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It seems to happen time and time again here, a student who has a piano teacher and takes regular lessons, posts a question online, wanting input from teachers here. I don't get it, why do they do it?
I would understand if they had asked their own teacher, the teacher replies sternly, "Though shalt not foray into such and such a style!" and they want a second opinion. But, no, they just don't want to ask.
Are they embarrassed? Shy? Do they want to prove they can do it alone (in which case, why ask here?) These are adults who have gone out of their way to organize lessons for themselves, so they must have some ability to communicate.
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Maybe because they already know their teacher's answer and would like a second opinion from those reading this forum who are accomplished, professional teachers?
Why would anyone seek a second opinion from a doctor, lawyer, or financial advisor?
Reasonable teachers can have different views and generally know more than students. Students sometimes want to know the different -- but reasonable -- approaches taken by teachers other than their own. That's part of how an adult endeavors to "organize lessons for (him)self", as you put it.
Last edited by ClsscLib; 01/08/13 07:38 AM.
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But I get what tlt is saying, many of these students don't even give their teachers a chance at a first opinion before seeking a 2nd. And I'm sure every teacher wonders if their students are doing the same - no tasking them something that they can certainly help them with if they knew it was something the student wanted.
I often will go out of my way with adult students especially and ask them if there's something specific they'd like to work on, perhaps in a different style just to be sure. A lot of times we teachers are left without any direction from the student as far as interests are concerned and so we just proceed with what we feel is necessary.
Getting feedback from a student is crucial and desired, however, at least from the good teachers I know.
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If I thought they had really asked, then I would be fine with them asking here. Maybe they have already picked up negative vibes and decided it isn't safe to ask. Again, this makes sense.
What I worry about is that they may simply assume (that a teacher who teaches classical isn't interested in jazz, or vice versa) and assume wrongly.
There are lots of things I'm interested in that I don't routinely bring up in lessons, but we could take a digression into.
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Not every adult has access to master teachers (such as are found on this forum!) <g>
Adults may be satisfied with some but not all of their teacher's abilities. Or the teacher might have convenient hours or prices, or just be likable. Rather than change teachers, they may just attempt to supplement what they fear is missing.
gotta go practice
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Well, I don't really ask for advice from the teachers here, but I do ask questions in ABF that I could ask my teacher.
I have different reasons and I can imagine others
1. The first reason for me would be that I've just finished my lesson and I've thought of a question, I am dying to get an answer asap (even though, really, it could wait).... and I don't want to call or email my teacher about it - it isn't worth disturbing him. So I post.
2. Just to see what other people think - a sort of "reality check" before bringing it up with the teacher.
There is a fear of being in "unknown territory" and not wanting to appear foolish or unknowledgeable in front of THE TEACHER! Even though I know that my teacher would behave respectfully and kindly, we all deal with different levels of how much we're willing to put ourselves "out there" and show our ignorance.
3. To find out if we are different or the same - is my question a common one? Do other people want to do xyz too, or is it just me?
That's just off the top of my head.
Sure, I think it is better to talk in person rather than speak to anonymous folks on the net - but sometimes the folks we have not met in person can help us get over something that we're not sure how to handle, help us to find a better way of expressing our ideas - or even of figuring out what exactly needs to be expressed. A testing ground, role-playing practice run so to speak.
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I would be so very happy if my students would call me with any questions they have, especially if they have just had their lesson! That tells me a great deal about what I need to be doing as a teacher and what they need as students.
B.A., Piano, Piano Pegagogy, Music Ed.
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because I find it easier to as a room of strangers a "dumb" question than someone I see for 60 seconds a week. But when I figure out what I'm asking (by asking someplace like here)and get input I feel like I have a less dumb question and some ideas.
Also the first couple of months it felt...intimidating.
I guess that I am naturally a shy person doesn't help.
I am also the kind of person who doesn't like one answer - I like to see all the different thoughts and ideas.
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First, this seems to be a very friendly forum. Questions, dumb or not, got answers. Not just a standard answers, but answers from different angles and levels. The collective wisdom presented here is probably well beyond any single teacher out there. And that invites new questions.
Second, many teachers have back to back lessons, there is simply no room for a student/parents to ask questions between lessons. And the student/parent does not want to spend half of the lesson time to discuss questions that are not critical enough.
