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#1998685 - 12/13/12 12:05 AM Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330  
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BoringPat Offline
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2 years ago, I bought the Casio PX-330 for my then 4 years old child and myself to learn the piano. It has been fantastic and served our purpose well.

Now that I can confirm that my child and me are both going to continue learning piano, I am planning to upgrade to something better in the year 2013. Any suggestion from the fine folks here?

My budget is around $2000-$2500. I would say I start to feel the limitation of the CASIO PX-330's touch and a more sophisticated touch mechanic is a priority of this upgrade.

I have no complain with the PX-330's Grand Piano's sound. But the speakers of the 330 clearly cannot deliver the bass and cannot make the player feel the vibration. I can't help but feel I am "outside" the sound, if you can understand what I mean.

Thank you for your advice in advance.

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#1998690 - 12/13/12 12:24 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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4g63mr Offline
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We'll if you want something still portable the kawai es7 is getting a lot of praise.

Otherwise a lot of praise goes to other high end kawais like the cp series or the Roland's. hp series.

#1998699 - 12/13/12 12:33 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: 4g63mr]  
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BoringPat Offline
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No, I don't think we need the portability. Which one in the CP series and HP series in particular you would recommend?

#1998768 - 12/13/12 06:12 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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KLSinCT Offline
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Originally Posted by BoringPat
2 years ago, I bought the Casio PX-330 for my then 4 years old child and myself to learn the piano. It has been fantastic and served our purpose well.

Now that I can confirm that my child and me are both going to continue learning piano, I am planning to upgrade to something better in the year 2013. Any suggestion from the fine folks here?

My budget is around $2000-$2500. I would say I start to feel the limitation of the CASIO PX-330's touch and a more sophisticated touch mechanic is a priority of this upgrade.

I have no complain with the PX-330's Grand Piano's sound. But the speakers of the 330 clearly cannot deliver the bass and cannot make the player feel the vibration. I can't help but feel I am "outside" the sound, if you can understand what I mean.

Thank you for your advice in advance.


The Roland FP-7F with a pair of studio monitors added for better speakers would be an excellent choice for your budget.

K.


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#1998786 - 12/13/12 07:17 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: KLSinCT]  
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Originally Posted by KLSinCT

The Roland FP-7F with a pair of studio monitors added for better speakers would be an excellent choice for your budget.

K.


Thank you for the suggestion. I have tried a bit the Roland FP-7F at my local music store. Definitely, the piano sound is more sophisticated (for lack of a better word) than the one in my CASIO PX-330. And key action is definitely different.

I guess my question to owners of FP-7F and PX-x30 series in this forum is: Would you consider it a significant upgrade? Will the teacher (who comes to my house) able to teach more nuance with this upgrade? Thank you in advance!

#1998805 - 12/13/12 08:17 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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spanishbuddha Online content
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The PX330 is like a toy compared to the FP7F. I say that having also owned, enjoyed, and appreciated very much a PX330. A friend of mine lets me play his FP7F, and the tone variations or timbre available through different dynamics is outstanding. So I would say it is a significant upgrade.

Last edited by spanishbuddha; 12/13/12 08:19 AM.
#1998814 - 12/13/12 08:46 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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personne Offline
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Originally Posted by BoringPat
My budget is around $2000-$2500. I would say I start to feel the limitation of the CASIO PX-330's touch and a more sophisticated touch mechanic is a priority of this upgrade.

But the speakers of the 330 clearly cannot deliver the bass and cannot make the player feel the vibration. I can't help but feel I am "outside" the sound, if you can understand what I mean.

In this price range, I would probably recommend Yamaha Clavinova CLP-440 from what I've seen.
Roland HP-503 and DP-90 / DP-90S also fit into the range, but have may be too little power.
If you want to feel incide the sound and have good bass, look for models with more power and more speakers, 12Wx2 or 20Wx2 may not be enough IMO. But most of such models are outside of your price range though, and I do not no how comfortable you are extending your budget to mid- or higher-end models.


Roland HP-507RW | Yamaha U1
#1998820 - 12/13/12 08:56 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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Wuffski Offline
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As I we have just have had a similar question elsewhere I can very quickly copy&paste my opinion here again wink :

Well, the sounds of the CLP and HP are so different colored, that I would first ask you back, which one you like more? Then I would remind you, that the bright sound of the CLP better cuts through if playing in a band, and might most likely appear more alive for modern music, while the mellow HP sound might be better suited for classic music played solo.

If the sound decision towards Roland or Yamaha is done, you could check which action comforts you and your budget best and compare the HP-503 and 505, and the CLP 440 and 470.

If you think, that you are also going to make a lot of use of the other tones, which are not piano but organ, acordeon, etc..., then also listen to them carefully. I am not so happy with this part of my HP-505, although I am overhelmed by its pure piano qualities.

Finally, if somebody will frequently practice with headphones, while aside somebody wants to relax, watch TV, read a book, then keep in mind that the keyboard mounted to a cabinet furniture style digital piano of Roland makes the loudest mechanical noise in comparison to Yamaha and Kawai cabinet mounts.

I can´t speak about the Kawai instruments. So far my impression is, that they are much more similar to the Yamahas, than to the Rolands.

I should finally add, that the Casio sound you are used to, in my opinion comes closer to the Yamaha sound than to the Roland sound. The responsiveness of timbre to the dynamic key action in the new Casios (and in the Roland) to me appear much more pronounced than in the Yamahas and Kawais.

Unfortunately, I am waiting for the answer from the Roland support about an issue which I encountered in the metronome functionality of my HP-505. If they can solve it, then I can continue to recommend this series, but if not then I would have to warn about a very annoying bug in there.

