Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!


SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Modern Piano Moving
Modern Piano Moving
(ad)
Virtual Sheet Music
Download Sheet Music Instantly
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
Sheet Music...
(125ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Piano Buyer Guide
Piano Buyer Spring 2017
(ad)
Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restorations and sales
Who's Online Now
63 registered members (ando, 36251, amad23, Beakybird, alphonsus, Adypiano, 13 invisible), 1,601 guests, and 7 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 34 1 2 3 4 33 34
#2127621 - 08/03/13 07:15 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: casinitaly]  
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,199
rnaple Offline

Silver Supporter until April 24 2014
rnaple  Offline

Silver Supporter until April 24 2014


Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,199
Rocky Mountains
Originally Posted by casinitaly
... Inlanding once suggested to me that I try sight reading a new piece every day (not worrying too much about the tempo, just getting the notes right) - and to write the date on the piece -- then a few months later, try that piece again.


Now that's a gem of a tip.


Ron
Your brain is a sponge. Keep it wet. Mary Gae George
The focus of your personal practice is discipline. Not numbers. Scott Sonnon
[Linked Image][Linked Image]
(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#2127890 - 08/04/13 10:19 AM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,041
CarlosCC Offline
2000 Post Club Member
CarlosCC  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,041
Lisbon, Portugal
Originally Posted by Saranoya
OK, so ... casinitaly and I were talking, recently, about how difficult it is to really focus on consistent practice over the summer, when there's no weekly piano lesson perpetually looming on the horizon, for which one must always have something more or less presentable prepared.


I like the idea. Not having someone giving weekly homework is part of my routine... smile
I can share my FOYD but I don't know if I can do it weekly. I've some really "busy" weeks which don't let me do the piano related work as I wished. In addition, I usually share my FOYD in my signature in the "Focused on" line.

So, for the first time in FYOD thread, I'm realy focused on:
- Participation in the ABF Recital #31: till 14 August
. . . . 1st QuickWin: decode the final parts of "Life"
. . . . 2nd QuickWin: Practice "Life" to get a decent sound
. . . . 3rd QuickWin: tackle the "red dot"
. . . . 4rd QuickWin: submit piece to ABF Recital

- After 15 August: listen and comment ABF Recital #31




[Linked Image]
SoundCloud | Youtube
Self-taught since Dec2009
"Don't play what's there, play what's not there."
#2127906 - 08/04/13 11:26 AM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
zrtf90 Offline
3000 Post Club Member
zrtf90  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
Ireland (ex England)
Originally Posted by dynamobt
I'm slightly afraid of setting out specific goals with a timeframe to reach them.
I'm with you on the time limited goals. One of the problems is that we don't (always) have deadlines to meet. Another is that, as we all keep saying, 'we get there when we get there' or 'it's the journey not the destination'. On the other hand we don't want to be playing the same few measures everyday without progress.

As our experience setting goals increases so does our ability to recognise what we can do. One approach is to spend a certain amount of time on one piece each day. We start by learning the first few measures then as we learn the next few we append them onto what we already know. This is the more common approach and often results in the first part of the piece being better known than the end and the performance deteriorates as we play.

Another way is spend the time on a limited number of measures and drop them when we get them until we've been through the whole piece in, say, four bar sections. On our second run through we have already learnt, even if forgotten, the early measures and they WILL return very quickly so for the second pass through the piece we can do six or eight bar sections in the same time as we did four. If we need another pass we can do twelve to sixteen bar sections and soon we can do the whole thing.

There is still the option of running through page by page hands separately to keep the continuity going or reserving the weekends to review our progress so far.

This needs enough experience to trust that you will remember what you've done so far, even if you leave it a few weeks, or re-learn it so much faster. If you've taken a section you can memorise in a few plays and work it for ten minutes or more putting hands together and you do that same section Mon-Fri you really will learn it again rapidly in a few weeks time even without reviewing it at the weekends. You may even find you can play it faster and easier without having practised it for a week or two.

