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Since 2008 my son has been playing on the Yamaha U1 EP #A3901056 which we bought in 2008 and he is Intermediate E level now. In the Seattle area there is only one good piano store to buy from, Classic Pianos, and the only one he liked there was the Schimmel K169 5'7" new $43k which we can't afford. Other options there were used Yamaha C5 and C3 at $26K but my son didn't care for the key weight and his teacher doesn't like Yamaha. Teacher has a Boston 7 ft.that my son takes lessons on.
Sherman Clay, a Steinway dealer, is going out of business after 140 years and this is last 2 days to buy before their lease runs out. My son really liked the PE Boston GP163EP serial 176524 they are quoting me $18,581.31plus tax and delivery and $2000 for our Yamaha U1 trade-in. I have reservations about buying a piano that everyone seemed to pass up but my son who is decerning really fell in love with it. Questions: 1) Is this Boston serial 176524 a 2013,? (Note they are selling new with 10 Steinway warranty included) what do manufacturer warranties cover and are they easy to call in? 2)a Trade-in Yamaha U1 EP # A3901056 for $2000 is fair price? 3) is this a good price for the Boston since the store is going out of business? 4) Is this a good choice for a 13-yr-old boy and Intermediate E to learn how to draw out dynamics and ring his playing to next level 5) His teacher might not have tried this particular piano and I wonder if I should drag him back in or just go with my son's ear, who now has probably tried 40 pianos and played in 3 stores for 2.5 hours
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Hello dfwtexas,
The answers to almost all of your questions are in the Piano Buyer which is linked to this page on the right. Here's my short take:
1. It doesn't matter - that's the most current version of the model and it's being sold as a new piano with a new piano warranty from the manufacturer. Warranties cover problems in materials and labor, but not tuning/voicing/regulation (normal wear/personal preference items). An owner rarely "calls in" for warranty service - your servicing technician does this if it's ever needed (and that's rare). 2. If that piano is from the mid-1980's, (you don't mention the age, but I'm guessing based on the serial number) yes, that seems fair as a trade in. You might be able to sell it easily yourself for slightly more, as the U1 is a very popular new and used piano and you live in a major metro. 3. Looking at the pricing guide in the Piano Buyer, it's about 27% off the SMP pricing. A good deal, but not a screaming bargain for a "going out of business sale". 4. Yes it's an okay choice for an intermediate student. I have no idea what "Intermediate E" means, though (these terms aren't standardized in the US in any meaningful way). A longer length piano might have a more pleasant tone and better dynamic range, though. On balance, a 5'3" grand was all I needed as a practice tool to get into some good schools for college, though it had limitations. 5. I'm happy to try instruments for students and teachers where I live, but my time is limited. Consider paying your teacher for their time (or bribe them with a nice meal) if you've been bugging them with many requests to "try out a piano" for your son.
It's likely the last piano you're going to buy - be sure you're happy with your decision. Were the prices you were being quoted on the other pianos the "tag" price, or a real "out the door" price? Classic Pianos has a good reputation, but I'm sure there are more than 2 dealers in your area to try instruments (if you're willing to spend a little time), and look at the classifieds here, pianomart, and elsewhere for a younger used grand piano within your budget.
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Hi Dallas,
Have you done any negotiating? You are a little boxed in due to the closing of that location.
I'm a little unsure of the price they gave you. Is it ~$18.5K minus $2K coming to a sale price of $16.5K? If so, that is a good price for the piano. I would try to get the delivery of the new piano, and pick-up of the used, included in the price.
I would guess that you have checked out the prices at Dallas Steinway Hall and know that this model usually goes for a considerably higher price.
Steinway is very responsive to warranty requests, so that is not a problem. The warranty covers the major components, but doesn't cover such things like a squeaky pedal or stuck key, and certainly not tuning. Usually the dealer will attend to these minor adjustments as a part of good customer service. In your case, you would have to pay out-of-pocket, but these sorts of things are very minor and not at all unusual in a new piano.
I don't have a SN listing for the very recently built pianos, but I wouldn't worry about it too much. It is not unusual for a given piano to be on the showroom floor for over a year. In fact, it's a plus that the piano has had a little settling-in and play-in time.
As far a others passing on that particular piano, don't worry about it. Other buyers were simply shopping for something else. We non-Texans assume that "bigger is always better" in the Lone Star State!
There is nothing wrong with asking your son's teacher to give it a playing. That additional audition could give you peace of mind.
Congratulations! Having an eager young pianist in the house is a great thing and I commend you for providing the proper tool for his studies.
Marty in Minnesota
It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
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Marty,
I think our OP is in the Pacific Northwest now despite the profile name. They mentioned Seattle and Classic Piano is in Bellvue WA.
