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#2025207 - 02/01/13 11:41 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Unlikely. There's not even a line-in on the VPC. It's intended to be an action only. There are precious few digitals with vibrating keys and they tend to be pianos with a strong emphasis on speaker quality (the VPC has no speakers).

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#2025212 - 02/01/13 11:46 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Kawai James Offline
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Yes, gvfarns is correct.


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#2025332 - 02/01/13 02:45 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: HisKidd]  
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Originally Posted by HisKidd
I'm still dumbfounded as to why a first class keyboard/controller would not be optimized for Mac! Please keep us informed as to if and when this added extra will become available. My plan right now would be to pick up an inexpensive Windows laptop just for use with the VPC1.

I can't see why this couldn't be used in a virtual machine, so if you already have a Mac I wouldn't bother buying an extra laptop. I wouldn't want to use a VM for any heavy (realtime) workloads, but apart from the learning functionality (which should be a decidedly light task) the editor seems more like an "offline" thing. It might even be possible to get it working under Wine, which would mean a completely free solution (Linux running on VirtualBox). Though USB support in Wine seems to be under development, so it might be a bit finicky to get working. The editor manual doesn't mention installing the driver as a requirement for using it, if that's not required that could make it a bit easier (James?).

Oh, hi, btw! *waves* I've been a lurker here for a while, nice and friendly place you've got here! smile I don't have a piano yet, I need to get a place where I have room for one first. Soon as I do, though, a piano will likely be one of the first pieces of "furniture" I get. Likely a VPC1, too — I've loved the action of the Kawais I've tried, and the VPC looks just great.

macnetic

#2025611 - 02/01/13 10:33 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Hi macnetic, welcome to the forum!

To respond to your query, The VPC1 can be connected via USB to a Mac or PC using the built-in USB-MIDI drivers included with Windows and OS X.

However, in order to use the VPC Editor, the Kawai USB driver must also be installed (as noted in the VPC1 owner's manual). I believe this is due to the way the VPC1 syncs settings stored in memory with the computer in real-time.

Once again, welcome to the forum!

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
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#2025771 - 02/02/13 09:19 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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James, do you happen to have a full view picture of your VPC-Nord setup? Your nice pics make me want to see the whole thing - in particular, I'd like to see how it looks from the rear wink
Does the Electro fit upon the VPC in a stable way so you can play both keyboards?


Shigeru Kawai SK-2, etc.
#2025776 - 02/02/13 09:31 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Hi maurus, I don't have any pics here at home, but will check at work on Monday.

I recall that the Electro fitted very snuggly on top of the VPC1 - my colleagues and I agree that it was a great match.

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#2025809 - 02/02/13 11:03 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: Kawai James]  
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
We've tested everything thoroughly, so there shouldn't be too many bugs/typos, however if you spot any issues, I would be grateful if you send a private message.

Hi James, it does not seem to be possible to send a private message to you as the following message is displayed: "Kawai James is over their Private Topic limit." FYI.

#2025816 - 02/02/13 11:22 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: Peter B]  
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Originally Posted by Peter B
Originally Posted by Kawai James
We've tested everything thoroughly, so there shouldn't be too many bugs/typos, however if you spot any issues, I would be grateful if you send a private message.

Hi James, it does not seem to be possible to send a private message to you as the following message is displayed: "Kawai James is over their Private Topic limit." FYI.


Peter B...
Thanks for posting this. I've also tried without success to send James a private message. James, how is this done?
Thanks!
H.K.


Keyboards are the best therapy I know of...
______________________________________________
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#2025980 - 02/02/13 06:20 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Everyone, for obvious reasons, wants to contact James, but we each have a limit of 200 PMs (IIRC) imposed by the Piano World system. Contact will be dependent on James deleting old messages.


"you don't need to have been a rabbit in order to become a veterinarian"

mabraman, 2015
#2025992 - 02/02/13 06:56 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Sorry chaps, I had indeed reached the 200 message limit.

I've deleted some messages now, so please feel free to send a PM if you'd rather not post in the forum publicly.

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#2026044 - 02/02/13 10:02 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: dewster]  
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Originally Posted by dewster
Kawai also makes the 9' EX, a couple of 5' grands, and some stuff in between. OK, I'll err on the safe side and assume it's based on a 5' action, thanks!

Dewster, I looked at the RM3 action display model in a piano store and measured the pivot length to 188 mm = 7.4 inch. Using the pictures of GF versus RM3 from Kawai's home page, the pivot length of GF is then estimated to 229 mm = 9.0 inch.

#2026411 - 02/03/13 05:41 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: anotherscott]  
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All this talk of replacing "hardware" every few (3 to 5) years vs the "long term" has me wondering if this new controller board would be "right" for me.
I think my current keyboard had a birthday recently - probably its 30th.,,, nope, that was the speaker cabinet a Peavey KB-100.
The KX-88 predates that by a year or two, but doesn't seem "worn".
After touch ? the thing that FLOODS sound generators with midi messages they don't care about ?
Yeah, I think I have that.

