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Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199806
11/03/08 11:19 PM
11/03/08 11:19 PM
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amelia k Offline OP
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Hello,

I'm new to the forum and relatively new to the world of pianos. I'm hoping I might get some advice on pricing and selling my Schiedmayer. It is a 7'3" model B grand piano, ebonized case, serial #124517. I believe it may have been built in 1969 or soon thereafter. It was purchased new by my family and has been played very little. It has never been refurbished and is believed by the regular piano tuner to be in excellent condition.

In spite of the gracious advice of Steve Cohen I've not been able to interest local dealers, so, also at Steve's suggestion, am thinking of listing on the internet. The piano has had a recent appraisal for estate purposes of $30,000, but other than the tuner's notion that it's worth closer to its original purchase price (approximately $75,000) I've been unable to track prices on comparable Schiedmayers. The dealers I spoke with weren't optimistic they could sell it at all. Any thoughts on what might be a reasonable and realistic asking price or other selling strategies?

Thanks very much. Pictures follow:

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image] [Linked Image]

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Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199807
11/05/08 09:42 PM
11/05/08 09:42 PM
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Posts: 3,919
Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
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I am sure it is a very fine piano, although I would be very surprised if the original price was anywhere near where you suggest.

Maybe you mean value of replacment with a new piano today...
In any case, the piano is almost 40 years old. Where are you located? Scheidmeyer is a fairly unknown brand in the US, that makes it harder to sell, especially a large ticket item. Add to that the current situation, where pianos are not moving very well... If you really want to sell you may be forced to reduce your price expectations.

Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199808
11/05/08 10:15 PM
11/05/08 10:15 PM
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Marty Flinn Offline
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J. & P. Schiedmayer, Stuttgart ended production in 1969 with serial numbers about 70000. Your serial number is materially higher than this. The Schiedmayer name was purchased by Kawai and used on some Kawai pianos distributed in Europe.

Schiedmayer & Soehne, also in Stuttgart, shows serial numbers that would match your estimated age, but this company is completely separate. Yours shows on the plate the J. & P. imprint.

You may have a Kawai produced instrument.

Pianos of this size back in the late 1960's would have sold for under $10000. A retail value in the So. Cal market would be under $10k in spite of the German cache. The market for used 7'+ grands that do not say Steinway & Sons on the front is very small in the U.S. Nearly non-existant for those with no brand name recodnition.


Co-Author of The Complete Idiot's Guide To Buying A Piano. A "must read" before you shop.
Work for west coast dealer for Yamaha, Schimmel, Bosendorfer, Wm. Knabe.
Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199809
11/06/08 01:55 AM
11/06/08 01:55 AM
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amelia k Offline OP
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Thanks to you both for the informative replies. The piano is in the Washington, D.C. area (Bethesda, Md.). And no, I don't actually know the original purchase price, only the family legend. I would be surprised if it was under $10,000, but anything is possible. It may well be moot anyway. I do know that the piano was sold within the family for $25,000 in 1996 after being appraised at that value by a reliable technician. As for my selling expectations, it's the sort of information you're providing that will help me set them. That the size and relatively unknown Schiedmayer label are problems echoes comments I've received from dealers. I guess I should try to find out if it is Kawai manufactured. Any tips on that? Is a Kawai product of lesser value? I should mention that I don't necessarily have to sell the piano at this time and could decide to postpone or look into donation.

Thanks again for the help,
Amelia

Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199810
11/06/08 02:45 AM
11/06/08 02:45 AM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,031
Belgium
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Belgium

Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199811
11/06/08 04:39 AM
11/06/08 04:39 AM
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Posts: 2,050
London
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A question to those that know:

Is it really possible that the piano might have been made by Kawai, even though it has "Schiedmayer Pianofortefabrik Stuttgart" embossed on the plate?

Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199812
11/06/08 11:41 AM
11/06/08 11:41 AM
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Posts: 11,011
Maryland/DC/No. VA
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Quote
Originally posted by David-G:
A question to those that know:

Is it really possible that the piano might have been made by Kawai, even though it has "Schiedmayer Pianofortefabrik Stuttgart" embossed on the plate?
As Amelia has said, she and I have discussed her piano at length.

It is almost undoubtedly a fine hand-made German instrument. It was evaluated by a very highly regarded RPT who is familiar with high-end pianos.

It is a shame. I beleive that the piano is a Tier 1 instrument. However it lack of name recognition severely limits its market value.


Piano Industry Consultant

Contributing Editor & Consultant - Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer

Jasons Music
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Family Owned and Operated Since 1937.

www.jasonsmusic.com
My postings, unless stated otherwise, are my personal opinions, not those of my clients.
Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199813
11/06/08 12:54 PM
11/06/08 12:54 PM
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ameliak, Consider contacting the German Embassy, perhaps they can put you in touch with a target audience who already knows the brand, or other similar organizations that would be interested because of its origins.

Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199814
11/06/08 06:13 PM
11/06/08 06:13 PM
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Oakland
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Or try contacting Schiedmayer directly. Perhaps they have more information.


