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#2096122 - 06/05/13 11:00 AM Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse  
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 3
Alex M. Offline
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Alex M.  Offline
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We're hosting a composition contest, and while it's geared towards religious pieces (both instrumental and choral) we do not require any religious affiliation. We seek inspiring music more than anything.

No entry fee is required. There are three categories and the following prize purse for each:

1st - $2,500
2nd - $1,000
3rd - $500

More information can be found at the following link:

http://yourldsmusicstore.com/contest/

All the best!

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#2098039 - 06/07/13 06:06 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Alex M.]  
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ScottM Offline
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OK, so it could be Hindu, or Jewish, or Islamic, or Wiccan religious music?


Scott
#2098471 - 06/08/13 05:05 AM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: ScottM]  
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Michael Sayers Offline
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Michael Sayers  Offline
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Stockholms län, Sverige
I think the real issue would be with the 100% publication buyout for three years when anything can be done with the music in print, with no other publication restriction implied or stated.

Would any composer who values his own music agree to that totally open ended aspect of the contract for $12,000?

Maybe for $120,000 then the three-year publication buyout is okay - the piano Legend can be published in a (not-the-composer's) transcription for brass quintent with numerous passages harmonically revised for popular intake, and also borrowed from for (other composers') other works in print for three years - otherwise no deal!

M.

#2098605 - 06/08/13 12:56 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Michael Sayers]  
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ScottM Offline
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Originally Posted by Michael Sayers


Would any composer who values his own music agree to that totally open ended aspect of the contract for $12,000?



YES.


Scott
#2098636 - 06/08/13 02:10 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: ScottM]  
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Michael Sayers Offline
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Michael Sayers  Offline
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Stockholms län, Sverige
Originally Posted by ScottM
Originally Posted by Michael Sayers


Would any composer who values his own music agree to that totally open ended aspect of the contract for $12,000?



YES.


What if he values it as though it were an extension of his body and soul?

I think a few thousand USD would be fine for three years with some restrictions and requirements needed (not just a one sentence contract as with the check box). But for old-West style carte blanche with the contents, really I think quite a lot more than a few thousand makes sense as the composer would not be able to make available accurate printed presentation of the music during the three year time frame . . . of course if the composer doesn't care about the music I guess the few thousand might be okay.

The contract doesn't even guarantee the music will be published by the group, it just gives the group exclusive publication right to the contents.

M.

#2098662 - 06/08/13 04:05 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Alex M.]  
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ScottM Offline
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Well, Mike, tell you what. You can buy one of my pieces for 3 years at $12000 and you can put me to the test. If I suffer without that piece of my soul for 3 years, then it's my own fault. Drat! Darn! And you don't even have to try publish it, either. I'd say it's sweet deal for you, then. Let me know!


Scott
#2099244 - 06/09/13 11:07 AM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: ScottM]  
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Steve Chandler Online content
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Steve Chandler  Online Content
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Originally Posted by ScottM
Well, Mike, tell you what. You can buy one of my pieces for 3 years at $12000 and you can put me to the test. If I suffer without that piece of my soul for 3 years, then it's my own fault. Drat! Darn! And you don't even have to try publish it, either. I'd say it's sweet deal for you, then. Let me know!

ROTFLMAOSMTMN! (SMTMN stands for spitting milk through my nose). This discussion is about potential vs. realistic. Something or someone with deep pockets may be able to take a piece of music and promote the heck out of it to garner significant earnings, but that's almost impossible in this day and age. Justin Bieber was discovered by Usher and promoted by him. Usher invested a lot of money in JB and has certainly recouped his investment and made JB a household name. Pretty good outcome for both of them. Could that happen in the classical realm? I hope so. I would be perfectly okay with selling one of my pieces for a few thousand as long as my name stayed attached to it as the creator. Musical creations are like potato chips, I can always make more!

Having said that I don't believe I'll be participating in this particular contest.

#2099281 - 06/09/13 12:28 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Alex M.]  
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Nikolas Offline
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Nikolas  Offline
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UK
Hem...

I've done total buyouts of my music for far less for computer games... The current price is around 1000 US$ per minute of music! So 12,000$ is fine by me too.

Only I don't do religious music and that would be a tad difficult. Plus most of my works are already publisher in which case I can't enter... :-/

The rest are... nothing compared to some 12,000$! grin

#2099405 - 06/09/13 04:22 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: ScottM]  
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Alex M. Offline
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Alex M.  Offline
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ScottM: Yes

#2099411 - 06/09/13 04:27 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Michael Sayers]  
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Alex M. Offline
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Alex M.  Offline
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Michael,

Below is information that covers your concerns. These are not listed on the contest website yet, but will be shortly.

I hope this helps.

Alex

*****************************************************************

OBLIGATION AS A WINNER:
If your piece is selected as a winner of one of the prizes, yourLDSmusic.com has the right to exclusively publish the piece in a downloadable form for three years. Once the three years have expired, you may publish the composition anywhere you would like.

COPYRIGHTS:
Unlike most music publishing companies that will take and own all the rights to your music, yourLDSmusic.com will NOT own any of the copyrights to your original composition. You keep and maintain all rights to your composition.