I think the HOT sound generator at the time was he MKS20 ?
Something like that, but I never did get one.

GAS attack ? Yeah, I feel it.
Past due ? Dunno, maybe it will pass (-:

#2026429 - 02/03/13 06:26 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: R_B]  
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Originally Posted by R_B
All this talk of replacing "hardware" every few (3 to 5) years vs the "long term" has me wondering if this new controller board would be "right" for me.


If you like the Kawai wood action and are used to using software pianos you can't go wrong with the VPC1. Go for it! smile


My piano channel on YouTube: Link
#2026516 - 02/03/13 09:20 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: gvfarns]  
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Originally Posted by gvfarns
Unlikely. There's not even a line-in on the VPC. It's intended to be an action only. There are precious few digitals with vibrating keys and they tend to be pianos with a strong emphasis on speaker quality (the VPC has no speakers).


I just read a post stating that the vibration of the keys is an important feature.

http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubb...0Pianos%20and%20Shige.html#Post2026250


I was all ready to buy the VPC1 but now I have to think twice again. Is vibrating keys really such a big deal?

Last edited by adak; 02/03/13 10:35 PM.

Casio Privia PX-150

#2026525 - 02/03/13 09:45 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: Amaruk]  
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Originally Posted by Amaruk
Originally Posted by R_B
All this talk of replacing "hardware" every few (3 to 5) years vs the "long term" has me wondering if this new controller board would be "right" for me.


If you like the Kawai wood action and are used to using software pianos you can't go wrong with the VPC1. Go for it! smile


Does it have after touch ?
How much "better" (however defined) is it than a KX-88 ?

What I am used to is a U-220 and a quadraverb, not at all bad in their day and I suppose my tin ear hasn't appreciated anything significantly "better" (yet).
I have pianoteq, but I don't have a dedicated computer for the keyboard stuff, so hooking things up and loading programs to play is a bit of a hassle.

I am wondering if a Kawai DP would be a better choice, what sort of price are their top of the line uprights ?

#2026531 - 02/03/13 10:09 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: adak]  
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Originally Posted by adak
Is vibrating keys really such a big deal?

No. I believe the only DPs that have modeled this systematically are the Yamaha AvantGrand. Some DPs with built in speakers have vibrations from the speakers that can be felt through the keys. In my view such vibrations are nice to have but not a deal breaker if the action otherwise is great which I find the VPC to be.

#2026541 - 02/03/13 10:20 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Vibrating keys are like fake ivory coatings: some people think it adds a lot, others (like myself) feel that it's essentially a gimmick.

#2026548 - 02/03/13 10:37 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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How about running an Integra 7 or a BK7m with this action. The BK7m would cost about the same as a laptop about $750 with retailers coupons the Integra 7 $2000. but what fun.


Kawai CA93, Lowrey Marquis
#2026659 - 02/04/13 03:51 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: Rich W]  
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Originally Posted by Rich W
How about running an Integra 7 or a BK7m with this action. The BK7m would cost about the same as a laptop about $750 with retailers coupons the Integra 7 $2000. but what fun.


I'll be using it with the Jupiter 80.


Shigeru Kawai SK5
Vintage Vibe 64
Roland LX-15e
Roland Jupiter 80
#2026662 - 02/04/13 04:00 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Are the Jupiter 80's SN pianos the same as the RD-700NX?

Does it include Dr P's favourite 'Studio Grand', for example?

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#2026686 - 02/04/13 05:05 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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If everything works out, I'll be playing it with my little red one, and perhaps my MacBook Pro (mind the software!) - can't wait to test it in a shop. Anyone has an idea when this will be in Europe/Germany?

PS. James, if you come across a full view pic of the VPC1-Electro setup, ...



Shigeru Kawai SK-2, etc.
#2026690 - 02/04/13 05:12 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Hello maurus, I searched through my images, however I'm afriad I do not have any full view images of the Electo+VPC1.

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#2026692 - 02/04/13 05:21 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Thanks James - I'll have to test it myself then. Your efforts are highly appreciated - as always!


Shigeru Kawai SK-2, etc.
#2026697 - 02/04/13 05:29 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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No problem, happy to help.

I should perhaps use this opportunity to point out that my saying "I hope to buy a VPC1 and place my Electro on top" is simply expressing my own, personal intentions.

Please do not confuse this as some kind of official company statement along the lines of "Kawai recommends Nord users purchase a VPC1".

Similarly, just because I plan to place my Electro on top of the VPC1, this does not mean to say that Kawai as a company recommends other VPC1 and Electro users do likewise.

As my signature states, I am employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#2026729 - 02/04/13 08:22 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: Kawai James]  
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Are the Jupiter 80's SN pianos the same as the RD-700NX?

Does it include Dr P's favourite 'Studio Grand', for example?