Kurt
********************************************************************************************************** Co-owner (by marriage) and part time customer service rep at an electronic musical equipment repair shop.
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This sounds like a good deal overall-- your son loves it, you don't have to worry about selling your piano, and the price seems quite reasonable for a new PE Boston. I'd go for it if I were in your shoes before someone else does.
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Oops - I should have caught that.
Same reasoning applies, however.
Thanks for the catch!
Marty in Minnesota
It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
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I thought that you don't get discounts on Steinway/Boston/Essex very often, and that SMP = MSRP = what you usually pay for a new "Steinway" piano.
Am I wrong about this?
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Hi Joe,
There is usually a little more wiggle room with Boston and Essex, but it is usually not as great as other brands.
In this case, the store is going out of business and that becomes a major factor.
Marty in Minnesota
It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
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Since 2008 my son has been playing on the Yamaha U1 EP #A3901056 which we bought in 2008 and he is Intermediate E level now. In the Seattle area there is only one good piano store to buy from, Classic Pianos, and the only one he liked there was the Schimmel K169 5'7" new $43k which we can't afford. Other options there were used Yamaha C5 and C3 at $26K but my son didn't care for the key weight and his teacher doesn't like Yamaha. Teacher has a Boston 7 ft.that my son takes lessons on.
Sherman Clay, a Steinway dealer, is going out of business after 140 years and this is last 2 days to buy before their lease runs out. My son really liked the PE Boston GP163EP serial 176524 they are quoting me $18,581.31plus tax and delivery and $2000 for our Yamaha U1 trade-in. I have reservations about buying a piano that everyone seemed to pass up but my son who is decerning really fell in love with it. Questions: 1) Is this Boston serial 176524 a 2013,? (Note they are selling new with 10 Steinway warranty included) what do manufacturer warranties cover and are they easy to call in? 2)a Trade-in Yamaha U1 EP # A3901056 for $2000 is fair price? 3) is this a good price for the Boston since the store is going out of business? 4) Is this a good choice for a 13-yr-old boy and Intermediate E to learn how to draw out dynamics and ring his playing to next level 5) His teacher might not have tried this particular piano and I wonder if I should drag him back in or just go with my son's ear, who now has probably tried 40 pianos and played in 3 stores for 2.5 hours An important note: no piano on the planet will "bring his playing to the next level" Only hard work and study with a good teacher can do that. I've heard some really awesome pianists that practiced on junk. However a better piano can be inspiring, and yes it can ease his learning how to play good pianos well (voicing, etc.). It also shows your support for his learning. So I'd say buy him a better piano, but be realistic about what a better piano accomplishes. I don't like Boston pianos very much, but I've only played a few. If your son likes this one, the price sounds ok. I would suggest having the teacher play the piano if possible.
Pianist and Piano Teacher
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If I were you I would go to the local Kawai dealer, who apparently is Prosser Piano and Organ, and I would look at a Kawai RX-2
If you/he likes it, you should be able to purchase it for very little additional $ versus the Boston, which is, after all, manufactured by Kawai.
I like the Bostons ok - but personally I feel the Kawai action is far superior.
And they are normally a far better value, although the Boston is on special as the store is closing, which makes it a bit less expensive than it would otherwise be.
Just my 2 cents worth - to a fellow ex-Texan
Amateur Pianist and raconteur.
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musicpassion,
"to learn how to draw out dynamics and bring his playing to next level" is a totally different concept than what you quoted. It is a very valid concept, in fact.
Marty in Minnesota
It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
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I skipped over most of the replies so that I could answer you promptly. Yes, it's a good price. One of my students just bought (about 6 weeks ago) a non-PE, same size, for roughly the same price, and it's delightful. A perfect fit for their smaller room.
Remember, you're buying a musical instrument, which is a highly subjective purchase, not an automobile where conformity is the name of the game.
BTW, I rather like Ben's attitude towards helping customers - he's always been fair with my students and me. If you want to quibble over $$, then you'll end up missing out on an instrument which will make your family very happy. If you like what you hear, buy it. If you have any doubts about the sound it produces, skip it.
"Those who dare to teach must never cease to learn." -- Richard Henry Dann Full-time Private Piano Teacher offering Piano Lessons in Olympia, WA. www.mypianoteacher.com Certified by the American College of Musicians; member NGPT, MTNA, WSMTA, OMTA
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Hi Joe,
There is usually a little more wiggle room with Boston and Essex, but it is usually not as great as other brands.