So we set ourselves a goal of so many measures that we'll practise each day of the coming week and keep them until they're done. If the goal is reviewed weekly it soon becomes apparent if you're still on the same few bars for several weeks and it may be time to move on before that section is finished and revisit it before the second pass. Maybe the section is too long or the technical problem needs an alternative solution. There's still a time factor without it becoming a deadline.



Richard
#2127910 - 08/04/13 11:33 AM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
zrtf90 Offline
3000 Post Club Member
zrtf90  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
Ireland (ex England)
Originally Posted by aTallGuyNH
Mine will likely be of the form "practice only measures x through y, then only do full run through at end of practice session".

Basically, I need to focus on focusing.
Do the full run through at the start and the small bit last! (See Chang on Post Practise Improvement)

Once you start writing goals you start becoming goal oriented and the focus may well shift automatically.

Do full run throughs of pieces you've learned already and can play. Don't do full run throughs of pieces you're learning. You can do a review of what's been done so far but then only focus on the current days bit and move on to another piece when that's done or another section. I know not everyone here will find this useful advice smile
_____________________________

I'm working on Grieg's Trolltog, 54/3, for the upcoming Grieg recital. This is my work for the coming week. I'm under a time constraint because of the five week deadline. I wouldn't normally do so much on one piece but I picked this up only a week ago (though I've been targetting it for some time - since this thread).


RH M2-29; LH M11-14; LH M21-30; RH M40-47; LH M40-47

These are all memorised already. I'm working on increased facility playing at 80, 100, 120 then back to 100 bpm until they're automatic and I play without thinking too much. I can hit these speeds now but 120 is an effort where the sections transition - it's that thinking ahead thing. I'm targeting 132 bpm (HT) but I doubt I'll reach that for the recording given the time. I'd be thrilled to hit 120 HT by September.

HT from memory: M1-10; M17-18; M40-47; M48-55
HT from the score: M11-14; M21-30; M117-120

These are memorised HS but I still use the score for HT on some passages. These are being done at 60 bpm for the quaver (= 30 bpm, a quarter of HS tempo) until they're automatic. I set the pulse with the metronome then turn it off, I don't leave it ticking. If I didn't do this I'd get too fast too soon. At this stage I can judge 60 or 120 bpm to within a few beats just using my foot.

The cantabile section, M71-86 and M97-112, I can play from the score and may well have the page in front of me when I record. M87-96 and M113-123 are too fast for me to read so I'll have to memorise those. I'm just doing M117-120 this week to get the timing in the fingers.

I'm currently working on three other Grieg pieces, I've just finished and posted my ABF Recital piece, (spent a lot of time on the text 'cause I know Cheryl likes to read it smile ), and am about to start on November's entry. I also have to keep up my Bach, Scarlatti and sonata work. I usually settle for 5 - 15 minutes per piece per day. Trolltog is exceptional.

At present I have no schedule for a first full run through.
Maybe Sept 9 smile



Richard
(ad ) MusicNotes.com
sheet music search
#2127949 - 08/04/13 01:30 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
casinitaly Offline

Gold Supporter until March 1 2014
casinitaly  Offline


Gold Supporter until March 1 2014


Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
Italy
Dynambot and Richard -- I hear you on goals with deadlines. Of course we choose to take them on for recitals - live or recorded smile - but generally I don't set them for myself.

The reason for the self-imposed deadlines I posted way back at the top of the page was simply because I have do get my homework projects into some sort of shape and this seems to be the only way for my brain to get down to it. Until making that list I was still waffling on WHICH pieces I was going to do for my homework. (In case anyone is wondering, my Beethoven Sonatina in G has been put on the shelf - I'd started it about 2 years ago with my first teacher, had to stop because I injured my arm (tension stress) and the idea had been to work on it over the summer. However,.. I just can't bring myself to tackle it on my own. What a weenie I am, I want my teacher to hold my hand as I work through it ! )

Richard your suggestions for approaches on how to tackle pieces hits home. I fight the temptation to go back to the beginning (because I know it, it is easier, it is fun to play ....) and to force myself to start at different spots in the piece.
With the Fughetta in particular, I'm finding this helpful.


