Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
What's Hot!!
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
(125ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Piano Buyer Guide
Piano Buyer Fall 2017
Who's Online Now
105 registered members (BachToTheFuture, anamnesis, Agent88, Anita Potter, Alexander Borro, 29 invisible), 1,766 guests, and 2 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#2141649 - 08/31/13 02:13 AM jazzification of classical music  
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,334
Michael Sayers Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Michael Sayers  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,334
Stockholms län, Sverige
Hi Everyone,

The subject of jazz pianists came up in another post and I am interested to know what other members think of the efforts originating with pianist Jacques Loussier such as:

J.S. Bach - Air on the G String
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14AhD3xdoMk

Chopin - Nocturnes Op. 9
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVTR-9HyjPA

And also involving other pianists, such as the first 12 minutes of this Dave Brubeck Quartet link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBCUaQeDPGg


M.


(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#2141660 - 08/31/13 03:13 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,393
Bobpickle Offline

Gold Supporter until July 10  2014
Bobpickle  Offline

Gold Supporter until July 10  2014


Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,393
Cameron Park, California
I can't comment much on Loussier himself not having been familiar with him before you brought him up, but the efforts to "modernize," or improvise over, works of the past (as well as those of the present) didn't originate with Jacques Loussier. I remember reading once about a journalist who gave a concert Liszt once gave a rave review, mentioning in one part how he (Liszt) embellished - on-the-spot - a piece of Handel's with the "most beautiful harmonies". A good short summary of the great composers' experiences with improvisation can be read here: http://ericbarnhill.wordpress.com/facts-about-improvisation/


"[The trick to life isn't] just about living forever. The trick is still living with yourself forever."
#2141677 - 08/31/13 05:33 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,931
wr Offline
8000 Post Club Member
wr  Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,931
Loussier usually seems tasteful and intelligent enough to me not to be outright offensive. As jazz, it's a little too unadventurous to get me very interested, though.

I'm not sure how to explain why, but jazzing up classical music always seems to have a kitschy aura about it. Sometimes that bothers me; other times, not so much.







#2141695 - 08/31/13 06:42 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: wr]  
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 9,726
bennevis Offline
9000 Post Club Member
bennevis  Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 9,726
In principle, I don't have a problem with jazzers jazzing up classical tunes - after all, few jazzers come up with decent original tunes of their own wink .

But if you're going to jazz a classical tune up, do it whole-heartedly, like Leszek Mozdzer did with Chopin, and (in parts) Uri Caine with Bach and Mahler. Loussier's often saccharine treatment is just ladling extra sugary syrup on something that cannot withstand such treatment - his Air on a G string is especially nauseating....


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
(ad ) MusicNotes.com
sheet music search
#2141752 - 08/31/13 09:38 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: wr]  
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,906
laguna_greg Offline
1000 Post Club Member
laguna_greg  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,906
guess where in CA and WA
Originally Posted by wr


I'm not sure how to explain why, but jazzing up classical music always seems to have a kitschy aura about it. Sometimes that bothers me; other times, not so much.




I think it can work very well in Bach, if it's done right. The arrangements by the Swingle Singers are among my favorite listening. Jazzers have been doing that since the 1930s I believe.

But for other composers, and especially Chopin, I don't think it works well at all.


Laguna Greg

1919 Mason & Hamlin AA
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/greg-dempster/34/325/6b9/ (my day job)
#2141772 - 08/31/13 10:20 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 398
Music Me Offline
Full Member
Music Me  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 398
PA
You either like it, or you don't. If anything, braiding two genres together can get young or new listeners to become interested in listening to either genre extensively. I will agree that it works well with some compositions and not others.

I credit The Modern Jazz Quartet's "Blues on Bach" with sparking my interest in Bach, along with "Switched on Bach" (performed on a Moog Synthesizer). Give a listen. It may surprise you. I still listen to both.



Barbara
...without music, no life...
#2141773 - 08/31/13 10:24 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,629
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Damon  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,629
Here was a fun bit that was posted in the forums awhile back.


#2141779 - 08/31/13 10:33 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Music Me]  
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,906
laguna_greg Offline
1000 Post Club Member
laguna_greg  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,906
guess where in CA and WA
Barbara,

Switched on Bach was the first classical album I ever listened to as a kid. I still love it.

Thank you for reminding me!


Laguna Greg

1919 Mason & Hamlin AA
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/greg-dempster/34/325/6b9/ (my day job)
#2141781 - 08/31/13 10:38 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,837
Kreisler Offline
Kreisler  Offline


Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,837
Iowa City, IA
I tend to like jazz versions of things if done well. I have several Loussier and Bolling albums that I like, and I've played some Bolling as well. Art Tatum's Dvorak is also amazing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYcZGPLAnHA

On the flip side, I'm also a big fan of the classified Beatles albums by John Bayless.

And the rock/electronica versions of Mussorgsky and Holst by Emerson Lake and Palmer.

