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Originally Posted by AndyJ
Originally Posted by Loren D


Couldn't disagree more. Professionalism never goes out of style.

I guess it depends where you are. Around here (southwest Ohio), a tuner wearing a tie would get some funny looks.


Could be. I guess my point is that often it's the little things that make a big difference. My real issue is with the notion that ties are last century. I'm not a fan of professionals dressing down. I play a lot of weddings, and you'd be surprised at what some people consider proper attire for someone's wedding. I see jeans, shorts, t-shirts...


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Does this mean I have to buy a Toyota corolla and trim my long goatee.
O wait, I have lots of work. smile


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Originally Posted by Jbyron
I agree with the OP, the economy is great! I get a kick out of the technicians who act like they know what all the other technicians in the country are doing, charging, acting like. Making statements that seem to indicate that since they charge more than everyone else they must be perceived as better too (how do you know what they're charging?), or I wear a tie so my customers like me better. Ties are last-century for the most part. Having a clean professional image is important but so many other factors also play in.

Jbyron,

Maybe I misinterpreted the OP - I sensed a fair level of sarcasm in his posts. confused

Through the Piano Technicians Guild I have had a chance to interact with technicians from all over the country on fairly regular basis. So my opinion is somewhat based on experience. It sounds like you disagree - no problem. smile

I agree that rates are not always an indication of quality. However, the market is a no-nonsense indicator of how well an individual's business strategy is paying off. If you are charging top dollar and the phone continues to ring throughout the year, you must be doing something right.

Take Rod, for example: If you want him to replace a soundboard for you you're going to be waiting at least a year. I guarantee you this is not because he is cheaper than his competitors! thumb

In regards to the tie - maybe they are a bit old fashioned! I think being a piano technician is kind of an old fashioned occupation, so to me, it fits. I do get an occasional comment, but I tend to err on the side of looking like a professional businessman. This partly carries over from when I was in my 20's with 2 young kids trying to make it in a town with several other established technicians. I had to do everything I could to make a good impression, being such a young whooper-snapper!

LaRoy Edwards who ran Yamaha's Little Red Schoolhouse for many years encouraged us to consider wearing a tie. He said we'd make more money! "It's OK if you don't want to make more money. But if you WANT to make more money, you should wear a tie" he said. I figured with my situation I couldn't afford NOT to!

Of course Jerry Groot, RIP, despised ties after his got caught on a grand action he was working on, causing the action to go crashing onto the floor when he stood up! grin

Your last sentence is right on. Image is only part of the equation. That's why I mentioned continuing education.

Most techs are not all that interested in it - it's hard enough to get people to show up for a Piano Technicians Guild meeting. Far fewer will attend a conference. Attendance at the PTG annual conference has been running at around 600 out of a total membership of approximately 4000.


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Originally Posted by Loren D
Originally Posted by Jbyron
Ties are last-century for the most part.


Couldn't disagree more. Professionalism never goes out of style.


I agree with you, professionalism never goes out of style. Ties and professionalism are not mutually exclusive. Styles go out of style, proven by the fact that we are no longer wearing powdered wigs to work. I have no problem what-so-ever with people dressing how they want and don't mind seeing people in ties. In Southern California very few wear them and I live in a professional area where there is a ton of wealth and a ton of success. I only have a problem when people say they have the best formula for success and anyone else is pond-scum by comparison. It sounds like some people construct agenda driven posts at every turn. You'll never get everyone to be just the way you think they should be. Why even try? Especially if you feel that their inadequacies are bringing more work your way. I had my most lucrative year ever and it just so happened to be one where I dressed down slightly to what I felt was more appropriate for the work that I do most often. Granted, a concert tuning or wedding calls for dressing up but durable kakis and a dress shirt or even nice jeans, nice shoes and dress shirt is usually more appropriate for pulling actions into your lap, climbing under a piano and adjusting pedals, using glues and lubricants, etc. I find that customers respond favorably to a trim clean appearance and a friendly smile more than anything else.


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Originally Posted by rysowers
Originally Posted by Jbyron
I agree with the OP, the economy is great! I get a kick out of the technicians who act like they know what all the other technicians in the country are doing, charging, acting like. Making statements that seem to indicate that since they charge more than everyone else they must be perceived as better too (how do you know what they're charging?), or I wear a tie so my customers like me better. Ties are last-century for the most part. Having a clean professional image is important but so many other factors also play in.

Jbyron,

Maybe I misinterpreted the OP - I sensed a fair level of sarcasm in his posts. confused

Through the Piano Technicians Guild I have had a chance to interact with technicians from all over the country on fairly regular basis. So my opinion is somewhat based on experience. It sounds like you disagree - no problem. smile

I agree that rates are not always an indication of quality. However, the market is a no-nonsense indicator of how well an individual's business strategy is paying off. If you are charging top dollar and the phone continues to ring throughout the year, you must be doing something right.

Take Rod, for example: If you want him to replace a soundboard for you you're going to be waiting at least a year. I guarantee you this is not because he is cheaper than his competitors! thumb

In regards to the tie - maybe they are a bit old fashioned! I think being a piano technician is kind of an old fashioned occupation, so to me, it fits. I do get an occasional comment, but I tend to err on the side of looking like a professional businessman. This partly carries over from when I was in my 20's with 2 young kids trying to make it in a town with several other established technicians. I had to do everything I could to make a good impression, being such a young whooper-snapper!

LaRoy Edwards who ran Yamaha's Little Red Schoolhouse for many years encouraged us to consider wearing a tie. He said we'd make more money! "It's OK if you don't want to make more money. But if you WANT to make more money, you should wear a tie" he said. I figured with my situation I couldn't afford NOT to!

