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poslishing small scratches #1926580
07/14/12 06:33 AM
07/14/12 06:33 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 125
Z
ZBGM0 Offline OP
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ZBGM0  Offline OP
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Z

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Hi!

I have a question about a scratch removing. I read quite a few topics about it, but opinions are quite different, so I decided I will open new topics.

Well, I found few scratches on my piano and I have no idea where they came from. First, I have to say that I am not obsessed with scratches…but the scratches are really so shallow that they could probably disappeared quite fast – at least I think so. I believe that micro scratches it the right term, there is no way that you can feel the scratch if you touch it with your finger nail and they are also not seen if there is not enough light in front of the piano.

Maybe I don’t need a buffing machine for scratches that I was describing. So my questing would be: what kind of wax should I buy to polish the scratches? I heard that car wax could be very good. There is also someone who reported a very good result with "Renaissance - Micro-Crystalline Wax Polish". I would like to get advice (if that is possible) for a specific product that works well for this situation. I don’t want to buy inappropriate wax, I heard that some of them leaves film on the finish etc. I am pretty sure that someone had good experiences with specific wax.

Piano finish: high gloss polyester (there is a sign “hard finish” on the desk).

Thanks and sorry for my English.

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Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1926602
07/14/12 07:45 AM
07/14/12 07:45 AM
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KZ
Maximillyan Offline
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ZBGM0, it is better to use the wax from the bees (natural). To start a small piece of scrub at the site not visible a part your piano, and set how many need you to press to it's
I usually do this: I pick up soft-tip pen color the piano and drive it on this scratch. Then take a piece of wax, and slowly I drive on it with a little pressure. After I'm drive a piece of chamois here. You will feel when the scratch disappears. But I only work with cheap piano

Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: Maximillyan] #1926740
07/14/12 02:15 PM
07/14/12 02:15 PM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,734
Auckland New Zealand
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Robert 45 Offline
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I would not use wax of any kind on a polyester finish. The term "Hard Finish" on the music desk, suggests to me that you have a Kawai piano and your piano should have been supplied with a cloth for removing smudges and light marks from the finish.

On this polyester finish, what appear like scratches are not in fact scratches at all and can be removed by careful use of the slightly dampened polishing cloth.

Fine scratches can be caused by rubbing a dusty piano with cloth which gathers the particles of grit and dirt that damage the the polyester and cause a haze of fine scratches. This will eventually dull the gloss finish. Always remove surface dust with a very light dusting, before attempting to polish the piano.

A piano is a precious item and do not experiment with products that could create even more damage to the finish. There are products used by professional tuners/technicians which can rapidly effect amazing results on superficial damage to the polyester.

Simple, commonsense care should keep your piano looking like new. In the event of damage to the finish, always leave it for the professionals to repair.

Good luck!

Robert.

Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1926750
07/14/12 03:07 PM
07/14/12 03:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 824
England
M
MU51C JP Offline
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England
Wax on polyester finishes only builds up to form a surface that eventually attracts dust and makes a mess of the finish. The only thing to use should be a good quality damp wash leather. If the finish does get scratched then professional buffing would be needed as Robert45 has already said. For very slight marks, sometimes very careful use of jewellers rougue will do the trick .... but never wax polish! wink


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Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1926769
07/14/12 04:04 PM
07/14/12 04:04 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,404
Qubec, Canada
accordeur Offline
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Do not use wax.

Any good quality rubbing compound can be used. I use 3M and Meguiar's products. Use 100% cotton cloth or microfiber cloth. Don't be afraid to hand rub vigorously until the finish actually warms up. And then just wipe clean.


Jean Poulin

Musician, Tuner and Technician

www.actionpiano.ca
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1926774
07/14/12 04:28 PM
07/14/12 04:28 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,481
Niagara Region, On. Canada
Emmery Offline
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Niagara Region, On. Canada
+1 on the Meguirs products. In particular, they make a polish called Meguiar's s Mirror Glaze #9 Swirl Remover which can be found in marine supply stores and auto finishing stores. Also the Meguiar's Mirror Glaze #17 Plastic Cleaner works really well for polishing out slight surface scratches. You can find #17 at most automotive supply places. Motorcycle supply stores also carry a number of plastic polishes used for removing haze and surface scratches in clear motorcycle fairing windshields.