And Wendy Carlos and Don Dorsey's electronic treatments of Bach.


"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

www.pianoped.com
www.youtube.com/user/UIPianoPed
#2141783 - 08/31/13 10:42 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Kreisler]  
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,629
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Damon  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,629
Originally Posted by Kreisler

On the flip side, I'm also a big fan of the classified Beatles albums by John Bayless.

And the rock/electronica versions of Mussorgsky and Holst by Emerson Lake and Palmer.

And Wendy Carlos and Don Dorsey's electronic treatments of Bach.


No Tomita?!

#2141784 - 08/31/13 10:46 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,837
Kreisler Offline
Kreisler  Offline


Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,837
Iowa City, IA
ACK! Can't believe I forgot TOMITA!

Yeah, I went through a big electronic phase in high school. Jean-Michel Jarre, The Art of Noise, Laurie Anderson, Kraftwerk, etc...


"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

www.pianoped.com
www.youtube.com/user/UIPianoPed
#2141801 - 08/31/13 11:19 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 219
Derek Hartwell Offline
Full Member
Derek Hartwell  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 219
United Kingdom
Originally Posted by Michael Sayers
Hi Everyone,

The subject of jazz pianists came up in another post and I am interested to know what other members think of the efforts originating with pianist Jacques Loussier such as:

J.S. Bach - Air on the G String
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14AhD3xdoMk

Chopin - Nocturnes Op. 9
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVTR...tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBCUaQeDPGg


M.



I like all of these and no longer have a problem with the mixture of classical music with the jazz idiom. Isn't this what is now known as 'classical crossover'?

rk


Music Teacher (Piano/Theory/Musicianship)
#2141803 - 08/31/13 11:22 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: wr]  
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,169
beet31425 Offline
4000 Post Club Member
beet31425  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,169
Bay Area, CA
Originally Posted by wr
As jazz, it's a little too unadventurous to get me very interested, though.

Exactly! And my problem with a lot of jazz generally. It seems so unadventurous these days!

The best jazzified piece I ever heard was a version of Chopin's op.25/4 etude. It started normal, and kept launching into super-fast stride piano. If you think how that etude goes, you can almost imagine it.

-J


Beethoven op.110, Chopin op.27/2, Liszt Vallée d'Obermann
#2141811 - 08/31/13 11:37 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Kreisler]  
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,334
Michael Sayers Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Michael Sayers  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,334
Stockholms län, Sverige
Originally Posted by Kreisler
ACK! Can't believe I forgot TOMITA!

Yeah, I went through a big electronic phase in high school. Jean-Michel Jarre, The Art of Noise, Laurie Anderson, Kraftwerk, etc...


Any thoughts on Vangelis, such as with this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGl3041zhAU

I found this interview with Vangelis on Al Jazeera from January of last year to be quite interesting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5K0kiYSStZM


M.

#2141826 - 08/31/13 12:23 PM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,837
Kreisler Offline
Kreisler  Offline


Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,837
Iowa City, IA
Yeah, Vangelis' music became quite popular after Chariots of Fire was released. I still have my original Opera Sauvage CD I bought in the early 80's. smile


"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

www.pianoped.com
www.youtube.com/user/UIPianoPed
#2141962 - 08/31/13 07:19 PM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Damon]  
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 398
Music Me Offline
Full Member
Music Me  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 398
PA
Awesome! I never heard it sound better! Thanks for this!


Barbara
...without music, no life...
#2141975 - 08/31/13 08:08 PM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: beet31425]  
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,028
TwoSnowflakes Offline
2000 Post Club Member
TwoSnowflakes  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,028
Originally Posted by beet31425

The best jazzified piece I ever heard was a version of Chopin's op.25/4 etude. It started normal, and kept launching into super-fast stride piano. If you think how that etude goes, you can almost imagine it.

-J


This?


#2142023 - 08/31/13 10:27 PM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: TwoSnowflakes]  
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,169
beet31425 Offline
4000 Post Club Member
beet31425  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,169
Bay Area, CA
Originally Posted by TwoSnowflakes
Originally Posted by beet31425

The best jazzified piece I ever heard was a version of Chopin's op.25/4 etude. It started normal, and kept launching into super-fast stride piano. If you think how that etude goes, you can almost imagine it.

-J


This?




Yes!!!! I LOVE this. Thanks so much for finding it!

-Jason


Beethoven op.110, Chopin op.27/2, Liszt Vallée d'Obermann
#2142076 - 09/01/13 12:25 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 442
erichlof Offline
Full Member
erichlof  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 442
My favorite is Bill Evans' take on Valse by J.S. Bach. His jazz trio actually adds something to the music that wasn't there before - a rare feat indeed:

[video:youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=tnvMoSCFQeE[/video]

Bill could play both WTC books at an early age, and his touch and sensitivity show in this performance. Enjoy!