Third, the anonymous nature of an internet forum makes people far more open. People asked thing here that they will never ask a teacher in person, and teachers have said things here that they would never say directly to students/parents.
Of course discussions here does not replace the communication with teachers. However, it can be a great supplement to a healthy student/parent/teacher relationship.
And I really appreciate everyone here that cared to answer the questions.
Last edited by The Monkeys; 01/08/13 04:42 PM.
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Second, many teachers have back to back lessons, there is simply no room for a student/parents to ask questions between lessons. And the student/parent does not want to spend half of the lesson time to discuss questions that are not critical enough. I am very grateful for the teachers who do share their expertise with students here on this forum, and have asked for advice several times, but this reason seems odd. Teachers have limited time all around (as do we all), so why do you feel that you don't want to infringe on the lesson time, where you are paying the teacher to pay attention to all the issues surrounding your or your child's learning, including the perhaps less-than-critical issues -- but feel that it's OK to ask teachers here to take out time from what they might primarily be using the forum for (perhaps, to learn to teach better or share their experience to help other teachers teach better), and answer your questions for free?
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Second, many teachers have back to back lessons, there is simply no room for a student/parents to ask questions between lessons. And the student/parent does not want to spend half of the lesson time to discuss questions that are not critical enough. I am very grateful for the teachers who do share their expertise with students here on this forum, and have asked for advice several times, but this reason seems odd. Teachers have limited time all around (as do we all), so why do you feel that you don't want to infringe on the lesson time, where you are paying the teacher to pay attention to all the issues surrounding your or your child's learning, including the perhaps less-than-critical issues -- but feel that it's OK to ask teachers here to take out time from what they might primarily be using the forum for (perhaps, to learn to teach better or share their experience to help other teachers teach better), and answer your questions for free? This is an observation, not saying this is a right thing to do, but people do that anyways. There were similar discussions in this forum about this behaviour.
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Having said that, I feel I need to try to be introspective about the reasons why I have sometimes posted questions here.
What I have asked the most are questions where aspects of how my then-teacher was teaching didn't match up with ideas I was gaining from reading this and other forums, and I wanted to check if I was on target with questioning my lessons, before raising the matter with my teacher. Primarily what I got in reply was the advice to speak to my teacher, but no clear response on "that sounds off to me" or "that's actually perfectly fine".
The end result after posting here and receiving that advice was that I raised the issues in various ways with my teacher -- obliquely in a way though, because I wasn't going to flat-out say "I don't like the way you're teaching me, please change." And also without feeling necessarily that I was justified in wanting some things to be different. Ultimately they all remained issues for me, and other issues arose, and her teaching didn't change, and it wasn't providing me things I was increasingly wanting from my lessons no matter how much I asked for them, and I became more confident in thinking that one could expect to get these other things in lessons from the proper teacher and that I wasn't being unreasonable, so although the proximate cause of my ending lessons was financial, if I do get enough money again for lessons I will find a different teacher.
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I was thinking about playing the piano, and felt I should add, to be fair, that I learned some very useful things from my teacher also. Also it was by taking lessons with her that I was able to get unstuck from the level I was at before the lessons. (I was self-taught as a child; music lessons were never an option then.)
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"but feel that it's OK to ask teachers here to take out time from what they might primarily be using the forum for (perhaps, to learn to teach better or share their experience to help other teachers teach better), and answer your questions for free?"
I think some people are kind, they might have a moment and if not, no response is not rudeness but shows a lack of time/interest/desire to respond. I have searched and there have been requests for a parent forum but none was created (probably blind parents leading blind parents creates a different set of issues).
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Why ask here?
Because they can!