Always completely dust off the piano with a quality duster before wiping with any cloth. It is usually the tiny bits of grit and dirt in this dust that causes the swirly's and scratches in the first place when just going at it with a cloth.

Last edited by Emmery; 07/14/12 04:29 PM.

Piano Technician
George Brown College /85
Niagara Region
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: Emmery] #1926776
07/14/12 04:32 PM
07/14/12 04:32 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,404
Qubec, Canada
accordeur Offline
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Qubec, Canada
Originally Posted by Emmery
+1 on the Meguirs products. In particular, they make a polish called Meguiar's s Mirror Glaze #9 Swirl Remover which can be found in marine supply stores and auto finishing stores. Also the Meguiar's Mirror Glaze #17 Plastic Cleaner works really well for polishing out slight surface scratches. You can find #17 at most automotive supply places. Motorcycle supply stores also carry a number of plastic polishes used for removing haze and surface scratches in clear motorcycle fairing windshields.

Always completely dust off the piano with a quality duster before wiping with any cloth. It is usually the tiny bits of grit and dirt in this dust that causes the swirly's and scratches in the first place when just going at it with a cloth.


+1


Jean Poulin

Musician, Tuner and Technician

www.actionpiano.ca
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1926778
07/14/12 04:36 PM
07/14/12 04:36 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,404
Qubec, Canada
accordeur Offline
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Meguiars final inspection is also great for day to day dusting, plus it smells great!


Jean Poulin

Musician, Tuner and Technician

www.actionpiano.ca
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1927082
07/15/12 11:51 AM
07/15/12 11:51 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 125
Z
ZBGM0 Offline OP
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ZBGM0  Offline OP
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Z

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Thank you (all of you) very much for answers. So, I will not use wax.

You are right, micro scratches are probably result of dusting piano. That’s why I use feather duster now.

I will try with this two Meguiar’s products. I don’t want to complicate about scratches, but because they are not deep and piano is still new, I will try to remove them.

Can you just please confirm that I am looking the right two products:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Meguiars-Sw...ries&hash=item231a12c47d&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Meguiars-Cl...ries&hash=item231a12d610&vxp=mtr

Thanks

Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1927088
07/15/12 12:01 PM
07/15/12 12:01 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,481
Niagara Region, On. Canada
Emmery Offline
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Emmery  Offline
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Niagara Region, On. Canada
Yep, those are the right products. You might want to try the #17 first, as it is the milder of the two from my experience, and may suffice by itself. As with any finishing surface product, try it in a small inconspicuous spot first. Also, cover the tuning pins with a cloth or plastic to prevent any of the powder residue from finding its way in there. These polishers will strip any previous products like wax that may have been on there, and it mixes in with the residue.


Piano Technician
George Brown College /85
Niagara Region
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1927090
07/15/12 12:04 PM
07/15/12 12:04 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,071
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wouter79 Online content
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Beware of feather dustres too. I had one with something sharp in it, and it gave me a scratch (on my computer screen, not on my piano)

I had a very fine haze that seemed to be very fine scratches on one place on my black high polish grand. I used this with good results. it is white stuff so I assume it will work on non-black high gloss pianos as well.

http://www.gtrmusic.co.uk/ghs-guitar-gloss-nonwax-polish-p-143.html

[Linked Image]


[Linked Image][Linked Image][Linked Image][Linked Image]
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: wouter79] #1927154
07/15/12 03:09 PM
07/15/12 03:09 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 515
Windsor,Nova Scotia Canada
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wayne walker Offline
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Joined: Aug 2008
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Windsor,Nova Scotia Canada
Originally Posted by wouter79
Beware of feather dustres too. I had one with something sharp in it, and it gave me a scratch (on my computer screen, not on my piano)

I had a very fine haze that seemed to be very fine scratches on one place on my black high polish grand. I used this with good results. it is white stuff so I assume it will work on non-black high gloss pianos as well.

http://www.gtrmusic.co.uk/ghs-guitar-gloss-nonwax-polish-p-143.html

[Linked Image]


good for guitars, but not for piano's polyester finish


Wayne Walker
Walker's Piano Service
http://www.walkerpiano.ca/
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1927180
07/15/12 04:03 PM
07/15/12 04:03 PM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 125
Z
ZBGM0 Offline OP
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Ok, thanks again Emmery. I will report about results as soon I get the product. I will see if I can get it in our country, if not, I will order it on E-bay.

Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1927189
07/15/12 04:27 PM
07/15/12 04:27 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,456
Lowell MA
Larry Buck Offline
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Lowell MA
Allied Piano sells Konig products.

http://www.alliedpiano.com/

Konig manufactures products specifically for polyester finishes.

For some reason I can not find the German site for Konig ..

Talk to Ruth at Allied, she is very knowledgeable.


"It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt."
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Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1927193
07/15/12 04:36 PM
07/15/12 04:36 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
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Qubec, Canada
accordeur Offline
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König makes really high quality products, but I don't think they sell liquid compounds. Their polyester is super, and their pastes for buffing wheels are unsurpassed. But they are products for the shop.

Here is their website.

http://www.heinrichkoenig.de/en/startseite


Jean Poulin

Musician, Tuner and Technician

www.actionpiano.ca
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1927387
07/16/12 06:10 AM
07/16/12 06:10 AM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,456
Lowell MA
Larry Buck Offline
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Konig has a complete group of products for use by hand on polyester.

And, they also have liquid compounds.


"It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt."
Mark Twain

E. J. Buck & Sons
Lowell MA 01852
978 458 8688
www.ejbuckpiano.com
http://www.facebook.com/EJBuckPerformances
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1927477
07/16/12 10:21 AM
07/16/12 10:21 AM
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I stand corrected, thanks.


Jean Poulin

Musician, Tuner and Technician

www.actionpiano.ca
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: ZBGM0] #1927499
07/16/12 10:50 AM
07/16/12 10:50 AM
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wouter79 Online content
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>good for guitars, but not for piano's polyester finish

I asked two techs and both thought it would be OK

It worked OK

What's wrong with it?


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Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: wouter79] #1927643
07/16/12 04:15 PM
07/16/12 04:15 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,481
Niagara Region, On. Canada
Emmery Offline
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Emmery  Offline
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Originally Posted by wouter79
>good for guitars, but not for piano's polyester finish

I asked two techs and both thought it would be OK

It worked OK

What's wrong with it?


If you read the literature on it, it mentions a lot of finishes like paint, lacquer's, metal, brass ect... it doesn't mention polyester specifically...thats a big red flag for starters.

Polyester is over 2 3/4 times harder than standard lacquers and 4 times harder than a standard nitro-cellulose lacquer. Also, a polish may add sheen to many softer finishes found on guitars that rate in the range of 50-60 degrees, but polyester alone has a sheen of 90-95 degrees by itself and polishes are not needed to add sheen....polishes with fine compound in them are designed to remove surface swirls and scratches within that high sheen.



Piano Technician
George Brown College /85
Niagara Region
Re: poslishing small scratches [Re: Emmery] #1927687
07/16/12 05:50 PM
07/16/12 05:50 PM
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Windsor,Nova Scotia Canada
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wayne walker Offline
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Joined: Aug 2008
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Windsor,Nova Scotia Canada
Originally Posted by Emmery
Originally Posted by wouter79
>good for guitars, but not for piano's polyester finish

I asked two techs and both thought it would be OK

It worked OK

What's wrong with it?


If you read the literature on it, it mentions a lot of finishes like paint, lacquer's, metal, brass ect... it doesn't mention polyester specifically...thats a big red flag for starters.

Polyester is over 2 3/4 times harder than standard lacquers and 4 times harder than a standard nitro-cellulose lacquer. Also, a polish may add sheen to many softer finishes found on guitars that rate in the range of 50-60 degrees, but polyester alone has a sheen of 90-95 degrees by itself and polishes are not needed to add sheen....polishes with fine compound in them are designed to remove surface swirls and scratches within that high sheen.



and it leaves a greasy film on the polyester

Last edited by wayne walker; 07/16/12 05:50 PM.

Wayne Walker
Walker's Piano Service
http://www.walkerpiano.ca/
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