In this case, the store is going out of business and that becomes a major factor. Marty, I'm not certain this is entirely the case with S&S dealers. I know that the Seattle store received most of the left over inventory of the Phoenix store, and I suspect that rather than over-discount, they have agreements to ship to the non-sold instruments to the Spokane S&S dealership. Also, S&S isn't going to let Seattle sit long without a dealership, so they may just warehouse unsold instruments until they open a new store.
"Those who dare to teach must never cease to learn." -- Richard Henry Dann Full-time Private Piano Teacher offering Piano Lessons in Olympia, WA. www.mypianoteacher.com Certified by the American College of Musicians; member NGPT, MTNA, WSMTA, OMTA
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Hi John,
I was speaking in general terms to answer a posted question, rather than to the specifics of this available Boston. Steinway is very stingy with discounts on the S&S brand. But, as I said, there is usually a little room on the Bostons and Essexs, but certainly never like the discounts from SMP as indicated by Fine on other brands.
I agree with you, this is a very good price for the piano as I indicated in my first reply.
Are you reading the postings in reverse order?
Marty in Minnesota
It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
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Hi Marty,
No, I came across the thread this afternoon and thought that as time is of the essence, a quick reply after scanning some of the answers was more important than studying every detail. I'd hate to see someone miss out on a really fine instrument because several of us began nitpicking over whether this was the best discount possible.
Don't know how familiar you are with Seattle, but Sherman & Clay is situated on prime real estate in the city center. They are on the NW corner of the Westlake Center, a huge shopping complex in the city center, and which is also the northern terminus of the rail link coming from the airport and the southern terminus of the monorail. A few blocks from the warf. Whenever you see Seattle on the news, the photographers are just a short half block away at the Starbucks. The building owner wanted to raise rent, substantially, I'm told, and frankly Sherman Clay really didn't need all four floors it had under lease. There is a new luxury condo tower built just a block to the north, and my suspicion is that the current owner of the SC building wants to either rebuild or sell to a perspective client.
The point being that this "going out of business" sale, while true for SC may be driven by forces unknown and while quibbling over a price, a great opportunity for the OP may be lost.
Regards,
John
"Those who dare to teach must never cease to learn." -- Richard Henry Dann Full-time Private Piano Teacher offering Piano Lessons in Olympia, WA. www.mypianoteacher.com Certified by the American College of Musicians; member NGPT, MTNA, WSMTA, OMTA
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John
I was told that Sherman Clay's parent company owns the building.
Small world.
Amateur Pianist and raconteur.
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Just a few facts...
Sherman Clay does not own the Seattle building; they sold it quite some time ago....
The serial number in question - - this is a 2013 piano. Also, it would come with a full factory warranty.
For reference, New York retail on that model is $25,300.
No remaining inventory - if there is any - will be going to Spokane.
Yes, we are committed to Seattle - and will be very well represented there soon. Stay tuned.
Bob Snyder Senior District Manager Steinway & Sons rsnyder@steinway.com www.steinway.com
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Thanks. I only wish I could get one of my families off their collective duffs and get up there and grab that instrument. It would be perfect for their two children who are advancing quite nicely. Well, some folks, when opportunity comes knocking, slam the door in its face.
"Those who dare to teach must never cease to learn." -- Richard Henry Dann Full-time Private Piano Teacher offering Piano Lessons in Olympia, WA. www.mypianoteacher.com Certified by the American College of Musicians; member NGPT, MTNA, WSMTA, OMTA
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musicpassion,
"to learn how to draw out dynamics and bring his playing to next level" is a totally different concept than what you quoted. It is a very valid concept, in fact. Marty, I understood the statement to mean the OP was both looking for better dynamic control and also bringing his playing to the next level. I agree the grand will help dynamic control. That can be part of bringing his playing to the next level. But there's no substitute for hard work.
Pianist and Piano Teacher
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The Boston GP-163 in my opinion, whilst only 5'4" in length is a beautiful piano. Yes, like the the others, I agree with a slightly larger piano you'd get slightly better tonal quality and dynamic range but the Boston is a well-rounded piano and I believe will last your son for many years to come.
On the price side of things, including the part ex. for your Yamaha, I think that you've found yourself a rather reasonable deal here.
The Boston pianos do sometimes seem to get a lot of stick and many people consider them solely as 'ok' pianos, but I feel they're more than just that. Whilst being made by Kawai, I prefer Bostons, mainly for their sweeter, more mellow tone than what I feel the Kawais portray - this is just my opinion however.
All the best in the piano search.
If you go with the Boston, you've chosen a very good piano which will last you a long time.
Current: Yamaha AvantGrand NU1X Previous: Venables & Son Academy-168, Kawai K-15 E and Yamaha Clavinova CVP-208
"Insurance broker by day, classically trained pianist by... well, when I'm not working!"
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