I had a look at your 54/3 Troldtag- March of the Trolls, Zug der Zwege! Without counting I could tell immediately which measures were 11-17. Mamma mia! That's a challenge!

You piqued my curiosity about your recital piece so I went to check out what you submitted. smile I don't know much about or from Liszt - so your notes will indeed be greatly appreciated and enjoyed! smile

I have done my first recording of Watchman's Song (Grieg Op12 N3)
I realized I had 2 pretty serious weak spots. One I was aware of, the other I thought I'd had under control, but with performance jitters I had a brain blank-out on what to do...so clearly there's more work to do there. I also heard myself messing up with the pedal. Part of that was clear to me as I was playing but not all of it. In a way that's good because at least only part of it was a surprise.

So... back to focus study on the wobbly bits !

The Fughetta came together a bit better this morning so I'm inclined to be optimistic with regards to PianotStudent88's take on how repetitions pan out over a period of time.

Not sure how much music is going to happen tomorrow as I'm heading out at 8.30am to go cycling - We're heading up to a small lake just north of here and planning to cycle around it (just under 30 Km). I know I'll play when I get home but who knows how much or how effective it will be.



[Linked Image]
#2127963 - 08/04/13 02:09 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
zrtf90 Offline
3000 Post Club Member
zrtf90  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
Ireland (ex England)
Originally Posted by casinitaly
I hear you on goals with deadlines...but generally I don't set them for myself.
Thre's nothing wrong with setting time limits as long as it doesn't add unnecessary pressure. Set them by all means but be flexible rather distraught if you don't meet them.

Originally Posted by casinitaly
I had a look at your 54/3 Troldtag- March of the Trolls, Zug der Zwege! Without counting I could tell immediately which measures were 11-17. Mamma mia! That's a challenge!
It looks harder than it is, Cheryl. The RH notes are just shaping the hand and rolling it (rather like the passages in your own Grieg piece). The difficulty with hands combined is the one note step down each half bar in RH against the uneven LH changes, which are also easy HS.

Originally Posted by casinitaly
I don't know much about or from Liszt
Oh, he was a famous pianist back in the 1800's! laugh

Originally Posted by casinitaly
So... back to focus study on the wobbly bits !
...
I'm heading out at 8.30am to go cycling...just under 30 Km...

I think that should take care of the wobbly bits!
ROFL!



Richard
#2127971 - 08/04/13 02:29 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: zrtf90]  
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,982
SwissMS Offline
1000 Post Club Member
SwissMS  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,982
Costa del Sol
Originally Posted by zrtf90
Originally Posted by dynamobt
I'm slightly afraid of setting out specific goals with a timeframe to reach them.
I'm with you on the time limited goals. One of the problems is that we don't (always) have deadlines to meet. Another is that, as we all keep saying, 'we get there when we get there' or 'it's the journey not the destination'. On the other hand we don't want to be playing the same few measures everyday without progress...


I think it depends on what motivates a person. There is always the danger of setting goals that are too ambitious and adding undue pressure on yourself. On the other hand, for me, I think if achievable weekly goals are set, then progress is more likely to occur. The goals give my practice direction and focus.

Part of the process is learning what is achievable. The feedback loop is to assess progress at the end of a week, and see if I succeeded. If the goals were too ambitious, I set more modest goals for the next week. I also like having longer term goals that have deadlines. For me, that means knowing what I am planning to have finished to present in recital or the next two ABF recitals. It is sort of like having a road map of where I am planning on going. I guess I am a very goal oriented person, and obviously not everyone likes to work this way.

#2127976 - 08/04/13 02:41 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: SwissMS]  
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,199
rnaple Offline

Silver Supporter until April 24 2014
rnaple  Offline

Silver Supporter until April 24 2014


Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,199
Rocky Mountains
Originally Posted by SwissMS
It is sort of like having a road map of where I am planning on going.


