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#2074783 - 05/01/13 06:06 AM How happy are you with your Digital?  
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peterws Offline
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Northern England.
Scale of one to ten. What would your ideal be?

Mine scores eight and a half. I`m not sure that my ideal exists . . . or ever will!


"I am not a man. I am a free number"

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#2074794 - 05/01/13 06:21 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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Kawai James Offline
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Hamamatsu, Japan
7.4


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#2074819 - 05/01/13 07:15 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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EssBrace Offline
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0.0

Or could also be expressed as pointless.

#2074824 - 05/01/13 07:24 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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MacMacMac Offline
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Standalone Yamaha CLP-240:
Touch . . . . . 8
Sound . . . . . 3
Appearance . . 10

The sound is poor, so I use software piano libraries.
In concert, the setup rates:
Touch . . . . . 8 (no change)
Sound . . . . . 9 (increased because the software makes it sound like a piano)
Appearance . . 8 (reduced because of the equipment clutter)

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#2074825 - 05/01/13 07:25 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: EssBrace]  
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Marko in Boston Offline
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10: the first week you after you purchased your shiny new DP

8: after you had it few months go by, you find a few flaws and annoyances

7: after you have it for 6-12 months and you start to see the new model DP's rolling out. Obviously those must be the new 10's

5: you are ready to sell your DP to buy the latest DP

.... and now back to

10: the first week you after you purchased the LATEST shiny new DP


KAWAI ES7 | ROLAND RD-800 | YAMAHA CP4 | YAMAHA STAGEPAS 400i | PRESONUS R65 & T10 | SHURE SRH1540 | SENNHEISER HD650 | K&M OMEGA
#2074847 - 05/01/13 07:57 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: Marko in Boston]  
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dmd Offline
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Originally Posted by Marko in Boston
10: the first week you after you purchased your shiny new DP

8: after you had it few months go by, you find a few flaws and annoyances

7: after you have it for 6-12 months and you start to see the new model DP's rolling out. Obviously those must be the new 10's

5: you are ready to sell your DP to buy the latest DP

.... and now back to

10: the first week you after you purchased the LATEST shiny new DP



This is pretty close to my pattern.

However, my present DP (ES7) has met my expectations for sound and touch and I am going to try to leave it at that and just concentrate on learning to play it.

We'll see how it goes.


Don

Current: ES8, Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 audio device, SennHeiser HD598 Phones, Focal CMS 40 Powered Monitors, JBL LSR305 Powered Monitors
#2074855 - 05/01/13 08:10 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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I like mine. But I have only had it two weeks and am just learning to play. I bought a Clavinova 440. A friend of mine who plays well came and tried it out and was very impressed.


Yamaha CLP 440 Delivered on April 16 2013
Started playing piano April 16 2013
#2074889 - 05/01/13 09:03 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: dmd]  
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Marko in Boston Offline
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Originally Posted by dmd
Originally Posted by Marko in Boston
10: the first week you after you purchased your shiny new DP

8: after you had it few months go by, you find a few flaws and annoyances

7: after you have it for 6-12 months and you start to see the new model DP's rolling out. Obviously those must be the new 10's

5: you are ready to sell your DP to buy the latest DP

.... and now back to

10: the first week you after you purchased the LATEST shiny new DP



This is pretty close to my pattern.

However, my present DP (ES7) has met my expectations for sound and touch and I am going to try to leave it at that and just concentrate on learning to play it.

We'll see how it goes.


@ DMD
Kidding aside, I feel the same way about my ES7 as you do. I am fortunate that I still feel like im in the honeymoon stage almost 6 months in with it. But Im always curious to see the new ones.



KAWAI ES7 | ROLAND RD-800 | YAMAHA CP4 | YAMAHA STAGEPAS 400i | PRESONUS R65 & T10 | SHURE SRH1540 | SENNHEISER HD650 | K&M OMEGA
#2074911 - 05/01/13 09:20 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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BeccaBb Offline
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I'm still at stage 10 with mine. smile I love it. I'm still learning how to use 1/8th of it's capabilities. I have no desire to go and buy another one. It's been almost a year now and it's great!