Cheers,
James
x


Not really but the waveforms are there ... the Studio grand is on the Integra but called another name.


"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally associated with Arturia but my sentiments are my own only.
#2026731 - 02/04/13 08:25 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: Kawai James]  
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Originally Posted by Kawai James

I should perhaps use this opportunity to point out that my saying "I hope to buy a VPC1 and place my Electro on top" is simply expressing my own, personal intentions.

x



If they don't give you one I'd resign and walk up the road. Heaven knows Roland need a good manual writer.


"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally associated with Arturia but my sentiments are my own only.
#2026741 - 02/04/13 09:10 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Maybe so, but that's quite a long walk to do every day...


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#2026805 - 02/04/13 10:56 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: Dr Popper]  
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Originally Posted by Dr Popper
Originally Posted by Kawai James

I should perhaps use this opportunity to point out that my saying "I hope to buy a VPC1 and place my Electro on top" is simply expressing my own, personal intentions.

x



If they don't give you one I'd resign and walk up the road. Heaven knows Roland need a good manual writer.


+1 thumb Whenever I have to look up some technical info in my FP-7F manual, I find myself thinking "Too bad that Kawai James didn't write this one"...seriously!

K.


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#2026813 - 02/04/13 11:06 AM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: Kawai James]  
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Are the Jupiter 80's SN pianos the same as the RD-700NX?

Does it include Dr P's favourite 'Studio Grand', for example?

Cheers,
James
x


Not as much tweaking possible but I believe the underlying SN pianos are the same. Not entirely sure because I don't have the 700NX.


Shigeru Kawai SK5
Vintage Vibe 64
Roland LX-15e
Roland Jupiter 80
#2027581 - 02/05/13 06:30 PM Re: Kawai VPC [Re: davinwv]  
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Today I had the opportunity to visit the Thomann showroom at the company headquarter. The showroom alone is probably the biggest music store in Germany and the top modern dispatch center is huge.

I was visiting to playtest a few DPs and virtual instruments and to find something that could replace the MP6.

I must say that I now have a different opinion on the VPC1 than before.

I spent nearly four hours walking back and forth between the acoustic piano department and the digital piano department to A/B test the real deal and the virtual implementations and to get a feel for the differences between the actions and the sounds. I learned a few things that put the VPC1 in a different context than before.

1. The sound of a real Kawai Grand is actually pretty impressive but also quite different from the Grand Piano Sample in my MP6. I'd take an MP10 that sounded like the Kawai Concert Grand I tried in a heartbeat.

2. I never had the opportunity to play on a grand piano before (my school uses uprights that are pretty worn out as school pianos usually are) and the action feels quite a bit different from the action on an upright. The first few tries I didn't even manage to get a sound out of it because the whole mechanism is not like I'm used to.

3. Most DPs I tried are actually quite close to the action on a standard upright but only a select few felt at least similar to the grands I tried. Honorable mentions go to the MP10 and the Roland RD700NX and V-Piano

4. The MP10 had hands down (Hah!) the best action of the bunch, it wasn't necessarily the best emulation of the feel of the grands I tried but it felt almost 'seamless' when I played it. The Rolands came second but I didn't like their Ivory Touch coating at all.

5. I instantly fell in love with the piano sounds in the Nord Stage 2 and Nord Piano 2. They are pretty impressive considering the small size of 500 MB and I caught myself just going back to the Nord to play a little bit more. It's an inspiring instrument. That being said I could never live with the Fatar Keyboard action. It's pretty much worse than the Yamaha, Kawai and Roland Pianos I tried. It felt artificial and 'plasticky' and the whole board is actually quite 'noisy' because the inside of the Nord is not properly insulated against noise and acts as a resonance chamber for the noise of all the button presses and the action.

6. The Pianoteq Pianos both sounded more lifelike and more artificial at the same time than their sampled counterparts to me. I couldn't handle it because it sounded eerie. Every note I played was a hodgepodge of 'that sounded quite like a real piano and yet it sounded not like a real piano at all'. I can't describe it in a better way than that.

If the Nord Piano 2 or Stage 2 had come with the action of the MP10 (or even the Roland RD700NX) and was properly noise insulated I'd have instantly bought it. Instead it felt like a great instrument had been ruined by a sub-par keybed. It was quite sobering.

So I opted for a copy of Synthogy Ivory 2 and a RME babyface instead and will probably keep my MP6 for the forseeable future (at least until the VPC1 comes out and I had a chance to play the PX-5S)

It was a toss up between Ivory 2 and the Galaxy Vintage D (which sounded pretty amazing).

So after my recent experience the VPC1 seems like a pretty good idea and James's setup makes a lot of sense. If I'd go for a Nord I'd probably go for the Electro4 D (even though it has a smaller memory for samples) or the SW73 version of the Stage 2. This would offer you both a waterfall option and a great piano action.

So kudos to Kawai for the VPC1

Last edited by Nigeth; 02/05/13 06:32 PM.
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