kawai James; 04/07/13 09:56 PM. Reason: AHA --> AWA

Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, CP209, yamaha, korg ..?
Kawai James #2061056 04/07/13 09:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Grand Feel > RM3 Grand II > RM3 Grand > AHA Grand Pro


Did you mean AWA Grand Pro II for this last one?

If not, I guess I'd have to say one can pretty much unambiguously compare the wood actions, but if by this last one you are referring to RHII or AHAIV, I've heard people who prefer the plastic, so it's not clear.

Last edited by gvfarns; 04/07/13 09:51 PM.
Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, CP209, yamaha, korg ..?
pianoworldanon #2061059 04/07/13 09:55 PM
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Yep, well spotted...I'll fix it now. wink

I guess that makes us even, huh? wink

James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, CP209, yamaha, korg ..?
Kawai James #2159513 09/29/13 06:41 AM
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"However, the core piano samples are largely the same."

Kawai James, I have two questions for you:

1)
Are you saying that the CN33, CN34, ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, and CP209 and sampled from the same grand piano?

2)
How do you compare ES7 vs. the MP6 in terms of sound and touch , feature set, and use let's say by the most advance player in the world? (i don't play).

Here's what's quoted:

ES7 compared to MP6, here's what one reviewer says: "Kawai also produces the MP6 portable pro piano which I have reviewed and highly recommend, and in some ways the MP6 is more flexible and more capable than the ES7 as far as instrument sounds and control is concerned. " Please give some detail because a friend is looking for a piano. Person is going to buy one piano, and won't be upgrading.

3) what's the difference between the MP vs. ES line in terms of "use?" I won't be looking at the MP10 though.


Thanks.

Last edited by pianoworldanon; 09/29/13 06:43 AM.
Re: ES7, MP6, CA95, CA65, CP209, yamaha, korg ..?
pianoworldanon #2159583 09/29/13 09:53 AM
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pianoworldanon:

1) The core 'Concert Grand' sound in all of the models you listed is based on the audio data, recorded from a Kawai EX grand piano. However, there will be a difference in expressiveness depending on the sound technology employed (PHI, UPHI, HI-XL).

2) ES7 is superior to the MP6 in terms of touch and sound. The MP6 is superior in terms of controller features and functionality. The 'most advanced player in the world' depends on the style of music, and type of playing.

3) Again, ES7 is intended as a 'portable piano', with great touch and sound (including built-in speakers), while the MP6 is intended as a 'stage piano' - still great touch and sound, but an emphasis on controller functions (no built-in speakers).

For more information, please take a look at the relevant owner's manuals and brochures at the link below:

http://www.kawai.co.jp/worldwide/support/manuals.html
http://www.kawai.co.jp/worldwide/support/catalogue.html

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019

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