Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
What's Hot!!
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
(ad)
Piano Tuning
How to Tune Pianos
(125ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Piano Buyer Guide
Piano Buyer Spring 2017
(ad)
4th Finger Enigma Resolved!
Schumann's 4th Finger Enigma Resolved!
Who's Online Now
46 registered members (barbaram, Agent88, aph123, AZNpiano, 10 invisible), 1,749 guests, and 2 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#2040767 - 02/28/13 02:09 PM Cut off, sent adrift...  
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,960
RonTuner Offline
1000 Post Club Member
RonTuner  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,960
Chicagoland
The PTG is shutting down support of the original list for piano technicians; "pianotech" The archives (hopefully) will remain, but they've tried to replace the mail based list with a forum-type system that doesn't work very well for a lot of the pianotech members. Right now the archives are here:

http://mail.ptg.org/pipermail/pianotech/

A wealth of discussions going back to 1994. They can be downloaded and saved if you don't trust the PTG to protect them or keep them public.

John Delacour has set up a google group to take in the pianotech refugees - it works as a mail-list, but also has an online forum. The term "googletech" is presently being used to describe this new group. I wanted to let techs know that might not be active on that list that there is a move going on...

this came to my mailbox:
John Delacour johndelacour@gmail.com has invited you to join the pianotech
group with this message:

In view of the impending (Apr 1) demise of the PTG Pianotech mailing
list, you are cordially invited to join the Pianotech Google Group,
which, besides being a normal mailing list also has a web
interface. The group at present has already 214 migrants from the
old list.

With best wishes -

John Delacour

Here is the group's description:

This group is for discussion of matters relating to technical aspects of the
piano.

---------------------- Google Groups Information ----------------------

You can accept this invitation by clicking the following URL:

http://groups.google.com/group/pian...rJNlp7kdtv0lzuciJmIggO7to4wuyg&hl=en


(ad 800)
PTG Journal
PTG Journal
#2040985 - 02/28/13 08:15 PM Re: Cut off, sent adrift... [Re: RonTuner]  
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,128
David Boyce Online content
1000 Post Club Member
David Boyce  Online Content
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,128
Scotland
The "googletech" group is shaping up very well!

#2041794 - 03/02/13 11:15 AM Re: Cut off, sent adrift... [Re: RonTuner]  
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 295
Jim Moy Offline
Full Member
Jim Moy  Offline
Full Member

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 295
Fort Collins - Loveland, CO
Ron inadvertently included a URL that may appear to be a link to a subscribe-here page for the Google Group, but it was only a confirmation link for him.

The proper page for subscription is here:

http://groups.google.com/group/pianotech/subscribe

You can also subscribe via email, which is handy if you do not have (or want to use) a Google account. To do this, send a blank email here:

pianotech+subscribe@googlegroups.com

And when you receive a confirmation request email, don't click the link/button in it, simply Reply to it with no modifications to the subject or body, and that will confirm an email subscription.

This is in no way criticism of or advocating leaving PianoWorld for this new group. It's just a service announcement for those who may be members already and have not heard of its impending demise, or for anyone interested in a primarily email based list.



Jim Moy, RPT
Moy Piano Service, LLC
Fort Collins and Loveland, Colorado
http://www.moypiano.com
#2041833 - 03/02/13 01:11 PM Re: Cut off, sent adrift... [Re: Jim Moy]  
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 944
jim ialeggio Offline
500 Post Club Member
jim ialeggio  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 944
shirley, MA
Originally Posted by Jim Moy
This is in no way criticism of or advocating leaving PianoWorld for this new group. It's just a service announcement for those who may be members already and have not heard of its impending demise, or for anyone interested in a primarily email based list.

Jim,

Just clarifying...The syntax above is confusing...

The demise Jim is referring to is the demise of what used to be the PTG's Pianotech email listserve. Pianoworld is in fine shape and not going away.

In shutting down the listserve, the PTG has chosen to cut itself off from the expertise shared by some of the most the knowledgable people in the profession. Archives of the discussions from the last 20years will be kept, I'm told (thank goodness). I think they will be on the PTG website. However, from April 1st on, all discussions, management of the new list, and shared expertise will no longer be under the support or auspices of the PTG, but be functioning on googlegroups.

Jim Ialeggio


Jim Ialeggio
www.grandpianosolutions.com
advanced soundboard and action redesigns
978 425-9026
Shirley Center, MA
(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#2041840 - 03/02/13 01:23 PM Re: Cut off, sent adrift... [Re: RonTuner]  
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,263
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Silverwood Pianos  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,263
Vancouver B. C. Canada

Originally Posted by jim ialeggio

In shutting down the listserve, the PTG has chosen to cut itself off from the expertise shared by some of the most the knowledgable people in the profession.


I was on the understanding that the PTG had developed a new web site and forum… My PTG.org or something like that; is this not the case?


Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."
#2041850 - 03/02/13 01:59 PM Re: Cut off, sent adrift... [Re: Silverwood Pianos]  
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 944
jim ialeggio Offline
500 Post Club Member
jim ialeggio  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 944
shirley, MA
Originally Posted by Silverwood Pianos
I was on the understanding that the PTG had developed a new web site and forum… My PTG.org or something like that; is this not the case?

Yes this is correct. However, a combination of conditions, starting with the way the site was implementated, lead to such unpleasantness over the last 2 years that a gaping wound opened and continues to fester. Leadership, instead of trying to dress and soothe the wound seems intent on rubbing salt into it, if not actively opening other wounds.