This is precisely what this thread is about.
It's about getting focus on what we're doing.
When we aren't focused. We don't do it. Forget about this or that. Don't focus on getting a particular part right.
It's about planning. Which helps many of us to do what we want to do.

It isn't about setting a bar and competing with ourselves to see if we can obtain that or raise the bar.
There is no danger in anything here.
You cannot fail this thread.
You can only fail to try.


Ron
Your brain is a sponge. Keep it wet. Mary Gae George
The focus of your personal practice is discipline. Not numbers. Scott Sonnon
[Linked Image][Linked Image]
#2128046 - 08/04/13 05:23 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
casinitaly Offline

Gold Supporter until March 1 2014
casinitaly  Offline


Gold Supporter until March 1 2014


Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
Italy
Ron's right - we can only fail to try.

SwissMS - your point about having weekly goals - and testing to see if you've really made them reasonable - is a good one.

When I have my lessons I have this sort of weekly target. To a large extent the bar is set by my teacher. I may end up doing more, or if work and life get in the way.. a bit less.

I think this exercise of working out my targets without the teacher can only be a good thing.

Richard. Thank you so much for that elucidation on Liszt - I'd say "in a nutshell" but I'm actually trying to think of a smaller container. wink and on that other comment of yours...
..... cheeky, cheeky fellow!
smile


[Linked Image]
#2128095 - 08/04/13 07:32 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: casinitaly]  
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,249
malkin Offline
4000 Post Club Member
malkin  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,249
*sigh* Salt Lake City
I can set the goal for my behavior--practice this section--however many times, but I can't set the time for the outcome--play this piece (or even this measure) competently at a designated tempo in a specific time frame.

It takes as long as it takes.
"We're not in a hurry." I am reminded at every lesson.


Having power is not nearly as important as what you choose to do with it.
– Roald Dahl

#2128225 - 08/04/13 11:18 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: aTallGuyNH]  
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,393
Bobpickle Offline

Gold Supporter until July 10  2014
Bobpickle  Offline

Gold Supporter until July 10  2014


Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,393
Cameron Park, California
Originally Posted by aTallGuyNH
I'm with you... very small is what I was thinking, such as having a goal that is essentially only about focus, not about aptitude at all. Mine will likely be of the form "practice only measures x through y, then only do full run through at end of practice session".

Basically, I need to focus on focusing. smile


Overwhelming one's self (with either too ambitious/unrealistic of goals and/or simply trying to practice too much at once) is probably the single best/fastest way to de-motivate yourself and then really not be able to focus. See this post I made from a month ago on tips for setting practice goals, and how "not being able to focus" often isn't an issue of focus at all.


"[The trick to life isn't] just about living forever. The trick is still living with yourself forever."
#2128381 - 08/05/13 08:49 AM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Bobpickle]  
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 513
aTallGuyNH Offline
500 Post Club Member
aTallGuyNH  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 513
Originally Posted by Bobpickle
Originally Posted by aTallGuyNH
I'm with you... very small is what I was thinking, such as having a goal that is essentially only about focus, not about aptitude at all. Mine will likely be of the form "practice only measures x through y, then only do full run through at end of practice session".

Basically, I need to focus on focusing. smile


Overwhelming one's self (with either too ambitious/unrealistic of goals and/or simply trying to practice too much at once) is probably the single best/fastest way to de-motivate yourself and then really not be able to focus. See this post I made from a month ago on tips for setting practice goals, and how "not being able to focus" often isn't an issue of focus at all.

Thanks... perfect timing...

Last night I had a horrendous session where I said "well, I guess my goal needs to be to play two notes in proper rhythm". I need to reset my level of difficulty (again).


"...when you do practice properly, it seems to take no time at all. Just do it right five times or so, and then stop." -- JimF

Working on: my aversion to practicing in front of my wife

1978 Vose & Sons spinet "Rufus"
1914 Huntington upright "Mabel"

[Linked Image]XXIX-XXXII
#2128396 - 08/05/13 09:18 AM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 211
255 Offline
Full Member
255  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 211
It's hooooooooooot!!!

