Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
What's Hot!!
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
(ad)
Piano Tuning
How to Tune Pianos
(125ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Piano Buyer Guide
Piano Buyer Spring 2017
(ad)
4th Finger Enigma Resolved!
Schumann's 4th Finger Enigma Resolved!
Who's Online Now
103 registered members (bennevis, 36251, amad23, augustm, BGrantier, 29 invisible), 1,931 guests, and 3 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#2107915 - 06/25/13 04:10 PM A talk on Beethoven  
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,097
fnork Offline
2000 Post Club Member
fnork  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,097
Helsinki, Finland
I found this discussion rather rewarding:

http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/musicshow/paavali-jumppanen-on-beethoven/4668384

Paavali J. discusses various issues relating to Beethoven, his life and his works. For someone that has performed all piano sonatas (as well as all violin sonatas and concerti, etc) many times as a cycle, it's very nice to see that he is so down-to-earth and frequently says that he (or Beethoven scholars in general) doesn't necessarily know everything. What does the pedal indication for op 27 nr 2 mean? Does Beethoven's notation of the upbeat in 1st movement of Hammerklavier mean it must be played by one hand? Etc etc. Enjoy.

(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#2107920 - 06/25/13 04:22 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: fnork]  
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Orange Soda King  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
Thanks for sharing. Always good to hear a professional's insight about Beethoven. This is why I'm also going to do Jonathan Biss's (Biss'? Punctuation rule fail) free online course on Beethoven's piano sonatas, as mentioned in an earlier thread.

#2107958 - 06/25/13 04:48 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: fnork]  
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,935
JoelW Online content
5000 Post Club Member
JoelW  Online Content
5000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,935
USA
It's a name, therefore it's "Biss's".

#2107962 - 06/25/13 04:53 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: fnork]  
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9,224
Polyphonist Offline
9000 Post Club Member
Polyphonist  Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9,224
New York City
In fact, the rules for possessives are more complex than you know, as some names receive only an apostrophe and not an s. laugh

(Very confusing stuff.)


Regards,

Polyphonist
(ad ) MusicNotes.com
sheet music search
#2109082 - 06/27/13 01:24 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: fnork]  
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,097
fnork Offline
2000 Post Club Member
fnork  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,097
Helsinki, Finland
ha, that much for keeping the discussion about Beethoven wink I've heard Paavali's (correct use of the apostrophe, I hope?!) Beethoven live a few times and will hear him again later in July. It's often fairly extreme in tempi, have rarely heard such fast tempis in the outer movements of Appassionata. In any case, I like that he's very undogmatic, doesn't preach about anything and doesn't encourage anyone else to follow his path interpretation-wise.

#2109114 - 06/27/13 02:30 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: fnork]  
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 225
AndyJ Offline
Full Member
AndyJ  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 225
Near Dayton, Ohio USA
Originally Posted by fnork
Paavali's (correct use of the apostrophe, I hope?!) Beethoven....

Yes, congratulations!

#2109162 - 06/27/13 04:11 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: fnork]  
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,097
fnork Offline
2000 Post Club Member
fnork  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,097
Helsinki, Finland
awesome! let's keep talking about apostrophes!!!

#2109164 - 06/27/13 04:12 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: fnork]  
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Orange Soda King  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
Oh no!! I just misuse'd two apostrophe's!! frown frown

#2109263 - 06/27/13 07:49 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: fnork]  
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 142
The Hound Offline
Full Member
The Hound  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 142
Generally speaking it's nothing to do with it being a name or not, but whether it's singular. So, for example, "the boss's computer" takes an "'s" on the end, like "Biss's". Whereas if it were multiple bosses, it would be "bosses' computers". There are a few exceptions - basically when "'s" becomes unwieldy - but that's the general rule.

Anyway, Beethoven. There can never be too much talk about him, so thanks for the link - will be sure to check it out.

Has anyone here seen "In Search Of Beethoven" (and the accompanying "In Search Of Mozart"), by the way?

