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#1969956 - 10/07/12 05:20 PM Upright piano for small room  
Joined: May 2007
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iccaro Offline
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iccaro  Offline
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Hi,normally everybody is looking for upright pianos as tall as the pocket allows, because tonal advantages of tall pianos. I assume that the sound of taller pianos is also louder.

My question is: if I put a piano into a small room (6 m2), could a be a problem if the piano sound is too much loud? Should I buy a smaller piano, or this idea has no sense?

Thanks for your opinions.

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#1969990 - 10/07/12 06:29 PM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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BDB Offline
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Taller pianos are not necessarily much louder. You might be able to coax a bit more sound out of them, but the efficiency at which pianos convert the mechanical energy of your fingers to the vibrational energy of the strings is fairly constant no matter what the size of the piano. The only difference is that larger pianos are usually better at having the vibrational energy sound musical. In other words, the larger the piano, the more of the sound coming out is music, rather than noise.


Semipro Tech
#1970100 - 10/07/12 10:47 PM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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gnuboi Offline
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Just want to second BDB... all the "good" ones seem to be loud regardless of size. If you get a very old entry-quality console... those tend to be quiet.

#1970108 - 10/07/12 11:09 PM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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backto_study_piano Offline
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Size, while being a part of the equation, is not always the issue. I occasionally play a small old piano - it's really loud, I suspect because the hammers are hard enough to perform carpentry with. Play various pianos, listening to how loud. In a small room, a bright piano can often sound louder than it really is.


Alan from Queensland, Australia (and Clara - my Grotrian Concert & Allen Organ (CF-17a)).
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#1971651 - 10/11/12 02:14 AM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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Jean Claude Offline
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France
6m² is a tiny space for any upright, are you sure that there will be enough room to sit comfortably at the piano and that the entrance door will still open once the instrument is in place? In any case you may well find that the sound is unpleasantly loud and that the short echo will drive you to insanity or deafness (maybe both)

Maybe a digital piano (with headphones) would be a better idea.

#1971673 - 10/11/12 03:53 AM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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Withindale Offline
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Suffolk, England
I have a piano in a room that is about 6m² but it does have quite a high ceiling, and there is an opening like an open window into the hall above the door. It's fine, but I'd need earplugs to play at fff all the time which I don't. You may need some other stuff in the room to tame the acoustics.


Ian Russell
Schiedmayer & Soehne, 1925 Model 14, 140cm
Ibach, 1905 F-IV, 235cm
#1971690 - 10/11/12 06:01 AM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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Minnesota Marty Offline

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Minnesota Marty  Offline

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Joined: May 2012
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Rochester MN
Help Me!

Being in the USA, I'm not sure what 6m² is in size. If I'm reading it correctly, would that be 3m. X 3m.? If that's the case, it would be about 10 feet X 10 feet. That's a small bedroom over here and would certainly be big enough for an upright.

Curious,


Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
#1971693 - 10/11/12 06:12 AM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: Minnesota Marty]  
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Withindale Offline
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Suffolk, England
6'6" x 10' or about 8' square.


Ian Russell
Schiedmayer & Soehne, 1925 Model 14, 140cm
Ibach, 1905 F-IV, 235cm
#1971706 - 10/11/12 06:33 AM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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Minnesota Marty Offline

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Joined: May 2012
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Rochester MN
Thanks,

That would make it about the size of a practice room at a school. Still usable as a studio space for an upright.


Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
#1971751 - 10/11/12 09:21 AM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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Pianolance Offline
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Nashville, TN
Minn Mart is correct. Many colleges and universities have practice rooms that size and upright pianos in those rooms. Some of it might have to do with any sound treatment of the room, such as carpeting. You can also put some sound absorbing material behind the piano soundboard, between the piano and the wall and that will help quiet down a loud piano.


Knabe 5'2" Louis XV Walnut circa 1927
Very part time piano broker.
#1971767 - 10/11/12 10:00 AM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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KurtZ Offline
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The Heart of Screenland
My 48" is in a 9.5 by 11 foot bedroom. 9.6 sq meters. It's a pretty normal room with some stuff in it, a tall book case, light drapes and an oriental rug that covers most of the floor. It's not exceptionally loud and there's no short echo problem.

Kurt


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#1971851 - 10/11/12 01:36 PM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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iccaro Offline
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The room is indeed almost 7 square m. Now I have a full size electronic piano, an apart from this I have four guitars and bookshelves. So the space inside the room is not the problem, but the access for the piano. Of course it is not the ideal to play, but I live in a small flat.

#2019817 - 01/23/13 06:00 PM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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PNO40 Offline
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PNO40  Offline
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A North Atlantic Island former...
Apologies for reviving this dormant thread, but ...

What would someone recommend to obtain a clean sound in such circumstances? That is, if the problem is not that resultant sound is loud, but that it is overly 'muddy', with too many reflections clouding the direct sound from the piano. Is the formulae the same as that for quietening the piano, or are there any other tricks that may be useful?

With thanks in advance,

P.

#2019846 - 01/23/13 06:50 PM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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Steven Y. A. Offline
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Toronto
in music room acoustics (partially related to my profession), the ideal situation: you want the reflection achieve within certain delay "reveberation", preferably from rear angle - this is the principle (was discovered in 60s, the Berlin Model) new concert halls are based on.
you can calculate your room by using Sabian equation, but it may sound complicated.

to make it short: in a larger room, where sound reflection is less than desired can be achieved by adding reflector.
in your case, probably too much undesired sound reflection, the easiest way is to put soft materials in your room (anywhere, ur sofa is considered as soft material as well), this well help to absorb most frequency except the bass. leave the door open will help lower frequency wave to transmit. theres no other practical way to stop the bass.


PLEYEL P124
#2019868 - 01/23/13 07:20 PM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: Steven Y. A.]  
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mahermusic Offline
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Originally Posted by Steven Y. A.
(anywhere, ur sofa is considered as soft material as well),


What is a ur sofa?


Charles R. Walter 1520 QA Mahogany #531739 w/ High Polish, Renner and Quiet Pedal
#2019953 - 01/23/13 09:52 PM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: mahermusic]  
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musicpassion Offline
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Originally Posted by mahermusic
Originally Posted by Steven Y. A.
(anywhere, ur sofa is considered as soft material as well),


What is a ur sofa?


Your sofa. It's an abbreviation from txting.


Pianist and Piano Teacher
#2026473 - 02/03/13 06:38 PM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: Steven Y. A.]  
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PNO40 Offline
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PNO40  Offline
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A North Atlantic Island former...
Thanks Steven.

I laid down a thick wool rug under the piano, moved the piano around 40 cm/16 inches from the wall, and placed another similar rug on the remaining exposed wood floors. The difference is palpable, and it is hard to believe such a small change could make such a big difference. Though I had been investigating all kinds of specially designed acoustic treatment products, this has achieved the desired result.

With thanks,

P.

#2026616 - 02/04/13 12:34 AM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: iccaro]  
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Steven Y. A. Offline
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Steven Y. A.  Offline
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I'm very glad to hear things worked out for yo in the end smile

Steven


PLEYEL P124
#2026804 - 02/04/13 09:54 AM Re: Upright piano for small room [Re: musicpassion]  
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malkin Offline
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*sigh* Salt Lake City
Originally Posted by musicpassion
Originally Posted by mahermusic
Originally Posted by Steven Y. A.
(anywhere, ur sofa is considered as soft material as well),


What is a ur sofa?


Your sofa. It's an abbreviation from txting.


I was hoping ursofa was the original, prototypical, or seminal sofa, like urtext.


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