#1999203 - 12/13/12 11:02 PM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: Wuffski]  
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BoringPat Offline
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Originally Posted by personne

In this price range, I would probably recommend Yamaha Clavinova CLP-440 from what I've seen.
Roland HP-503 and DP-90 / DP-90S also fit into the range, but have may be too little power.
If you want to feel incide the sound and have good bass, look for models with more power and more speakers, 12Wx2 or 20Wx2 may not be enough IMO. But most of such models are outside of your price range though, and I do not no how comfortable you are extending your budget to mid- or higher-end models.


Originally Posted by Marco M
As I we have just have had a similar question elsewhere I can very quickly copy&paste my opinion here again wink :

Well, the sounds of the CLP and HP are so different colored, that I would first ask you back, which one you like more? Then I would remind you, that the bright sound of the CLP better cuts through if playing in a band, and might most likely appear more alive for modern music, while the mellow HP sound might be better suited for classic music played solo.

If the sound decision towards Roland or Yamaha is done, you could check which action comforts you and your budget best and compare the HP-503 and 505, and the CLP 440 and 470.



Thank you Personne and Marco very much for the replies. This morning I have gone to the local Yamaha store to test out the CLP 440. I am surprised that it sound so, hmmm, electronic with those notes coming out of the built in speakers. But then when I move on to the CLP 480, Wow, what a big different! Consider that both use the same sound engine, I can definitely see how speakers configuration contribute. It is only on CLP 480 that I can see it as an upgrade from my PX-330. And I must say it is not a huge upgrade. And there is a huge price gap between 440 and 480 (about $800). So basically, I need to pay $800 extra for a better amp/speakers ...

I definitely need to check out Roland HP series. As Marco suggested, I think I am looking for a certain sound. Hopefully Roland can give that to me with a reasonable price. Will update after I test them out.


#1999221 - 12/13/12 11:47 PM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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Since you like the sound of your Casio, the most obvious model to consider would be the AP-650. The action is a big step up, the sound is improved but has a similar underlying character as the PX-330, and the speakers spec very powerful. I'd be amazed if it didn't deliver for less money.

Roland's HP's are excellent but are above your budget. Do try the DP-90. There is no lack of power (the wattage can be misleading) but certainly the larger speakers have added fullness as you move up the line.


Sam Bennett
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#2000535 - 12/17/12 01:37 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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I have tried out AP-650 with my child in the weekend. The touch is definitely different. I would say it feel lighter than the action in PX-330. The default touch level (level = 2) was almost already too light. I hit a ff sound when intended to hit a mf sound. But to be fair, I was able to differentiate p and mp better on this keyboard (not sure if true though). The sound is slightly improved but the added other piano sounds are welcomed additions. The flip-top feel almost a gimmick though ...

The shop only have 2 Kawai DPs, and there were both lower models (CL26 and CE220). CL26's keys felt great. If it is any indication of Kawai's more advanced key actions, Kawai would definitely on my consideration list.

#2000539 - 12/17/12 01:57 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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That's interesting. I'm surprised you found the AP-650 lighter. Between the PX-330 and PX-350, the newer is definitely a little firmer and more even through the stroke.

We have a Roland LX-15 with a lid. In our large, open showroom, the effect is small, but in a more typical home setting, the lid effect is very noticeable. Our customers don't really appreciate it until they get it home. I wonder if this is the same with the AP-650?

Some of the new AP sounds have an volume limiter in the sample which I find unusual. You can moderate it with the volume knob, but for one AP you may set the knob at 12-1 o'clock position and for another you have to go almost to full power. I wonder if that came up in the sounds as you were testing?

Definitely keep pursuing the Kawais. I'll be curious when you compare them with Roland, too.


Sam Bennett
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#2000548 - 12/17/12 02:44 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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Kos Offline
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Originally Posted by BoringPat
And there is a huge price gap between 440 and 480 (about $800). So basically, I need to pay $800 extra for a better amp/speakers ...

800? Either you got a very good deal, or you're confusing it with CLP 470? 480 is twice as expensive as 440.


"There is nothing to piano playing besides producing the appropriate velocities on the appropriate keys at the appropriate time" (c) qvfarns
#2000557 - 12/17/12 03:54 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: Kos]  
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BoringPat Offline
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Originally Posted by Kos
Originally Posted by BoringPat
And there is a huge price gap between 440 and 480 (about $800). So basically, I need to pay $800 extra for a better amp/speakers ...

800? Either you got a very good deal, or you're confusing it with CLP 470? 480 is twice as expensive as 440.


Well, I guessed they marked 440 too high here ...

#2000562 - 12/17/12 04:11 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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If you like Kawai's basic model, I definitely think you should explore them further. I was won over by the CL-36 which has an upgraded action over the 26, as well as ivory touch keys. To me, that was the most important thing. I couldn't quite convince myself of the Yamahas and Casios, even though I slightly preferred the (speaker) sound coming from a similar ranged Yamaha. I didn't look at their bigger models since they fell out of my budget, but seem to be within yours.


Zaahir

Self-taught renegade - Kawai CL-36
#2000626 - 12/17/12 09:24 AM Re: Which DP to upgrade to? After 2 years of PX-330 [Re: BoringPat]  
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Have you looked at the (essentially brand new) Casio PX-350? It's an upgrade of the PX-330 from Casio and it seems to be a pretty significant improvement. In fact, it seems they've focused on improving the very things you find lacking in the PX-330. Since you already like the underlying character of the 330, it seems like it might be worth checking out.

Other than that, I don't think you'll go wrong with any of the other suggestions made in this thread. It's mainly just finding the board that has that magical combination of touch, response, and sound that you're looking for. I suggest getting a good set of headphones, shopping around and trying as many as you can until you find the one that makes the best fit.


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