#2128466 - 08/05/13 12:25 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
casinitaly Offline

Gold Supporter until March 1 2014
casinitaly  Offline


Gold Supporter until March 1 2014


Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
Italy
After a long day of cycling I'm looking at my piano...feeling like my brain has gone on holiday and left me behind. I doubt any serious piano work is going to happen today. I am glad that my goal calendar has nothing to specific on for today (good planning on my part smile )

28km - all the way around one of our local lakes- a few little hills, various types of road surfaces, great views. It was cool. No, it was stinking hot - but it was cool.

I'm pooped - and I think my piano is pouting.


[Linked Image]
#2128480 - 08/05/13 12:51 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: casinitaly]  
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 513
aTallGuyNH Offline
500 Post Club Member
aTallGuyNH  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 513
Originally Posted by casinitaly

I'm pooped - and I think my piano is pouting.

To borrow a saying I've heard re: computers:

"Don't anthropomorphize pianos... they hate that!"

grin ha


"...when you do practice properly, it seems to take no time at all. Just do it right five times or so, and then stop." -- JimF

Working on: my aversion to practicing in front of my wife

1978 Vose & Sons spinet "Rufus"
1914 Huntington upright "Mabel"

[Linked Image]XXIX-XXXII
#2128482 - 08/05/13 12:58 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 4,055
PianoStudent88 Offline
4000 Post Club Member
PianoStudent88  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 4,055
Maine
My focus and plans are documented on the Bernhard thread: Practicing what Bernhard teaches: a workshop thread.

I'd love it if anyone interested in trying these methods (either in detail or in general) joined in, either there or here. Of course I'm always interested in reading about anyone's ways of practicing and learning. I've been following FOYD with great interest.

My focus is to keep focusing on my Bernhard practicing.


Piano Career Academy - Ilinca Vartic teaches the Russian school of piano playing
Musical-U - guidance for increasing musicality
Theta Music Trainer - fun ear training games
#2128494 - 08/05/13 01:20 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: PianoStudent88]  
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,982
SwissMS Offline
1000 Post Club Member
SwissMS  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,982
Costa del Sol
Originally Posted by PianoStudent88
My focus and plans are documented on the Bernhard thread: Practicing what Bernhard teaches: a workshop thread.

I'd love it if anyone interested in trying these methods (either in detail or in general) joined in, either there or here. Of course I'm always interested in reading about anyone's ways of practicing and learning. I've been following FOYD with great interest.

My focus is to keep focusing on my Bernhard practicing.


I have been closely following your Bernhard thread, and trying to apply the principles to my practice. My focus pieces are all in the polishing stage, and so I haven't used the principles there much, but I started two pieces "on the side" just to try out the ideas. The pieces are Burgmüller op 100 # 24, "The Swallow", and Streabbog "The Orphan". So far the methods seem to be working well for me. These are relatively easy pieces, but they are coming together quite fast. I have done the focussed 20 minute chunks and did the aural study with the score. I will post my progress on them on Friday.

#2128501 - 08/05/13 01:31 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 4,055
PianoStudent88 Offline
4000 Post Club Member
PianoStudent88  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 4,055
Maine
SwissMS, great to hear about what you've been trying.

I'm finding -- I don't know if the pieces are coming together faster, but I am spending less time practicing to get to at least the same point on them, if not further. And I feel like I'm making progress at learning passages that with my usual methods (much as I thought they were practicing in small sections etc. but all too easy to get tempted into playing through larger parts) would often remain challenging forever with little embedded gotcha's.


Piano Career Academy - Ilinca Vartic teaches the Russian school of piano playing
Musical-U - guidance for increasing musicality
Theta Music Trainer - fun ear training games
#2128837 - 08/06/13 08:03 AM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
casinitaly Offline

Gold Supporter until March 1 2014
casinitaly  Offline


Gold Supporter until March 1 2014


Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
Italy
Well, I had planned to record my Fughetta today, but frankly I see no point in doing so. I don't need to record to evaluate where the weak points are. I have made some small progress with the challenging measures, but I think it would be a waste of time recording it.

