Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
Find a Professional
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Advertise on Piano World

What's Hot!!
Welcome PianoTV members!
---------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
(125ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Piano Buyer Guide
Piano Buyer Fall 2017
ad
Pierce Piano Atlas


Who's Online Now
70 registered members (BritishJim, accordeur, AprilE, Beakybird, 17 invisible), 982 guests, and 1 spider.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#1938134 - 08/06/12 10:28 AM Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M  
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 10
May Stone Offline
Junior Member
May Stone  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 10
I saw a beautiful Baldwin Baby Grand Piano last week. The owner said that he bought this piano on 1999 and piano's serial number is: M35xxxx. He asked the price: $9500.

My daughter likes this piano. The piano looks good and it has a rich sound. But I have the following questions about this piano:

1. I couldn't find out the serial number in the piano. If it in the piano, where should the number located?

2. This piano is model M2. I only can find out M1 from blue book. Anyone knows what is different between M1 & M2?

3. I was told that piano made in U.S. I can see "Made in U.S" label in piano, but does this mean it's real Baldwin piano?

Thanks for any advice!

Last edited by May Stone; 08/09/12 03:16 PM.
(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#1938232 - 08/06/12 01:39 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 235
jawhitti Offline
Full Member
jawhitti  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 235
The serial number should be on the plate somewhere. There's a baldwin M for sale near me at the link below and one of the photos shows a serial number. I don't know anything about an M2 - but the M's in general are 5'2" pianos.

$9500 for a 13 year-old 5'2" piano sounds awfully high to me. I've seen 5'10 Kawais advertised of similar vintage advertised for that price. I'd expect that piano to go for more like $5500. Look up Baldwin M pianos on ebay and you'll see what I mean.

You don't say how old your daughter is or how well she plays but she will outgrow a 5'2 pretty quickly. If you have room I'd recommend looking for something a little bigger - even a 5'8 would sound noticeably fuller than a 5'2.

Baldwin piano company was going through a lot of turmoil around 1999 - They were bought by Gibson who started making "Baldwin" pianos in Asia about that time and the early Asian Baldwins do not have a good reputation. However a '99 should predate that.

Nevertheless - have a technician check it out. The fact that case looks nice doesn't mean anything about the mechanics of the computer. Pianos that small are often bought but not played much which can be a double-edged sword.


Baldwin M for sale:
http://stlouis.craigslist.org/msg/3106900631.html

Baldwin M pianos on ebay:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BALDWIN-BAB..._DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2320b9aad4


#1938253 - 08/06/12 02:17 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 10
May Stone Offline
Junior Member
May Stone  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 10
jawhitti, thank you very much! We don't have enough space to put a bigger piano, size 5'8" should be max. My daughter is 10. She is pretty good in playing piano.

#1938351 - 08/06/12 04:21 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,625
Bob Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Bob  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,625
Florida
There are usually two places for a serial # on a Baldwin grand. The most common is on the left center side of the plate under the music rack, where the letter (denoting the piano size) and the serial # is just below it. The other place to look is behind the leg, on the treble side, where it attaches to the body of the piano. A few have a metal plate with the serial # there. If you post pictures of the plate, strings, and hitch pins, we can tell if it's an artist Baldwin, or not. You are right to double check, as DH Baldwins and Baldwin Classic are often mistaken for Artist grand models.

(ad ) MusicNotes.com
sheet music search
#1938644 - 08/07/12 06:12 AM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 10,827
Rich Galassini Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Rich Galassini  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 10,827
Philadelphia/South Jersey
An Artist series Baldwin from the '90s may very well be a great little piano. Frankly, I preferred them to the Steinway S hands down.

What you have heard is true - bigger is better in pianos, but this model of 5'2" is a lot of piano. Baldwin was having some quality control issues by the late '90s, so do not jump without having the piano examined.

Confirm the serial #, have it checked out by an independent tech., and provided the condition is very good, $9500.00 does not sound out of line to me.