Becca
Began: 01-12-11
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Roland RD300NX
1947 Gulbranson spinet piano
#2074921 - 05/01/13 09:39 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: BeccaBb]  
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Temperament Offline
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Hun,EU
If we could agree in the following interpretation of the scores, so these could be applied for valid comparisons over the digital/acoustic boundary as well:

10 = I say I am not tempted anymore to get a new one just for improvements.
0 = I don't want to touch that instrument at all (being disgusting or harmful).

So my evaluations:

  • Current DPs in general <= 4.5
  • Current SW instruments in general <= 6

DPs:
  • Previous CA51 = 2.2
  • Kurzweil PC88 = 1.5

SW-Pianos
  • Pianoteq v4.5 = 5
  • Galaxy VD = 5.3 (with own sound tweaking)
  • Galaxy Bose = 5.2 (with own sound tweaking)
  • Galaxy Blüthner = 4.7
  • Sampletekk Black = 2.7 (update overdue)
  • PMI Emperor = 2.5 (with own sound tweaking)
  • Baurmann edition Dutch Harpsichord (with scripting enhancements)
    = 5.1

Expected score for:
  • CS-10 = 4.3
  • CA-65 = 3.5

Acoustic department:
  • My great 1911 vintage upright Burger & Jacoby = 6.2
  • previous 1924 Förster baby grand = 5

Historical (acoustic):
  • Clavihord (Levai No1. unbound) = 6.5
  • Clavihord (Levai No4. 2-gebunden)= 2.5 (try and error example)

Last edited by Temperament; 05/01/13 10:12 AM. Reason: hints only

Acoustic: own clavichord!, Burger&Jacoby,Biel (nice vintage vertical)
Digital: CA65; Pianoteq; Sampled:Galaxy VintageD+Vienna(Bösendorfer)
Sampletekk Black,PMI, etc...
Harpsi: Beurmann Dutch+Sampletekk, Clavichord:PMI+Wavelore+organs
#2074987 - 05/01/13 11:01 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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Michael_99 Offline
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peterws, I have read your post, here:

Scale of one to ten. What would your ideal be?

Mine scores eight and a half. I`m not sure that my ideal exists . . . or ever will!

_________________________
I will invariably be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed,or numbered

_____________________________________________

Hey, peterws, good post.

A digital is a digital.
A digital is awesome.
Any digital with weighted keys is awesome.
Any digital that has 48 weighted keys is awesome because I can take it and play it anywhere on the earth 24 hours a day - even in outspace or on any planet that we as humans can land on now or in the future. That is how awesome a digital 48 weighted keyboard piano is.

I would like to go to a music store and play the best - I guess - most expensive digital piano that exist on the planet because I am curious of only one things, the sustain action of the digital of pressing a key on the digital - in the piano world they use the electronic/computer term of decay but call it what word you like, it is the action of a piano that when you strike a key as hard as you can like you could do on an acoustic piano and see how long the sound will last compared with any acoustic piano as cheap and a bad as they get - it just isn't the same. I have a really cheap yam and bought it because it was a cheap yam because I don't know were casio have a store to get it fixed if I had to if you will - somebody corrected me and said you get a casio fixed at any guitar store. Well, I never go to guitar stores and don't know anything about them, just piano stores and music stores, if you will, and I have yam motorcycles, yam cd players, yam amps, yam subwoofer speakers, yam everything, if you will - I could keep adding to the list, but you get the point. The point I wanted to make was that the yam store salesman asked me if I wanted a casio that was better than my p-95 and was cheaper - to me it was not a option. Secondly, a digital is a digital, like I said and sadly it is 45 pounds as a keyboard, but you can still carry it easily if you are a champion weightlifter - which I am not - but I can drag it down the street in a snowboard case that have wheels. As long as the digital piano has weighted keys that is all I care about because I want to be able to play a piano period. I try to play my 75 pieces that I play everyday - all the pieces that I know - on the acoustic which is beyond awesome. I try, too, to play all my pieces on the digital but it is just not the same - I mean I have a 20 year old Clavinova which is a different - better action slightly - better - but again it cost a lot in those days and has huge speakers - but again it is not the key action or the sound that matters - it is the sustain/decay that kills my spirit to play it. I used to play the digital after 2:00 a.m when the bars close and the drunks and the criminals are wandering the streets to rob and break into businesses and houses in Canada - I didn't say that right because I am not suggesting drunks do anything bad - I mean only the criminals are doing the robbing and stealing after 2:00 a.m.,etc. so I would play the digital so they couldn't hear me on the street. But now - you know - you can play an acoustic with flat fingers which is very difficult to do - believe me - but it allows you to play pp at it best and lowest level of sound - and while it is still not that great doing pp with flat fingers because if they are not strong, very strong fingers, you get silent keys - here and there because you haven't pressed hard enough or deep enough on the key but I still prefer that than any digital except the 48 weighted keys digital that doesn't exist except as a toy and not playable as of yet because if it did, I would own one if they existed and play after 2:00 a.m. with the drunks and criminals in the streets at night while they stole and robbed!

