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I have a choice of a gently used 2006 L190 for $24000 and a new L168 for $28000. Which one would you pick and are those good prices?

I'm also wondering if there were significant changes made to the design of the piano between 2006 and now.

Thanks in advance.

2006 if treated well!

The L190 was a wonderful instrument by 2006 but there have been additional changes since to both models. They are constantly refining.

I would play and consider both. Is the used piano presented well?

I have not _yet_ seen the L190, as it is in a different showroom. However, the store is reputable and I assured that it is literally in mint condition. My biggest problem is that I do not play a piano myself. This is an investment in the musical future of my two daughters so to speak. =)

Both are very fine instruments. The 190 would tend to win out as the increased size does tend to improve the sound quality.

Either instrument would be more than sufficient for any student, and a young pianist could 'grow into' either. As a mature pianist, my ear would draw me to the longer instrument.

The price on the L190 was probably close to full list price when it was new.

According to the listing in the 2006 supplement to "The Piano Book," the price for an ebony finish 190 is $34,650.

I should of stated reasonable retail price. My new Estonia L190 2008 was in the mid/high 20's.

I would offer 18k and pay no more than 20k for the 2006.

Although I have yet to play a (modern) Estonia I just want to state that when it comes to pianos a size difference of 28 cm generally makes a HUGE difference in the quality of sound, all things being equal (which unfortunately they rarely are).
(This is generally a rule of thumb but since you're not a piano player yourself and may not know this).

Sparky - Have you had the glorious experience of playing a Soviet Estonia?

If so, please accept my sympathy.

How do you know this?

I think it could have been almost anything. The present asking price does not have to be related to the original selling price. Also, it is very rare in my experience for Estonia dealers to ask for or get full list price or full SMP price. The pricing protocols in the Piano Buyer have been well known for such a long time that a buyer would have to be very uniformed to pay full list or SMP price.

Take my reasonable retail price, subtract yearly average increases and you get a ballpark number. If my reasonable 2008 price is translated down two years 24k would be a reasonable retail price in 2006.

But again, I would offer 18k and pay no more than 20k for this 2006. It is a buyers market after all.

PL, Mark did qualify the comment later to indicate actual retail price. $24K would be a bit below what I was offered for an Ebony L190 when I bought my Estonia in 2005 (I took a Bubinga), so he's about right there.

To the OP, as for not paying more than $20K for it now, I'm not sure I'd agree with that. Pricing for used pianos depends on the local market. Go ahead and offer $18K, but it's up to the dealer to accept reject or counter your offer. Frankly if I liked the instrument it might be worth $24K to me today. That's the issue what's it worth to the buyer. Kudos to the OP for even considering investing that kind of money in their children's musical efforts. I would agree the dealer is probably willing to negotiate a lower price with a serious buyer, the question is how much lower?

Consider that Estonia, in 2006, was when the instrument was gaining in popularity in the US. At the time, such a well built and fine instrument was considered an extroardinary value. Things have changed in six years and they are sought after instruments, and the prices have increased dramatically.

Asking $24K for this L190 doesn't surprise me at all, considering the demand. If you like the piano, it's time for some serious negotiations.

There have been improvements since 2006 in all of the Estonia models but there is nothing wrong with the older 190.

All things being equal, if you like the sound of both pianos and the 190 is in very good shape, my decision would be based on a two other issues.

1. Where was the piano and how was it cared for? Maintenance, tunings, etc.

2. What type (if any) and how complete of a warranty is being given to you with the purchase of the used piano.

Once those two questions are answered I would be more comfortable offering advice on which piano to buy.

The piano comes from the showroom of a reputable store. They claim one owner and light use.

The warranty covers action, strings, pins, and pin-block for 5 years parts and labor.

Thanks

Has a retailer ever claimed heavy use?

Like, this is a very nice piano, but the poor bastard was beat on like crazy!

Please make sure the soundboard is also covered in this warranty for the same duration and just for peace of mind I would have an independent technician inspect the piano prior to purchase.

Keep us posted!!

ygm,

The SMP (Suggested Maximum Price) of a brand-new Estonia L190 is $41,168. You might be able to negotiate the price down to $32,000 - $37,000. However, L190s are extremely popular now, and the dealer may not be in a negotiating mood. Doesn't hurt to inquire.

Both the L168 and L190 have been given glowing reviews, but the L190 is 9 inches longer, and in that size range 9 inches means a lot. I would opt for the L190, but at a better price than the initial offer.

The 2006 piano was built after Dr. Laul took over Estonia in 2002, and thus has the benefit of the significant changes Laul made in the design. However, I understand that he has made even more changes since then. It might be worth your while to audition a new L190, and decide whether the newest version is worth the extra cost.