Rich Galassini
Cunningham Piano Co.
Phila, Pa.
(215) 991-0834 direct line
rich@cunninghampiano.com
Check out the Science Channel's "How Its Made" featuring our piano restoration:
http://www.cunninghampiano.com/how-its-made/
#1938667 - 08/07/12 07:17 AM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,862
apple* Offline
apple*  Offline


Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,862
Kansas
i agree with Rich. The Artist Grands have a remarkable action, no matter their length. I paid much more for a 30 year piano years ago. Do confirm the serial number.. you can call Baldwin. There is something about the name M2 - that makes me a bit nervous.. like it is a Hamilton or something. YOu DEFINITELY want the artist grand. They are very professional. I owned an M for a while. it was great.


accompanist/organist.. a non-MTNA teacher to a few

love and peace, Õun (apple in Estonian)
#1938698 - 08/07/12 08:52 AM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: apple*]  
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 10
May Stone Offline
Junior Member
May Stone  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 10
I checked with a piano seller and Baldwin company yesterday. The seller told me that model "M2" is another version of model "M1". It's made in U.S. The different between M2 and M1 are one part of wood. I was told that Baldwin company (now is Gibson) doesn't have piano info before 2001 in their database. They have no ideas about different between M2 and M1.

I'll bring my daughter to try one more time and see if I'm allowed to take some pictures.

Thanks a lot everyone! All your messages are really helpful.

By the way, if there is an option between Baldwin baby grand M2 (1998/1999) and Yamaha baby grand G2 (1994). Both are same price $9500. Which one is better (I assume both are in excellent conditions)?

#1938825 - 08/07/12 01:41 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 235
jawhitti Offline
Full Member
jawhitti  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 235
I don't think there is any clear quality distinction here as long as both are in similar condition. Baldwins of that time are usually viewed with more suspicion but really it comes do to which one feels better to the player. Play 'em both (or let your daughter play 'em both) and one or the other will feel better or sound better (or both). Get the one that feels better as it is much easier to make it "sound better" (through voicing) than it is to make the action "feel better". Don't be afraid to abuse the dealer a little by insisting he fix any "issues" before you commit.

I still think the prices are very high for these pianos. In the 5'2 range you can just about get something brand new (like, say, a Samick SG-155) for that price.

(Sidebar - it kills me how I can go to a showroom and play a $50,000 piano that sounds like crap only to be told "oh it needs regulation" or "it needs tuning". I've never driven a Lexus and been told by the dealer that "yeah one of the cylinders is misfiring and the A/C is dodgy but we'll fix that right up after you buy it").

#1938916 - 08/07/12 05:31 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 558
Guapo Gabacho Offline
500 Post Club Member
Guapo Gabacho  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 558
Rio Grande Valley of Texas
Originally Posted by May Stone
By the way, if there is an option between Baldwin baby grand M2 (1998/1999) and Yamaha baby grand G2 (1994). Both are same price $9500. Which one is better (I assume both are in excellent conditions)?


No Yamaha's have a Renner action that a Baldwin Artist Grand has. I think the price quoted is full retail, but without the retail perks, like regulation and tuning after the delivery and an in-house warranty. Use those facts to get a price on a more level ground with the seller, but by all means, between the two choose the Baldwin.

While I am without a doubt a Baldwin Artist Grand proponent, I think you should research which other pianos chose Renner for their actions. With that being said, if the Baldwin in question is not an Artist Grand, IMHO choose the Yamaha. Your inspector can tell you if it has the ultra desirable Renner action.



#1938930 - 08/07/12 06:01 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,770
curry Offline
3000 Post Club Member
curry  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,770
Hamilton Twp, NJ
Only the Baldwin SF-10 and SD-10 have Renner actions. The other Baldwin artist grands use the standard Baldwin(Clemson)Action.