In retrospect I am not really convinced recording the Grieg was worthwhile either. ... except for giving me an opportunity to struggle with performance anxiety.




[Linked Image]
#2128845 - 08/06/13 08:38 AM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
zrtf90 Offline
3000 Post Club Member
zrtf90  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
Ireland (ex England)
Originally Posted by casinitaly
Well, I had planned to record my Fughetta today, but frankly I see no point in doing so. I don't need to record to evaluate where the weak points are...I am not really convinced recording the Grieg was worthwhile either...
First of all, it gives you the opportunity to get it right on the first go. Look how many posters relate their experience of getting everything right in practise at home and screwing it up when they get to their teachers!

They don't get in right in practise unless they've just been practising it! We can all get it right, or better, after a few extra goes. It's getting it right on that one time, when you first get to the piano, when you first get to your lesson, when you focus on the playing (performance) instead of the practising (rehearsal), when it matters...

No, record it every day. That's the acid test of whether or not you've got it. It's not just to listen to yourself more objectively, it's to practise focusing on your performance.

Don't 'struggle' with performance anxiety. Make it part of your daily routine and deal with it just as you would any other obstacle to a perfect world. Cope!

When I was learning calligraphy I'd always put off a final run on fine, expensive handmade paper. My tutor got me to blot the page before use and write around it. You can't get used to writing on a fine toothed paper by practising on a layout pad.



Richard
#2128858 - 08/06/13 09:15 AM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: zrtf90]  
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,041
CarlosCC Offline
2000 Post Club Member
CarlosCC  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,041
Lisbon, Portugal
Interesting short story about goals and focus. It's a story of a dancer, but I think it's applicable to anything.

Some sentences to highlight:
"She didn’t focus on receiving knowledge; instead she focused on action"
"She controlled the goals, instead of being controlled by them."
"The real payoff, however, is enjoyment."


Link: To Improve Faster, Think Like a Startup


[Linked Image]
SoundCloud | Youtube
Self-taught since Dec2009
"Don't play what's there, play what's not there."
#2128877 - 08/06/13 10:05 AM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 572
torquenale Offline
500 Post Club Member
torquenale  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 572
Italy
This is a wonderful thread! I am teacherless until October and I have 4 weeks here in The Netherlands with a DP and time to practice. This is the second week, and I am using a notebook where I set my weekly tasks. Last week was good, I achieved 90% of them; like others here I'm working on several pieces, and I only really failed on review part of an old one.
I can't write here my plans because I don't have an Internet connected computer here, so I use occasionally my phone but it is soooo boring!
But I hope you can go on with such a nice job!


[Linked Image] [Linked Image]
[Linked Image] [Linked Image]
#2128959 - 08/06/13 01:54 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
casinitaly Offline

Gold Supporter until March 1 2014
casinitaly  Offline


Gold Supporter until March 1 2014


Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
Italy
Torquenale - so glad you could join us! (and I know the hassles of trying to post using your phone - just put what you can and we'll be glad to hear from you! )

Carloscc : that was an interesting article and video. You highlighted some good points, for sure - but another line jumped out at me " to practice for at least five minutes each day. This allowed her to keep expectations low and avoid disappointment"

I think that it is a struggle to keep expectations low. For me anyway. I've always been pretty fast at learning how to do things and I have extremely high expectations for myself - it is really hard to be patient. Apart from learning calculus at a late age, this is probably the hardest thing I've ever done (and I didn't stick with the calculus smile )

Richard: You are right. I will take your advice to heart. - Correction - I HAVE taken your advice to heart. I recorded 3 pieces today. No, none of them were good takes, yes, I was on edge the whole time. .....however the parts of the Fughetta I was struggling with did come out better than before -(not a lot better, but at this point I'm willing to take a few crumbs of consolation this as a bit of encouragement! ).

Part of my problem is setting the bar too high, too early. The bar is in the right place, but at the wrong moment.