Last edited by erichlof; 09/01/13 12:25 AM.
#2142085 - 09/01/13 01:16 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 25,535
BDB Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
BDB  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 25,535
Oakland
An example of one of the best pianists to combine classical music into the jazz genre, Dorothy Donegan.



Semipro Tech
#2142134 - 09/01/13 05:08 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 467
slipperykeys Offline
Full Member
slipperykeys  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 467
Dorset, England
I'm a big fan of Tomita, when I heard his, "Pictures at an Exhibition" in 1976 (IIRC) I thought it was fabulous and I still do.

I don't have a problem with jazz versions of classics, as long as they are credited as such.

Provided people know what they are going to see or hear they can make their own choice.

I had never heard of Jacques Loussier but he seems very good.

I have a Roland RD 700 NX and love experimenting with string quartet versions of pop/rock and classical.

Bach's Bouree cries out for jazzing, to me, at least.

This is not me, I don't have,
A) A Baby Grand
B) A room that tidy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RU_2utHzs8

#2142139 - 09/01/13 06:10 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 467
slipperykeys Offline
Full Member
slipperykeys  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 467
Dorset, England
Here's an interesting video in the context of "un-jazzing".

Go to about 10 minutes 40 secs ( Although you may find the whole thing worth watching) in for demonstration on reversing Jazz to Baroque, short but fascinating.

Bach crops up again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3yzH861MDY


#2142681 - 09/02/13 05:41 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,379
beeboss Offline
1000 Post Club Member
beeboss  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,379
uk south
I like this - Bobo Stenson explores a theme by Purcell ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jloHFsaOdZs

and this - Gwilym Simcock explores a theme by Greig ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDvtX1BlxPQ



#2142770 - 09/02/13 10:30 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: Michael Sayers]  
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,334
Michael Sayers Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Michael Sayers  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,334
Stockholms län, Sverige
Thanks for all the responses so far and any additional ones which are forthcoming!

I wish some of these jazz pianists would do some classically oriented recordings but still preserving their sometimes unique sense of rhythm and timing. I've learned a lot from listening to jazz musicians and studying their work which includes such things as ragtime, such as with Scott Joplin who in his recordings did not adhere very strictly to his music in its published form - and it seems that the great classical pianist-composers of the past who we revere were the same in that respect at least until very recent times.

p.s. - Thanks for the Gwilym Simcock link, and others . . .


M.

#2142785 - 09/02/13 11:28 AM Re: jazzification of classical music [Re: slipperykeys]  
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,334
Michael Sayers Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Michael Sayers  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,334
Stockholms län, Sverige
Originally Posted by slipperykeys
I'm a big fan of Tomita, when I heard his, "Pictures at an Exhibition" in 1976 (IIRC) I thought it was fabulous and I still do.

I don't have a problem with jazz versions of classics, as long as they are credited as such.

Provided people know what they are going to see or hear they can make their own choice.

I had never heard of Jacques Loussier but he seems very good.

I have a Roland RD 700 NX and love experimenting with string quartet versions of pop/rock and classical.

Bach's Bouree cries out for jazzing, to me, at least.

This is not me, I don't have,
A) A Baby Grand
B) A room that tidy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RU_2utHzs8


And as well Andrei Tarkovsky's Solaris movie uses Tomita's The Sea Named "Solaris" with the familiar Bach organ chorale prelude. I couldn't find the desired excerpt on youtube, but Tarkovsky seems to have been quite adept at matching music to a cinematic image:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YZ909wp_hw
(the music doesn't begin until about 1:30)

There is a lot in his book "Sculpting in Time" that might be of interest to pianists and musicians in a very general way if one reads between the lines . . . the book wouldn't normally considered to be in any way about music but I learned a lot from it.

Andrei Tarkovsky was such a genius!


M.


Moderated by  Brendan, Kreisler 

Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World)
our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, Digital Piano Dolly, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.


Free Shipping* on Jansen Artist Piano Benches, Cocoweb Piano Lamps, Hidrau Hydraulic Piano Benches
(*free shipping within contiguous U.S. only)
(ad)
Pearl River & Ritmuller
Ritmuller Pianos
(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq 6 Out now
ad
Pierce Piano Atlas


New Topics - Multiple Forums
collapsing pinky
by Muove. 11/18/17 02:22 PM
DP-10X built in speakers for Pianoteq?
by Tim1981. 11/18/17 12:16 PM
Kawai K3 damper felts for "F" look different
by Crow Wing. 11/18/17 10:09 AM
Scarlatti Sonata B minor k 27 pedal
by Potlea. 11/18/17 05:46 AM
Mostly Medtner concert in Berlin, 28/11/2017
by Ken Iisaka. 11/18/17 01:45 AM
Forum Statistics
Forums44
Topics182,827
Posts2,672,758
Members89,157
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Check It Out!
There's a lot more to Piano World than just the forums.
Click Here to
Explore The Rest of Piano World!!
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2017 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0