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Don't delay too much on the Mozart ...
The Chopin Nocturne Opus 27/2 is a knockout.

I'm getting tired of hearing about this. If you don't go out and buy it. I'll go out and buy a reconditioned yamaha upright myself. Where I'll find one? How I'll get it up three flights of stairs to my apartment? That's irrelevant! All that's important is; if you don't buy it, I will!


OH Lord! Won't you buy me a reconditioned Yamaha upright.
My friends all play digitals. I must make amends.
Worked hard all my lifetime. No help from my friends.
So Oh Lord! Won't you buy me a reconditioned Yamaha upright.

LOL! No worries Ron, that's what I will probably do

I'm just trying to be a tad more sensible than I usually am. Tomorrow I will go to my local official Yamaha dealer so I can at least listen to a few more U1's.

If you love it, get a tech to check it out and get it! I have a used Steinway console and I love it. I was really nervous when I first found it, but the independent tech who checked it out told me it was basically brand new since it hadn't been played much but had been kept up well, had all the original parts, etc. I got a really great piano at a really good price as a result.

I also live in an apartment/duplex and share a wall with my neighbors, so I understand your worries on that front. My neighbors actually seem to have enjoyed the sound and give me lots of compliments! Just be cognizant of not playing late at night, too early in the morning, etc. We're actually getting new neighbors soon so I hope they'll feel the same way about it.

Hi sinophilia,

I just purchased a used Yamaha upright this weekend (here in Canada) -- and by coincidence, I'm exactly at the "Fur Elise" level, studying it as part of the Canadian RCM Grade 7 requirements. I've been using an older Roland digital keyboard and I feel that I'm at a stage where not practicing on a real acoustic piano is starting to negatively affect my playing.

From my research, the W-series were very good pianos, comparable to upgraded U-series pianos. The ones you're looking at were likely sold in the Japanese market, before being resold as used, then reconditioned by a used piano dealer/broker (probably not by Yamaha or their subcontractor) -- and then shipped to Europe where used pianos fetch higher prices as compared to in Japan.

Reconditioning can mean many things, from small repairs to a full rebuild. As others have mentioned, only a check by an independent technician can confirm the true condition of a piano.

About the sound, just be aware that the acoustics at the piano shop will be different from the acoustics of your apartment. Often, pianos will sound brighter in apartments. Another consideration is the size of the room at your country house vs. your apartment. A piano that might seem "too big" for an apartment might be "too small" for a larger room.

On tuning stability -- other than the condition of the piano, the biggest factor affecting tuning (and the overall health of the piano) is humidity. For example, if the humidity in your area fluctuates a lot between summer and winter, then you will probably need to tune the piano twice a year for the best performance. Where I live, the air gets really dry here in the winter, so I will have to put a humidifier nearby my piano.

It seems like you've found a piano you really like. I would agree with Anne H above... have it checked out and get it!

I have to make a confession: I did not have an independent technician check the piano I just bought. Yes, I gather that is considered a mortal sin by pianoworld standards. I did look up the serial number (mine is a 1997), played on it for awhile, and did some cursory checks myself (everything looked pristine to me, especially being a ~15 year old piano instead of a ~30 year old one). The dealer also has a good reputation and provided a 10-year warranty.

My search began with used U1s, then to U3s, then the one I finally purchased is a U300SX (basically a U3 Silent). Used Yamaha Silents are hard to find here, so that was one reason why I quickly "closed the deal" once I saw the piano I wanted.

Sorry for the long winded response and good luck with your piano search!

One note from my experience - if you do really love it and it's truly in good condition then you may have to make a quick decision or risk losing out. After I bought mine, I found out that they had already sold three others in similar condition in less than 24 hours after they were brought in. I'm glad I made up my mind so fast, or I wouldn't have gotten it.

Thank you Anne and peekay.

Yes, I'm a bit worried that this piano might find another buyer very quickly, so I plan to go back to the store by the end of the week to have another look at it, and possibly give them a deposit. If they already sold it, well then it wasn't meant to be!

About the independent technician - I must admit I don't think it's absolutely necessary for such a small expense, and with the 5-year warranty and buy back option and all. But yes, it might spare me trouble. I contacted a company that offers this consultancy service and they'll tell me how much it would cost me. I've never owned an acoustic piano before, so I don't have "my technician" yet.