However, I also realized that I had written my fingering for the left had ABOVE the notes, instead of below them - and (in part) that was tripping me up because I was reading the number for the left hand but playing it with the right. sigh.

(p.s. I hope you don't mind my paraphrasing what you said for my siggy - I want this "in my face" for a while :):) )

Last edited by casinitaly; 08/06/13 02:02 PM. Reason: added the ps

[Linked Image]
#2128971 - 08/06/13 02:10 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,546
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
keystring  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,546
Canada
Right now my goals are limited to one thing. I want to get at a particular thing so that I can finish my Grieg piece in the sense of polishing and recording it. It's relatively slow with the same thing happening over and over: Grieg doesn't vary it at all. I noticed that a few performers made it sound interesting rather than blah. All of them do something interesting with timing. They stretch some notes (like rubato), make some things a bit faster. I'm trying to hear what they are doing and make sense of it. Then experimenting (to make sense of it). Then if I can figure out what I might do with the piece for this part, I can practice it. I have copies with little scribbles - faster, slower, timing, squiggles.

So I'm trying to get at this side of it, and if I can, the next step is to decide what to do and then practice it, and then make a recording and test it out as a piece.

Somebody wrote about deadlines as motivators. There's one here since our Griegs have to be in by a certain time. I don't like them. When I had lessons on my first instrument to involve lessons, there were pieces that had to be ready for the recital. So often there were things I wanted to explore that would make my playing better or immerse myself in something, but this or that deadline had to be kept, stopping me. Once I was on my own again, I enjoyed above all that I could take as much time as I needed, go as deeply into something that interested me, stop if it seemed wise to stop - no deadline. Same for practising: go as far as you can go, use your judgment, stop when it seems the right time to stop.

That's why I want to get this Grieg done. Even if I give myself time to work on other things, it's hanging over my head because it "has" to be done by a certain time, and it has to be as good as I can make it. I didn't like this while taking lessons when they were still under this formal structure and I still don't like it. I cannot do my best work this way, and it's not as enjoyable.

#2128997 - 08/06/13 03:10 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: casinitaly]  
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
zrtf90 Offline
3000 Post Club Member
zrtf90  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
Ireland (ex England)
Originally Posted by casinitaly
p.s. I hope you don't mind my paraphrasing what you said for my siggy
Andy and Farm Girl might feel disgruntled, but who is this rztf90 fellow?

smile



Richard
#2129012 - 08/06/13 03:44 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: zrtf90]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
casinitaly Offline

Gold Supporter until March 1 2014
casinitaly  Offline


Gold Supporter until March 1 2014


Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
Italy
Originally Posted by zrtf90
Originally Posted by casinitaly
p.s. I hope you don't mind my paraphrasing what you said for my siggy
Andy and Farm Girl might feel disgruntled, but who is this rztf90 fellow?

smile



Oh crikey. Sorry!!!!!!!! Fixed!
(actualy , I wanted to put "Richard" as well, but I ran out of character space in my siggy :))

Last edited by casinitaly; 08/06/13 03:48 PM.

[Linked Image]
#2129016 - 08/06/13 03:47 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: keystring]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
casinitaly Offline

Gold Supporter until March 1 2014
casinitaly  Offline


Gold Supporter until March 1 2014


Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,597
Italy
Originally Posted by keystring
That's why I want to get this Grieg done. Even if I give myself time to work on other things, it's hanging over my head because it "has" to be done by a certain time, and it has to be as good as I can make it. I didn't like this while taking lessons when they were still under this formal structure and I still don't like it. I cannot do my best work this way, and it's not as enjoyable.


I'm not a fan of deadlines either, but I do like the "schedule" of the recitals - and for the Grieg, well, there was enough lead time I didn't feel rushed.

Of course now we're closer and I am feeling unready... but I'm hoping that my focus over the next few weeks will get me over that hump. We can but do our best - whatever our best is at this moment.



[Linked Image]
#2129033 - 08/06/13 04:20 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
zrtf90 Offline
3000 Post Club Member
zrtf90  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,508
Ireland (ex England)
One of the great benefits I've had since getting my new 'modern' digital is the ability to record at the press of a button.