G.Fiore "aka-Curry". Tuner-Technician serving the central NJ, S.E. PA area. b214cm@aol.com Concert tuning, Regulation-voicing specialist.
Dampp-Chaser installations, piano appraisals. PTG S.Jersey Chapter 080.
Bösendorfer 214 # 47,299 214-358
#1938949 - 08/07/12 06:44 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: curry]  
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 558
Guapo Gabacho Offline
500 Post Club Member
Guapo Gabacho  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 558
Rio Grande Valley of Texas
Originally Posted by curry
Only the Baldwin SF-10 and SD-10 have Renner actions. The other Baldwin artist grands use the standard Baldwin(Clemson)Action.


I didn't know, so I would favor the Yamaha in her case for resale value.

PS, that is with the same retail deductions I previously mentioned.

Last edited by Guapo Gabacho; 08/07/12 06:57 PM.
#1938970 - 08/07/12 07:21 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,770
curry Offline
3000 Post Club Member
curry  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,770
Hamilton Twp, NJ
I'd favor the Baldwin.


G.Fiore "aka-Curry". Tuner-Technician serving the central NJ, S.E. PA area. b214cm@aol.com Concert tuning, Regulation-voicing specialist.
Dampp-Chaser installations, piano appraisals. PTG S.Jersey Chapter 080.
Bösendorfer 214 # 47,299 214-358
#1938985 - 08/07/12 07:55 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 7,439
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014
Minnesota Marty  Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Joined: May 2012
Posts: 7,439
Rochester MN
Hey Curry - Where ya been?


Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
#1938988 - 08/07/12 08:05 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,770
curry Offline
3000 Post Club Member
curry  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,770
Hamilton Twp, NJ
Hey Marty. Just keeping busy. Wine , women, and song you know?
I still favor the Baldwin. The M as Rich said is a lot of piano for the money.


G.Fiore "aka-Curry". Tuner-Technician serving the central NJ, S.E. PA area. b214cm@aol.com Concert tuning, Regulation-voicing specialist.
Dampp-Chaser installations, piano appraisals. PTG S.Jersey Chapter 080.
Bösendorfer 214 # 47,299 214-358
#1938995 - 08/07/12 08:11 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: curry]  
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 7,439
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014
Minnesota Marty  Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Joined: May 2012
Posts: 7,439
Rochester MN
I agree with both you and Rich.

I go for Wine, Women, and Piano Serenade. I sing like a frog! No woman would want me singing under a balcony window and I'm not sure any woman would be worth hauling either piano to the hacienda.

laugh


Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
#1939253 - 08/08/12 09:07 AM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 10
May Stone Offline
Junior Member
May Stone  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 10
Thanks everyone! All your messages are very helpful. I will see this Baldwin Baby Grand Piano again this week. For my understanding now, there are D.H Baldwin, Baldwin Hamilton, Baldwin Classic and Baldwin Artist pianos on the market. I definitely want to buy a Baldwin Artist piano, how can I separate Baldwin classic and Baldwin artist? I have very less knowledge about pianos.

#1939515 - 08/08/12 05:52 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,126
TX-Dennis Offline
4000 Post Club Member
TX-Dennis  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,126
Texas
Artist grands are models M (5'-2), R (5'-8), L (6'-3), SF (7'), and SD (9') with or without various numbers appended depending on age. Anything else is a lesser instrument.


Dennis
[Linked Image]
flickr

#1939590 - 08/08/12 08:56 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 10
May Stone Offline
Junior Member
May Stone  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 10
We went to Baldwin piano seller's home again. The piano looks like a real Baldwin piano. After my daughter played couple of pieces, she mentioned some issues about this piano:

1. She thought this piano's voice too loud. The middle part voice is hard to change from loud to soft.

2. The piano's sound is not very smooth (last time was better).

My question is: can these problem be solved after tuning? I checked a technician who tuned this piano couple of month ago. I was told the quality of this piano very good.

Thanks for any advice!