Sino, it's exciting that you are smitten by this piano!

It is! Now I must go back and play it again to make sure it wasn't just a fleeting impression!

Today I played more pianos at the official Yamaha dealer, including an old UX3 and a brand new U1. The UX3 was nice, with beautiful bass and a warm tone... but it's from 1979 and they ask 4,500 euro for it! The weird thing is, the salesman underlined the fact that his pianos are OLD, not reconditioned. He meant that as a good thing, because in his opinion reconditioned pianos may have been rebuilt with parts that are not from Yamaha. This makes sense, but I can't help thinking that a 34-year-old upright with all its original parts is more likely to need some fixing in the next few years. Still, they provide a 10-year warranty on that old UX3, so they clearly believe that it will last. What can I say, there are as many opinions as there are sellers!

At the end of my afternoon I also tried a Celviano AP-450. At least I'm sure of one thing now: I won't buy another digital!

I'm starting to have more respect for older pianos that haven't been reconditioned now that I've talked to my tuner about them. It sounds like it's really dependent on what kind of use they've gotten and what sort of climate controlled environment that they've been stored in. For instance, my tuner says that he works on a Steinway grand in my neck of the woods that is 105 years old and hasn't even gotten close to needing a part replaced!

Well, I do find that hard to believe, and it's probably an exception. Plus, I'm sure it wasn't the lowest end model of Steinway piano, which means it has top-notch quality in it. Not saying Yamaha in chintzy, but an upright, even high-end, won't have the highest quality materials.

Since the OP is looking at uprights, I would be very concerned with buying OLD just as much as buying reconditioned. Either way, I'd have a tech look at it, because they are pros and know what to look for.

I'll confess, I'm looking forward to hearing this piano (or another upright, eventually) in a future recital, so I'm completely biased towards you buying an acoustic to replace your digital.

I'm also wondering -- given that this is "such a small expense", might you have cash to spare to send my way towards refurbishment of "Mabel"?

I totally agree. I think a tech is always helpful, as it can be hard to tell the junk from the gems. I love my older piano, but I definitely did my due diligence before I bought it.

Fine, send your Paypal address!

It's small compared to what most people spend for pianos

oh no, I will have to buy a microphone! I was having the time of my life with MIDI recordings!

btw, I'm going back to the store tomorrow... maybe I can get a discount for my imminent birthday

Be careful!! I heard a professional jazz pianist say that he and his friends (also pros) got tendonitis playing Casios and I'm pretty sure that I did. I've read that this is a risk you face playing exclusively on many DP's. If you don't need to play the DP much, it probably wouldn't be problem, but if you do, then I agree with NMaple, you might want to consider the VCP1.

Okay, there's no way I can keep my mouth shut until it actually gets into my house, so here it is... I own an acoustic

Yesterday I spent the whole afternoon in Treviso trying the piano I liked and chatting with the store owner, who is a piano teacher at the local conservatory and couldn't stop telling stories about music and musicians. He even took us for a quick tour of the city center.

We looked inside the piano. They don't know what was done to it before it left Japan, but it's clear that all felt parts are brand new. It has new underfelted U1 hammers. The action is perfectly even; the keys are noticeably lighter where the strings have no dampers, or with the damper pedal pressed, but I checked this on several other uprights and they are all the same. I can somehow play pianissimo - although I can see that it will take me some time to adjust my touch. The outside is not 100% perfect - a few tiny scratches here and there and a couple of polished spots around the Yamaha logo and the lock on an otherwise satin finish, but I can live with it. I managed to get the price down by 400 euro, so it's about the same price as an ordinary U1. A tuner will be present to check on the piano after delivery, even though they swear the tuning won't move a bit.

In the end, I didn't bring a technician. I decided to trust this people, that's all. I called a cousin of mine who is an organist and piano teacher in Padua and she said good things of this store. If something goes wrong, feel free to say "We told you!"

Lovely piano, congratulations Sinophilia.

Congratulations! You will soon discovered what all former digital players discover. The difference is beyond day and night.

Congrats Diana...

I think you did good.

EDIT: Microphone? A good ole SM57. You'd be impressed how good they do with a good pre-amp. A pair for stereo.
Definitely think about experimenting with the distance from the wall for sound quality. Or even sound treatment of the wall. That wall will effect the sound quality greatly.