Semipro Tech
Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199815
11/07/08 01:16 AM
11/07/08 01:16 AM
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amelia k Offline OP
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Hello again,
This posting has been a really good experience. I'm grateful and pleased, and relieved of the burden of the dark unknown. I've gotten exactly what I needed in terms of more or less pinning down the beast and learning the lay of the land. Not that I don't welcome more information--please continue to send any thoughts. Probably a case of a fine enough piano in serious limbo. Thanks for nailing that for me, Steve. I also loved the Schiedmayer thread I hadn't seen with the wonderful history about a much loved, sacrificed for, and restored piano with great pictures. The notion of contacting the German Embassy is brilliant and perhaps worth doing if only for the adventure. I have sent a email of inquiry to Schiedmayer in the event I could learn something from them. I would certainly keep the piano myself if I had any musical talent, but believe me, that has been tested. My mother was a pianist, a music teacher, and an occasional dealer. She had two grand Steinways of her own in addition to the Schiedmayer, which came from her sister. She considered the Schiedmayer the more valuable, but in certain ways preferred playing the Steinway B, perhaps just out of familiarity and its being broken in by her. I still have to sell the better of the Steinways as well. I always thought there was more than a bit of duelling pianos between them--the sister older, both Smith graduate music majors, etc...

Enough from me for now. If I get anything back from Schiedmayer, I'll let you know. Meanwhile, now that we're getting on the same page, what would you do??

Regards,
Amelia

Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199816
11/07/08 01:49 AM
11/07/08 01:49 AM
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guest1013 Offline
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amelia k, that is a very interesting story about your piano. I do wonder if conservatory graduates would be another target, networking with the schools and their alumni, or even the music department at Smith college. It is also interesting to see on the Schiedmayer website that they are celebrating their 200th anniversary in 2009.

Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199817
11/07/08 08:47 AM
11/07/08 08:47 AM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 466
Münster, Germany
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Gregor Offline
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Münster, Germany
Schiedmayer Pianofortefabrik v. J&P Schiedmayer Stuttgart was sold 1969 to Schiedmayer & Söhne, Stuttgart. I am quite shure that Schiedmayer & Söhne used the brand name Schiedmayer Pianofortefabrik further on until 1980 when it was sold to Ibach. Look at the serial numbers of Schiedmayer & Söhne: 1969 it was 54.798 and 1970 it was 124.593. And Schiedmayer Pianofortefabrik sold their company at the serial 69.618. So Schiedmayer & Söhne just added the serial numbers of their relatives to their production.

Complicated, but for your piano this means that it was produced in 1970 in Germany by Schiedmayer & Söhne but with the brand name Schiedmayer Pianofortefabrik.


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Münster, Germany
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Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199818
11/07/08 11:19 AM
11/07/08 11:19 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 11,011
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Steve Cohen Online content
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Amelia,

Please provide contact info.


Piano Industry Consultant

Contributing Editor & Consultant - Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer

Jasons Music
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Family Owned and Operated Since 1937.

www.jasonsmusic.com
My postings, unless stated otherwise, are my personal opinions, not those of my clients.
Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199819
11/07/08 02:22 PM
11/07/08 02:22 PM
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amelia k Offline OP
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Here is the reply I received from Schiedmayer:

Hello Amelia,

Thank you for your inquiry.I am glad to inform you that your grand piano
with the serial number 124517 has been built in Stuttgart and sold am
03.11.1969 to the J. Binion company in San Francisco. It could be that the
company still exists.
This instrument has been completely hand made, very high quality. Try to
contact David Vanderlip in Anaheim, if he could help. (714-635-4120)
dvanderlip@sbcglobal.net

Best regards


Elianne Schiedmayer

Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199820
11/07/08 05:14 PM
11/07/08 05:14 PM
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Posts: 386
Michigan
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verania5 Offline
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75k in 1969 could have purchased a very nice house. It is astonishing that this piano would sell for that much. Only the very wealthy could have afforded it. It does look lovely. Good luck with your sales.


Steinway M & Yamaha P120
Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199821
11/07/08 10:25 PM
11/07/08 10:25 PM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 6
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amelia k Offline OP
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Per reqest, here is my contact information:

abkerrigan@comcast.net
(805)9373655

Thanks again to all for such comprehensive and useful assistance. Such a team!

Amelia

Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199822
11/08/08 03:13 PM
11/08/08 03:13 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
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Marty Flinn Offline
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I stand corrected on my Kawai origins supposition. I still remain skeptical regarding the original selling price and current value. Can anyone document what a new Bechstein B or C would have sold for in 1969. Hamburg C in 1969? I am guessing a new NY B would have run about $12k.


Co-Author of The Complete Idiot's Guide To Buying A Piano. A "must read" before you shop.
Work for west coast dealer for Yamaha, Schimmel, Bosendorfer, Wm. Knabe.
Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199823
11/08/08 06:51 PM
11/08/08 06:51 PM
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Oakland
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I do not remember any J. Binion company in San Francisco in the 1970s.


Semipro Tech
Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199824
11/08/08 09:02 PM
11/08/08 09:02 PM
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Posts: 6
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amelia k Offline OP
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Internet research leads me to believe that today the company is JB Piano in San Raphael, Ca. It was founded in 1954 by Jared and Stephen Binion.

Re: Please Help with my Schiedmayer #199825
11/08/08 09:16 PM
11/08/08 09:16 PM
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Oakland
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That may be the case. You could contact them.

I know I tuned a fairly new Schiedmayer concert grand in Orinda back in the 1980s so they were around. (I also tuned another smaller one for a couple in Berkeley a long time ago, but they have died. They told me that they bought the piano new about 1918.)


Semipro Tech
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