ROYALTIES:
We offer a generous royalty on our music sold. Whereas the majority of publishers will pay an average of 10% sales, we offer a generous 33% royalty on net profits.


HOW WE SELL YOUR WINNING COMPOSITION:
The winning pieces will be sold in electronic sheet music form only. We will not print or sell hardcopies. The customer will purchase and download your music from our website. Your name and copyright information will be on the music. A sample of the copyright notice looks like this:

Copyright © 2013 by John Smith. All Rights Reserved.
Please be honest. Photocopying Prohibited.
Purchased at: yourLDSMUSICstore.com


GENERAL PUBLISHING:
If you are not a winner, you may still publish your music with yourLDSmusic.com. Many wonderful compositions have been submitted, but we will only pick the top three in each category as winners. You may submit your piece for publication with us at any time. Again, we do not own the copyrights to your composition. You will receive the same royalty at the rate of 33% on net profits.

#2099412 - 06/09/13 04:27 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Alex M.]  
Joined: Jun 2011
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PianoStudent88 Online content
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PianoStudent88  Online Content
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The prize is not $12,000; the total purse is $12,000. The first prize in any one of the three categories is $2,500.


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#2099416 - 06/09/13 04:31 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Alex M.]  
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PianoStudent88 Online content
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Royalty 10% on sales compared to 33% on net profits: if "sales" and "net profits" mean what I understand them to mean, then 33% is not necessarily better.


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#2099912 - 06/09/13 09:18 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Alex M.]  
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rada Offline
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I happen to be partial about my feelings in what I write but if someone were to 'steal' my ideas I feel I could just take them back and spin them into something a bit different.

I sent music to Singapore [ back a few years] and they consolidated 2 cds to 1. I made some money but how in the world would I know if someone in that part of the world is mis-using my music. Besides they could do their own spin.

rada
ps...I tried to enter but things got clogged and I got bogged....

#2099987 - 06/09/13 11:15 PM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: rada]  
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Michael Sayers Offline
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Michael Sayers  Offline
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Stockholms län, Sverige
Hi Alex,

Normally before publication there needs to be some communication between the composer and the music press editor.

For instance the editor might might discover something that wasn't correctly notated on a harmonic basis, or maybe the 'incorrect' harmony was actually correct . . . but maybe a change for publication purposes is okay.

There is a step-by-step process involved with this that seems to be jumped over here.

There doesn't seem to be much information on how winning compositions will be used in print (a piano only version might be wanted, for instance, if the original is not for solo piano).

And what if after the competition for some reason there is a decision not to publish and the composition then has to sit in a binder collecting dust for three years?

The financial incentive wouldn't be enough with those concerns for me personally to submit a work I take high satisfaction in as the result of much effort to overcome significant challenges.

The purpose here isn't to be dismissive of the competition - it is merely to express that interest faded for these various reasons.


Yours,
Michael

#2114029 - 07/07/13 12:48 AM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Alex M.]  
Joined: Nov 2002
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Kreisler Offline
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Joined: Nov 2002
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Iowa City, IA
Originally Posted by Alex M.

OBLIGATION AS A WINNER:
If your piece is selected as a winner of one of the prizes, yourLDSmusic.com has the right to exclusively publish the piece in a downloadable form for three years. Once the three years have expired, you may publish the composition anywhere you would like.

COPYRIGHTS:
Unlike most music publishing companies that will take and own all the rights to your music, yourLDSmusic.com will NOT own any of the copyrights to your original composition. You keep and maintain all rights to your composition.


I don't think both of these things can be true. If the website has the right to exclusively publish the piece, then the composer does *not* keep and maintain all rights to the composition. My understanding is that the copyright would have to be transferred and then transferred back. Either that, or an exclusive licensing agreement would have to be drafted.


"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

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#2114040 - 07/07/13 01:52 AM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Alex M.]  
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Nikolas Offline
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Nikolas  Offline
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You can retain 'exclusive license of copyrights explotation' or something to that end... Go figure... :-/

In any case I think that it's a very fair concept, give that the worst case scenario is to get your work back after three years! It's utterly risk free, plus you get some money from the competition!

OF course the whole religious part is making me feel uneasy...

#2114150 - 07/07/13 10:56 AM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Alex M.]  
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Kreisler Offline
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,837
Iowa City, IA
I don't see a problem with the religious aspect. Religious music is a HUGE industry in the United States, and there are a large number of publishers and booksellers who target religious consumers.

It is a bit unusual to see an LDS store, as they're not as widespread, and because the LDS church is a bit picky about it's dealings. The LDS church also sees music as a part of one's service to the church. The LDS church provides all liturgical and service music for free:

http://www.lds.org/music?lang=eng

As a result, commercial enterprises in LDS music are up against some difficult competition. There's even a free beginner piano method complete with teacher's manual on the LDS website.


"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

www.pianoped.com
www.youtube.com/user/UIPianoPed
#2114164 - 07/07/13 11:36 AM Re: Call For Submissions - $12,000 Prize Purse [Re: Alex M.]  
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Nikolas Offline
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Nikolas  Offline
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There's an issue about religious music: I can see the beauty in it, but I can't say that I "believe". This creates a clash in me (which I'm willing to overcome actually somehow, but I'm not sure why)...

That's why I said it's making me feel uneasy.


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