If I had to give a number out of 10 I would have it as a 10, because I own two plus two other ones which are not weighted key and fewer keys than a piano of 88 - one which I took to a hospital for a month and only have one acoustic which I love more than anything else that exists on the planet be it inanimate, animal or human.

Last edited by Michael_99; 05/01/13 03:37 PM.
#2074994 - 05/01/13 11:06 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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toddy Offline
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Still at the >8.5 stage after 18 months....let's say 9 ..... sometimes I wish I had ivory keys for a better grip and 3 sensors for fast repetitions but these are very minor gripes (you wouldn't have got these unless you were wealthy with an AP). And it's true that a brighter, cleaner sounding SN piano would have been nice but that could be taken care of with a low cost SW upgrade for the future: not important or urgent.

In all, the DP surpassed my expectations by a long way in terms of touch, sound and facilities. Improvements and additions can all be done with software, so no need to change in the foreseeable future.

There's just this abiding anxiety that you're getting something for nothing, which, measured against the old standards, I suppose you are.

EssBrace wrote:

0.0

Or could also be expressed as pointless.
_________________________
Roland RD-1000
Kawai MP10
Yamaha CP1


Woa! Maybe you should check out Casio - or, otoh, a real piano perhaps would do the trick.


Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / Native Instruments K9 ult / ESQL MOR2 Symphonic Orchestra & Choirs / Sample Mod, Trumpet 3 / Garritan CFX lite / Imperfect Samples Steinway / Production Grand C7 compact
Focusrite Saffire 24 / W7, i7 4770, 16GB / MXL V67g / Yamaha HS7s / HD598
#2075004 - 05/01/13 11:38 AM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: toddy]  
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EssBrace Offline
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Originally Posted by toddy
EssBrace wrote:

0.0

Or could also be expressed as pointless.
_________________________
Roland RD-1000
Kawai MP10
Yamaha CP1


Woa! Maybe you should check out Casio - or, otoh, a real piano perhaps would do the trick.


I was trying to subtly suggest that this thread is pointless.

#2075015 - 05/01/13 12:14 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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I think the best sampled software pianos are at a clear 9. I can imagine improvements but not very significant ones.

In terms of the physical action of my piano and other digitals around, maybe a 6.

There are lots of acoustics I don't like as well, though. Both the acoustic grand and upright I play regularly are around this same range. Maybe a little above my digital.

I'm afraid my standards are going up over time.

#2075025 - 05/01/13 12:32 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: EssBrace]  
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toddy Offline
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Originally Posted by EssBrace
Originally Posted by toddy
EssBrace wrote:
0.0
Or could also be expressed as pointless.
_________________________
Roland RD-1000
Kawai MP10
Yamaha CP1

Woa! Maybe you should check out Casio - or, otoh, a real piano perhaps would do the trick.