Members of the original listserve, the discussion body which, in my view, created a sharing of very specific expertise not found in any other forum anywhere, were "instructed" to move to the new web format. The nature of the website imposition and what many listserve members feel the poor design of the website, lead many of the listserve members to refuse to participate on the new website forums. The old listserve was reopened for the vocal listserve members, without any time commitment. So 2 PTG pianotech forums existed, the old listserve and the new website.

As many of the most knowledgeable techs refused to use the website forum, the website forum is and remains an underused, susbstance weak, milk-toast forum. The old listserve was reopended begrudgingly, and continued its "wild and wooly", expertise heavy, higher use ways.

Leadership chose to close down the listserve permanently, for reasons that we can only guess, since specific conversations of exec have remained unpublished. In any case, the old listserve members were told they had to go elsewhere, and one member of exec actually told us to go to forums outside of PTG. So that's what we have done, and I'm really lik'in it. The chat is becoming as active and specific expertise heavy as it was in its heyday, without the annoying, bureaucratic, creativity sapping meddling.

Jim Ialeggio


Last edited by jim ialeggio; 03/02/13 03:23 PM.

Jim Ialeggio
www.grandpianosolutions.com
advanced soundboard and action redesigns
978 425-9026
Shirley Center, MA
#2041881 - 03/02/13 03:27 PM Re: Cut off, sent adrift... [Re: RonTuner]  
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,263
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Silverwood Pianos  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,263
Vancouver B. C. Canada
Originally Posted by jim ialeggio
Leadership chose to close down the listserve permanently, for reasons that we can only guess, since specific conversations of exec have remained unpublished.


Thanks for the further information about this Jim,

I presume the admin thought by shutting off one side of the equation they would boost activity in the other side, but often decisions such as this have the opposite effect than what was intended. Apparently, with this development of the new Google group, that will not assist with any increase in traffic to the new site.

In an organization that requires membership fees, members have a right to know how, why and where the monies are being spent, similar to governments having to table a budget document to taxpayers.

Members also should have a vote on the shift or some type of referendum as something like this would affect all members who participate in online chat rooms.

Also all members are funding these proposals whether they participate in online chat rooms or not.

This almost amounts to what is called taxation without representation.

It is one of the unfortunate aspects of being group members; the administration puts all funding into general revenue and the makes decisions in a top down manner which often does not reflect the wishes of the majority of paying members.

Same thing happened to the CAPT a few years ago in reverse. Some decided the Google group was not good enough so the CAPT admin developed a web forum, and now the Google group activity has been archived; available on the new web site.

Best of luck with the new group; Are technicians from all walks of life welcome to join up?


Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."
#2041894 - 03/02/13 04:02 PM Re: Cut off, sent adrift... [Re: RonTuner]  
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,230
Olek Offline
9000 Post Club Member
Olek  Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,230
France
Is not the abscence of moderation a problem on Google groups ?

The PTG forums was a very good one , as the CAUT forum, with interesting people, and discussions, but sometime the signal to noise ration was really too low to make the forum easy to read.

I will have a look at the google group.

Thanks for the information


Professional of the profession.
Foo Foo specialist
I wish to add some kind and sensitive phrase but nothing comes to mind.!
#2041911 - 03/02/13 04:44 PM Re: Cut off, sent adrift... [Re: Olek]  
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,128
David Boyce Online content
1000 Post Club Member
David Boyce  Online Content
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,128
Scotland
Dan, you ask
Quote
Are technicians from all walks of life welcome to join up?


Most certainly!

As for questions of moderation, not a great deal is likely to be necessary - any needed input is more likely to be of a general admin nature. Considerations about this are current, and no doubt it will become apparent in time just how much admin input is required.

#2041922 - 03/02/13 05:12 PM Re: Cut off, sent adrift... [Re: Olek]  
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 944
jim ialeggio Offline
500 Post Club Member
jim ialeggio  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 944
shirley, MA
Originally Posted by Silverwood Pianos
Are technicians from all walks of life welcome to join up?

Absolutley, yes, seconding David B

Originally Posted by Olek
but sometime the signal to noise ratio was really too low to make the forum easy to read.

Isaac, creativity requires noise. Squash the noise, and you squash the good ideas too. I have gotten incredible course-changing info from small posts or even single sentences unexpectedly hidden in a long string of noise. The same goes for PW where in the midst of some endless rather noisy tuning and UT conversations, bam, a post just hits me like a lightning bolt.

I find that the noise actually is a reality filter, because really good ideas make it through the noise...at least that's how my brain takes in this kind of info. My antennae are always looking for those quiet hidden gems, because they are almost always there.

Actually the noise issue is one of my big beefs with the website forum. Its all so tidy nothing gets said...feels like a marshmallow jello mold church supper.

Jim Ialeggio

Last edited by jim ialeggio; 03/02/13 05:14 PM.

Jim Ialeggio
www.grandpianosolutions.com
advanced soundboard and action redesigns
978 425-9026
Shirley Center, MA

Moderated by  Piano World 

Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World)
our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, Digital Piano Dolly, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.


Free Shipping* on Jansen Artist Piano Benches, Cocoweb Piano Lamps, Hidrau Hydraulic Piano Benches
(*free shipping within contiguous U.S. only)
(ad)
Pearl River & Ritmuller
Ritmuller Pianos
(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq 6 Out now
(ad)
Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restorations and sales
ad
Pierce Piano Atlas


New Topics - Multiple Forums
What is a Focusrite Scarlett used for...?
by Pologuy. 10/20/17 12:42 AM
Good books on classical music and composers
by carolinakeys. 10/20/17 12:30 AM
Climate in London
by David-G. 10/19/17 07:30 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums44
Topics182,383
Posts2,665,783
Members88,990
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Check It Out!
There's a lot more to Piano World than just the forums.
Click Here to
Explore The Rest of Piano World!!
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2017 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0