Last edited by The Hound; 06/27/13 07:50 PM.
#2109271 - 06/27/13 08:03 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: The Hound]  
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,169
beet31425 Offline
4000 Post Club Member
beet31425  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,169
Bay Area, CA
Originally Posted by The Hound
Generally speaking it's nothing to do with it being a name or not, but whether it's singular. So, for example, "the boss's computer" takes an "'s" on the end, like "Biss's". Whereas if it were multiple bosses, it would be "bosses' computers". There are a few exceptions - basically when "'s" becomes unwieldy - but that's the general rule.
There's some debate on precisely when "s becomes unwieldy". I personally like s's for all name possessives: hence "Bliss's class" and "Gauss's Law". But for some reason "Jesus" is usually an exception, as in "Jesus' son".

Originally Posted by The Hound
Has anyone here seen "In Search Of Beethoven" (and the accompanying "In Search Of Mozart"), by the way?

Yes, I saw the Beethoven film last weekend. It's a sensitive, informative, beautifully-made, very long depiction of Beethoven's entire life. Highly recommended!

-Jason


Beethoven op.110, Chopin op.27/2, Liszt Vallée d'Obermann
#2109274 - 06/27/13 08:10 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: beet31425]  
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 142
The Hound Offline
Full Member
The Hound  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 142
Originally Posted by beet31425
Originally Posted by The Hound
Generally speaking it's nothing to do with it being a name or not, but whether it's singular. So, for example, "the boss's computer" takes an "'s" on the end, like "Biss's". Whereas if it were multiple bosses, it would be "bosses' computers". There are a few exceptions - basically when "'s" becomes unwieldy - but that's the general rule.
There's some debate on precisely when "s becomes unwieldy". I personally like s's for all name possessives: hence "Bliss's class" and "Gauss's Law". But for some reason "Jesus" is usually an exception, as in "Jesus' son".


Yes. Like you say, "Jesus", often only takes an apostrophe in the possessive, even though I don't personally find it unwieldy at all to have an apostrophe follwed by an "s" on that word. It's not always agreed on where the exceptions lie. I was just trying to make the general rule clear. There's often confusion over it, and a lot of people mistakenly use only an apostrophe on any name or word ending in "s".

Quote
Originally Posted by The Hound
Has anyone here seen "In Search Of Beethoven" (and the accompanying "In Search Of Mozart"), by the way?

Yes, I saw the Beethoven film last weekend. It's a sensitive, informative, beautifully-made, very long depiction of Beethoven's entire life. Highly recommended!

-Jason


Me too - I thought it was wonderfully informative and very nicely made. Essentially, I agree with all of your chosen adjectives. smile

#2109349 - 06/27/13 10:55 PM Re: A talk on Beethoven [Re: fnork]  
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Orange Soda King  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
This is actually one of the most interesting talk's on Beethoven Iv'e heard seen/recently, actually.


Moderated by  Brendan, Kreisler 

Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World)
our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, Digital Piano Dolly, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.


Free Shipping* on Jansen Artist Piano Benches, Cocoweb Piano Lamps, Hidrau Hydraulic Piano Benches
(*free shipping within contiguous U.S. only)
(ad)
Pearl River & Ritmuller
Ritmuller Pianos
(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq 6 Out now
(ad)
Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restorations and sales
ad
Pierce Piano Atlas


New Topics - Multiple Forums
Grandmother can't hear need help.
by Epee. 10/21/17 04:36 PM
How much should I sell my Kawai CA67 for?
by AndyE. 10/21/17 11:09 AM
What is cocktail music?
by pianoloverus. 10/21/17 08:44 AM
Yamaha DGX 660 vs Casio PX 560
by VMK. 10/21/17 06:54 AM
Can I Run Roland RD700nx Through Stereo Speakers?
by ClsscLib. 10/20/17 09:19 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums44
Topics182,410
Posts2,666,241
Members89,015
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Check It Out!
There's a lot more to Piano World than just the forums.
Click Here to
Explore The Rest of Piano World!!
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2017 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0