I get each phrase to the point that I can record it, which is quite soon (geologically speaking).

1 Hit the record button,
2 think it through a couple of times,
3 play the phrase,
4 stop the recording,
5 curse a little (or a lot, usually in inverse proportion to the thinking time from step 2)

repeat ad nauseam

Once the 'think it through' bit has been done sufficiently well the phrase is recorded consistently well and we can move onto the next phrase.

Phrases that have been recorded well can be kept more easily in memory (and in the fingers) than those that have simply passed muster at the end a session. A very measurable and objective point has been reached, something akin to critical mass, where the phrase is maintainable and it can be quickly refreshed when it's time to record it with its adjacent companion.

These things build up and each stage is only a small step ahead. Eventually I reach a point where I have two halves in good shape and I only have to try 23 takes a day for a month to do the whole thing. smile
_____________________

I see you've discovered my identity correctly, Cheryl. I now just have to consult the copyright laws... smile

_____________________

I'm inspired by this thread and its reception in the forum to post, in addition to the Grieg recital piece, my focus for the November ABF Recital, Brahms' Ballad in D minor Op. 10/1.

I learnt the first page many years ago but didn't memorise it and gave up after trying to play 3v2 with crossed hands. I couldn't play full chords with the same alacrity as I can manage today either.

This week is just listening. I've to memorise it again (as a hummable tune in my head) before I get back to the piano with it and analyse it also. I used not to do that last time I tackled this wee beastie.

I've mopped up four long-outstanding unfinished pieces because of these recitals. The motivation from posting a recording is unbelievable!



Richard
#2129045 - 08/06/13 04:49 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: Saranoya]  
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,546
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
keystring  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,546
Canada
Record features are fantastic, and we have a real advantage over students years ago. I have that feature on my DP and also have a cable leading to the computer so I could have it running continuously while I practice. I don't necessarily check if something is perfect or perfectly matching a goal, but I'll want to see what it sounds like and what I can catch. Sometimes I hear something really cool, and try to remember what I did. Other times I'll notice a problem that I didn't hear while practising. It's not always related to what I was trying to achieve. If I actually try to achieve a particular result, that makes me anxious, and I don't go there. Rather, I trust that if I work a certain way, things will develop, and then I listen to see what's happening. It's like when your baby toddles along every day, and you're delighted as he falls less, and his prattle starts resembling words. laugh

#2129067 - 08/06/13 05:31 PM Re: FOYD - Focus On Your Domain [Re: keystring]  
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 6,271
peterws Offline
6000 Post Club Member
peterws  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 6,271
Northern England.
"Somebody wrote about deadlines as motivators."

Dead right they are! A motivation for me to play at all. If it wasn`t for these, I wouldn`t be on this forum, I wouldn`t be playing again. . . I wouldn`t be considering buying a new pee-anno, or acquiring a new index finger (RH but a decent LH will do)


"I am not a man. I am a free number"

"[Linked Image]"
Page 2 of 34 1 2 3 4 33 34

Moderated by  BB Player, casinitaly 

Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World) our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.


Free Shipping on Jansen Artist Piano Benches
(ad)
Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
ad
Pierce Piano Atlas


(ad)
Pianoteq
Grotrian Concert
Royal
for Pianoteq out now
What's Hot!!
Why Do You Play The Piano?
-------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
-------------------
Piano Classified Ads
New Topics - Multiple Forums
waiting for ds.dmtry.com
by Beemer. 06/27/17 02:28 AM
What action does GM-10k have?
by James Guo. 06/27/17 01:00 AM
Baldwin Grand Classic Line C Info?
by Dee102. 06/27/17 12:10 AM
Starting Scarbo.
by Sean P. 06/26/17 08:45 PM
(ad)
Sheet Music Plus
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Forum Statistics
Forums44
Topics180,479
Posts2,639,397
Members88,200
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Check It Out!
There's a lot more to Piano World than just the forums.
Check It Out!
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2017 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0