I was trying to subtly suggest that this thread is pointless.

Maybe so. But not to put too fine an existentialist point on it: what isn't?

Last edited by toddy; 05/01/13 12:34 PM.

Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / Native Instruments K9 ult / ESQL MOR2 Symphonic Orchestra & Choirs / Sample Mod, Trumpet 3 / Garritan CFX lite / Imperfect Samples Steinway / Production Grand C7 compact
Focusrite Saffire 24 / W7, i7 4770, 16GB / MXL V67g / Yamaha HS7s / HD598
#2075043 - 05/01/13 01:03 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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Vid Offline
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10/10 if I consider the alternative which is nothing.



Kawai VPC1, Pianoteq, Galaxy Vintage D
#2075057 - 05/01/13 01:26 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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justpin Offline
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Holmes Chapel
Its fine (CDP200), I have a AP to use I just wish it stopped going out of tune so quickly.

I've tried the PX850, and the P155, the improvements were not gigantic, much like the bloke said in the shop, that the days of quantum leaps is over. The Japanese companies like to drip feed tech.

The only thing I was impressed with was a Kawai with real wooden keys and the RD700NX

#2075074 - 05/01/13 01:59 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: Michael_99]  
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peterws Offline
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Michael, now many times did you come up for air on that sentence ?? BACK TO YOUR PRACTICE! You`ve had enough time out . . .


"I am not a man. I am a free number"

"[Linked Image]"
#2075076 - 05/01/13 02:03 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: EssBrace]  
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peterws Offline
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Northern England.
"I was trying to subtly suggest that this thread is pointless."

"Subtle" is a word you aren`t familiar with, I can tell . . . But my skin is soooo thick . . . Now, then. How many threads on this forum really have a point? Do they have to have? If people feel motivated to respond, then that`s point enough . . .

And you did! grin


"I am not a man. I am a free number"

"[Linked Image]"
#2075083 - 05/01/13 02:10 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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After some 18 months, my fp7-f still gets something close to a 9. In fact, I think I prefer playing on it that on an AP. I do have some small complaints, though:

- The speaker grille buzzes on some notes
- The volume knob controls all outputs at once
- I wish it were lighter
- A bit more bass in the speakers would be nice

#2075092 - 05/01/13 02:36 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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As I've stated before, I'm plenty satisfied with my CP33. The weak link isn't the hardware I'm using.

I like the comments justpin mentioned from a shop: "...the days of quantum leaps is over. The Japanese companies like to drip feed tech."

Drip-feed. Nice. Explains the CP33 / 300 to a large extent.


Last edited by dje31; 05/01/13 03:55 PM.

Yamaha CP33 | Roland XP-30
#2075122 - 05/01/13 03:23 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: toddy]  
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Rocky Mountains
Originally Posted by toddy
Originally Posted by EssBrace
Originally Posted by toddy
EssBrace wrote:
[i]0.0
Or could also be expressed as pointless.

I was trying to subtly suggest that this thread is pointless.

Maybe so. But not to put too fine an existentialist point on it: what isn't?


From an existentialist point of view: Chocolate


I love my old keyboard. To give her a number is degrading.


Ron
Your brain is a sponge. Keep it wet. Mary Gae George
The focus of your personal practice is discipline. Not numbers. Scott Sonnon
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#2075124 - 05/01/13 03:25 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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Michael_99 Offline
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peterws, and that is why I write like I do grin

Last edited by Michael_99; 05/01/13 03:26 PM.
#2075147 - 05/01/13 03:47 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: toddy]  
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Michael_99 Offline
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toddy, I read your post, here:

Still at the >8.5 stage after 18 months....let's say 9 ..... sometimes I wish I had ivory keys for a better grip and 3 sensors for fast repetitions but these are very minor gripes (you wouldn't have got these unless you were wealthy with an AP). And it's true that a brighter, cleaner sounding SN piano would have been nice but that could be taken care of with a low cost SW upgrade for the future: not important or urgent.