Learner
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We have heard from many individuals, whose opinions I respect, on why THEY might ask questions on the Forums, INSTEAD of asking their own teachers essentially the same questions. Here might be a compelling reason to NOT ask such questions on the Forums: WRONG ANSWERS There is the classically ludicrous level of WRONG ANSWERS, typically happening more often on the Non-Classical Pianist Forum than with the Teachers’ Forum. A “student†asks something like, “How do you play a Db9 chord?†The first person to answer is anxious to demonstrate how smart s/he is, and writes, “ D and F# and A and C and Eb, but if you want it to sound really cool, leave out the D, and try adding the #11th and the 13th. Then, play the Aeolean mode on B in your right hand. Change inversions frequently. Really a ‘happening’ sound.†Someone else argues with this. By the fifth or sixth post, an intelligent individual has chimed in, and is inquiring of the OP if the Db9 is a D-chord with a flatted ninth, or a Db chord with a major ninth. Of course, this critical question gets obliterated in the chatter. The other aspect of WRONG ANSWERS from the Forums has to do with the student’s level of preparedness. If the individual asking the question(s) is a beginner, s/he will require a completely different level and depth of explanation, than if s/he is an advanced student. Here, THE teacher of this student is fully aware of which explanation to give, and why. The rest of us are taking a “stab in the darkâ€. OR, better yet, I could use this precise, current thread as an example of BOTH: https://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubb...0ear%20/%20Fake%20books.html#Post2009745So, for those of you inclined to tap into this vast storehouse of wisdom and knowledge that we call the Forums, I certainly agree that you will get a much BROADER RANGE of answers to your questions. Equally, many of you also have enough knowledge to filter through the pile of answers - right and not-so-right - and sift out the garbage. But what about those who are asking questions WITHOUT enough knowledge? Without the ability of sift? Ed
In music, everything one does correctly helps everything else.
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Ed's just taken the words right out of my mouth.
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We have heard from many individuals, whose opinions I respect, on why THEY might ask questions on the Forums, INSTEAD of asking their own teachers essentially the same questions. Here might be a compelling reason to NOT ask such questions on the Forums: WRONG ANSWERS There is the classically ludicrous level of WRONG ANSWERS, typically happening more often on the Non-Classical Pianist Forum than with the Teachers’ Forum. A “student†asks something like, “How do you play a Db9 chord?†The first person to answer is anxious to demonstrate how smart s/he is, and writes, “ D and F# and A and C and Eb, but if you want it to sound really cool, leave out the D, and try adding the #11th and the 13th. Then, play the Aeolean mode on B in your right hand. Change inversions frequently. Really a ‘happening’ sound.†Someone else argues with this. By the fifth or sixth post, an intelligent individual has chimed in, and is inquiring of the OP if the Db9 is a D-chord with a flatted ninth, or a Db chord with a major ninth. Of course, this critical question gets obliterated in the chatter. The other aspect of WRONG ANSWERS from the Forums has to do with the student’s level of preparedness. If the individual asking the question(s) is a beginner, s/he will require a completely different level and depth of explanation, than if s/he is an advanced student. Here, THE teacher of this student is fully aware of which explanation to give, and why. The rest of us are taking a “stab in the darkâ€. OR, better yet, I could use this precise, current thread as an example of BOTH: https://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubb...0ear%20/%20Fake%20books.html#Post2009745So, for those of you inclined to tap into this vast storehouse of wisdom and knowledge that we call the Forums, I certainly agree that you will get a much BROADER RANGE of answers to your questions. Equally, many of you also have enough knowledge to filter through the pile of answers - right and not-so-right - and sift out the garbage. But what about those who are asking questions WITHOUT enough knowledge? Without the ability of sift? Ed +1. Most often, the teacher who knows what their student has learned and what they're capable of are the best ones to answer their questions, no matter how "dumb" they may seem. Most teachers are delighted when a student is asking questions, because it usually means they're thinking about what is being taught, or it gives us insight into the student's interests, thought-process, and most importantly, understanding of what was taught. The latter is really important because if the student asks a question that clearly shows they did not understand what was taught, then the teacher knows they were not veyr good at explaining it for them. It gives us another chance to explain it differently. Yes, that takes up lesson time. But isn't that what the lesson is for? To learn how to play piano better?
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1. My teacher takes more time to respond than here. Particularly if he's on holidays for a few weeks
2. Teacher's time is expensive, so it's better if I am far prepared as possible before going to lesson.
3. It's good to hear other than the teacher's ideas and make up my own mind.
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1. My teacher takes more time to respond than here. Particularly if he's on holidays for a few weeks
2. Teacher's time is expensive, so it's better if I am far prepared as possible before going to lesson.
3. It's good to hear other than the teacher's ideas and make up my own mind. I think the question is more rather than asking your teacher, you ask here. So it's not asking your teacher and other teachers, it's instead of asking your teacher that is the issue.
private piano/voice teacher FT
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