Of course Jerry Groot, RIP, despised ties after his got caught on a grand action he was working on, causing the action to go crashing onto the floor when he stood up! grin

Your last sentence is right on. Image is only part of the equation. That's why I mentioned continuing education.

Most techs are not all that interested in it - it's hard enough to get people to show up for a Piano Technicians Guild meeting. Far fewer will attend a conference. Attendance at the PTG annual conference has been running at around 600 out of a total membership of approximately 4000.


My main gripe being, I didn't see how what you said had anything to do with the OP's statement. It just seemed like an agenda driven bunch of unrelated comments. Perhaps I misunderstood.

I interact with technicians from all over the country as well. Do you feel that they could/should be earning more money? Maybe you are sincerely trying to help them, I don't know.

We all know that you charge top dollar and your phone rings throughout the year. I think a lot of us are experiencing plenty of work, which to my understanding was the reason for the OP's post.

If the tie suits you and your area, that's fantastic. In my area, even though a wealthy one, ties are looked upon with great suspicion. wink

I have tremendous respect for LaRoy Edwards, he's a good guy to listen to about any aspect of the business IMO. I just don't agree with the tie and more income thing. smile

I miss Jerry Groot's, RIP, great humor.

I wouldn't gauge the desire for continued education of technicians solely by PTG function attendance. There are other ways technicians learn and improve, for instance last year I skipped the convention but spent a great deal of time honing my voicing skills with a mentor, and a lot of us read a great deal. One convention I attended was waste of time because I didn't hear anything new. Mostly my fault for picking the wrong classes. I usually learn a great deal there.






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Jbyron,

As I said, I took the OP's remarks as sarcasm. So I was making the point that a technicians perception of the economy may have more to do with their business strategy than with the actual economy. If you take the OPs post on face value, I suppose my comments didn't seem to be relevant. It wouldn't be the first time! [Linked Image]

So maybe the OP can clarify - Sarcasm or sincerity?

I never intended to make anyone feel like pond scum (although pond scum may be happier than most humans are. They get all their energy from the sun smile )

I agree with you that PTG functions aren't the only or necessarily best way to progress. I was simply siting it as an example that I perceive that it is a small minority of technicians that actively work to upgrade skills. I like your idea of skipping the convention and working with a mentor on voicing skills. In regards to not hearing anything new at a convention - that may be true, but I find that I am so thick-headed that I have to hear the information a few different times sometimes from multiple sources before it really sinks in! [Linked Image]



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Originally Posted by rysowers
Jbyron,

As I said, I took the OP's remarks as sarcasm. So I was making the point that a technicians perception of the economy may have more to do with their business strategy than with the actual economy. If you take the OPs post on face value, I suppose my comments didn't seem to be relevant. It wouldn't be the first time! [Linked Image]

So maybe the OP can clarify - Sarcasm or sincerity?

I never intended to make anyone feel like pond scum (although pond scum may be happier than most humans are. They get all their energy from the sun smile )

I agree with you that PTG functions aren't the only or necessarily best way to progress. I was simply siting it as an example that I perceive that it is a small minority of technicians that actively work to upgrade skills. I like your idea of skipping the convention and working with a mentor on voicing skills. In regards to not hearing anything new at a convention - that may be true, but I find that I am so thick-headed that I have to hear the information a few different times sometimes from multiple sources before it really sinks in! [Linked Image]



thumb


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I don't do ties. 'Too many horse thieves in my background, and a tie brings up unpleasant historic associations with neckties of another sort.


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Here's David dressing up for work:
[Linked Image]


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Gaaaaaaaakh!


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This thread didn't start out about ties, but now that it is there I want to bring up Willis Snyder. Anyone remember Willis?

When he went into a home - no matter if it was January or July, he would wear a coat and a bowtie, sometimes all black with a bright white shirt, an overcoat, and a gentleman's hat.

Great tech. too - who did not mind sharing his knowledge. I miss him. frown


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I used to dress up slacks, button up shirt or polo. After climbing under pianos sifting through dust bunnies and cobwebs many of times along with pulling actions out onto my lap I have went to blue jeans and polo shirts and decent shoes. Not dressed up but not shorts, tee shirt and flip flops. I have heard stories from customers about other technicians in the area showing up stinking of cigarette smoke, biker chain hanging out of his pocket with a baby in a car seat. Another showing up with his wife who wandered around the customers house then went and took a nap on her couch. Needless to say I now have those customers and the word has spread around the area about the others.

Also I never talk politics with a customer.

Last edited by pianotune2; 06/28/13 02:44 PM.

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Originally Posted by pianotune2
I have heard stories from customers about other technicians in the area showing up stinking of cigarette smoke, biker chain hanging out of his pocket with a baby in a car seat. Another showing up with his wife who wandered around the customers house then went and took a nap on her couch. Needless to say I now have those customers and the word has spread around the area about the others.


Same here! One technician will occasionally bring all 4 of his kids to an appointment! Ironically, its the only tech left in the area who still wears a business suit, suspenders, and a tie.


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Originally Posted by Samthetech
Originally Posted by pianotune2
I have heard stories from customers about other technicians in the area showing up stinking of cigarette smoke, biker chain hanging out of his pocket with a baby in a car seat. Another showing up with his wife who wandered around the customers house then went and took a nap on her couch. Needless to say I now have those customers and the word has spread around the area about the others.


Same here! One technician will occasionally bring all 4 of his kids to an appointment! Ironically, its the only tech left in the area who still wears a business suit, suspenders, and a tie.


I know a tuner that was in a small conflict with a customer so he brought his wife to the home as a witness while he re-checked the piano. She sat on the couch while he worked. The customer was extremely upset and called the dealership he was tuning for to let them have it. Needless to say she wore the pants in the family.


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