In all, the DP surpassed my expectations by a long way in terms of touch, sound and facilities. Improvements and additions can all be done with software, so no need to change in the foreseeable future.

There's just this abiding anxiety that you're getting something for nothing, which, measured against the old standards, I suppose you are.

EssBrace wrote:

0.0

Or could also be expressed as pointless.
_________________________

Well, at the rate that digital are being made, they would soon run out of elephants!

What is an AP? Is that an acoustic or something else?

What is an SN piano?

What is an SW?

And I guess a DP is a digital piano, right?

Thanks for any help.



#2075172 - 05/01/13 04:40 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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toddy Offline
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Ahh yes - elephants: the thing is that 'ivory' means porous plastic (what Yamaha started advertising as 'Ivorite' a few decades ago. These days it is a feature of most mid- hi- priced digital pianos, but far fewer acoustic pianos, strangely enough. In any case, we would not want to see one single tusk of an elephant harmed for the sake of a piano key top....certainly not.

As for the rest, sorry about the ugly abbreviations.

SN is Roland's sound generating system. It stands for 'SuperNATURAL' which admittedly does not help matters.

SW is software, meaning piano sample sets & player systems that run in the computer.

AP is acoustic piano.



Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / Native Instruments K9 ult / ESQL MOR2 Symphonic Orchestra & Choirs / Sample Mod, Trumpet 3 / Garritan CFX lite / Imperfect Samples Steinway / Production Grand C7 compact
Focusrite Saffire 24 / W7, i7 4770, 16GB / MXL V67g / Yamaha HS7s / HD598
#2075178 - 05/01/13 04:49 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: toddy]  
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bennevis Online content
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My score for my R V-P is 9.9/10. (It doesn't use R's SN, as its sounds are M, not S, which is why no other DP can touch it for realism).

Only a B I 290, and possibly a F F308, would score 10/10, but they are both G APs.


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
#2075188 - 05/01/13 04:59 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: mdp92]  
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Originally Posted by mdp92
After some 18 months, my fp7-f still gets something close to a 9. In fact, I think I prefer playing on it that on an AP. I do have some small complaints, though:

- The speaker grille buzzes on some notes


You can fix that by shoving bits of folded card or paper in between the joints. Well, it worked for me.

#2075189 - 05/01/13 05:04 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: bennevis]  
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Originally Posted by bennevis
My score for my R V-P is 9.9/10. (It doesn't use R's SN, as its sounds are M, not S, which is why no other DP can touch it for realism).

Only a B I 290, and possibly a F F308, would score 10/10, but they are both G APs.


10-4


Kawai VPC1, Pianoteq, Galaxy Vintage D
#2075191 - 05/01/13 05:07 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
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Posts: 172
NikkiPiano Offline
Full Member
NikkiPiano  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 172
Hertfordshire, UK
I remind myself how bad all my digitals are by playing them for 10 minutes and then playing my lowly U3. It blows them away in terms of every little possible detail, feel and sound. It's like being deaf for a while and then having your hearing fully restored.

Last edited by NikkiPiano; 05/01/13 05:10 PM.
#2075245 - 05/01/13 06:56 PM Re: How happy are you with your Digital? [Re: peterws]  
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 311
JazzyMac Offline
Full Member
JazzyMac  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 311
World Traveler
I've had my P155 for a month plus two days. I'm happy with it because I researched the heck out of it before I purchased, I love the look, and I appreciate the feel. Not to mention, I feel like I got a great deal on it brand new.

A couple of weeks after purchasing, I started perusing more websites and found 100 next best things, for more money, but also more technology. I felt that maybe I could have found a better keyboard with more research effort.

After visiting a piano store, I felt the keys of the big CVP and didn't feel that much of a difference. I thought I would be tackling a huge difference on the CVP from the P155, but for now the P155 suits my clumsy practices fine.

I love my Yamaha P155; at work I think about coming home to practice on it. I can't wait until a few years pass, and I will get a nice acoustic piano.

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