#1939627 - 08/08/12 10:37 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,730
kpembrook Online content
1000 Post Club Member
kpembrook  Online Content
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,730
Michigan
As a former Baldwin dealer and piano technician, I am quite familiar with this piano. It was arguably the best short grand you could get when it was made and still today compares well with anything.

These American-made Baldwins were in another league beyond the imports and should not be compared in pricing to Kawai or Yamaha. The only comparable is the Steinway "S". You can check out those prices on the internet, as well.


Keith Akins, RPT
Piano Technologist
USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair
Editor Emeritus, Piano Technicians Journal
#1939629 - 08/08/12 10:40 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,730
kpembrook Online content
1000 Post Club Member
kpembrook  Online Content
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,730
Michigan
Originally Posted by May Stone
We went to Baldwin piano seller's home again. The piano looks like a real Baldwin piano. After my daughter played couple of pieces, she mentioned some issues about this piano:

1. She thought this piano's voice too loud. The middle part voice is hard to change from loud to soft.

2. The piano's sound is not very smooth (last time was better).

My question is: can these problem be solved after tuning? I checked a technician who tuned this piano couple of month ago. I was told the quality of this piano very good.

Thanks for any advice!


You describe routine service items that can be corrected by any competent technician. You could read the discussions of "Regulating" and "Voicing" on the Piano Technicians Guild website at www.ptg.org. You can also use their "Find A Technician" widget on their homepage.

At this point, you should be engaging a technician to examine the instrument rather than asking people on the internet.


Keith Akins, RPT
Piano Technologist
USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair
Editor Emeritus, Piano Technicians Journal
#2488612 - 12/07/15 07:48 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: May Stone]  
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 28
BoisePhil Offline
Full Member
BoisePhil  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 28
Boise, ID
What year did Baldwin actually produce the first Artist Grand? ...and just how were they different from their immediate predecessors? Was 1991 in there...? Does it have to have the plaque mounted on the plate to qualify?

Thanks

Phil


Yamaha P22 in satin ebony
#2488637 - 12/07/15 10:15 PM Re: Question about Baldwin Baby Grand Piano Model M [Re: TX-Dennis]  
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,484
Retsacnal Online content

Platinum Supporter until Feb 18  2015
Retsacnal  Online Content

Platinum Supporter until Feb 18  2015


Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,484
🎹
This is one of the threads that convinced me to buy my M!

My understanding is that Baldwin was producing these long before calling them "Artist" models. That distinction was added when they started to produce more models at varying price points.

Originally Posted by TX-Dennis
Artist grands are models M (5'-2), R (5'-8), L (6'-3), SF (7'), and SD (9') with or without various numbers appended depending on age. Anything else is a lesser instrument.


I M A G I N A T I O N is more important than knowledge -Albert Einstein

Moderated by  Ken Knapp, Piano World 

Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
CLEARANCE SPECIALS!
Save Big In our online store now

In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World)
our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, Digital Piano Dolly, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.


Free Shipping* on Jansen Artist Piano Benches, Cocoweb Piano Lamps, Hidrau Hydraulic Piano Benches
(*free shipping within contiguous U.S. only)
(ad)
SummerKeys
Maine Coast Music Vacation for Adults
(ad)
Pearl River & Ritmuller
Ritmuller Pianos
(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq 6 Out now
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Learning my scales 12 at a time
by Sammyjammy. 01/19/18 07:33 PM
Protek MPL-1 Grease on Grand Knuckles
by David Boyce. 01/19/18 05:20 PM
Mendelssohn Songs without words op 19
by Beemer. 01/19/18 02:18 PM
So glad I bought this book in the 1970's
by RaggedKeyPresser. 01/19/18 12:52 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums44
Topics183,872
Posts2,688,756
Members89,485
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Check It Out!
There's a lot more to Piano World than just the forums.
Click Here to
Explore The Rest of Piano World!!
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2018 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0