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Which one of Chopin's Major Works are the most reasonable to start out with as your first one? The following are the ones I am talking about, how would you rank these from easiest to hardest?

Scherzo 1, 2, 3, 4
Ballade 1, 2, 3, 4
Fantasie Op 49
Polonaise Op 44, Op 53
Polonaise-Fantasie
Nocturne Op 48 1
Barcarolle

For me (very subjective):

Least difficult to most difficult of each set listed:

Scherzi: 3, 2, 4, 1
Ballades: 3, 2, 1, 4 (4 and 1 are actually very comparable technically, provided you are proficient in double notes)
Polonaises: 44, 53, P-F
Other works listed: Op 48 no 1, Barcarolle, Fantasie

Again, it's very subjective. All of the Scherzi are of comparable difficulty, same goes for the Ballades. As for the polonaises, the P-F is on another planet in terms of technical difficulty.

Of all the works listed, P-F is certainly the hardest IMO.

I try to resist the tradition of learning numerous miscellaneous works of the same composer before tackling the harder ones. I would say go ahead and start with a scherzo, but I don't wish to dissuade you from tackling a harder work if you do have the technique for it.

Easiest to hardest:
Nocturne op 48 1, Ballade 3, Scherzo 3, Scherzo 2, Scherzo 1, Polonaise Op 44, Barcarolle, Fantasie Op 49, Scherzo 4,
Polonaise Op 53,
Ballade 1, Fantasie Polonaise, Ballade 2, Ballade 4

The second question is kind of a ridiculous question BUT I will answer non-the-less. I am not going to rank all of these works together, but rather in groups. The difficulty will go from least difficult to most difficult. (all rankings are based off of my strengths, my weaknesses and my opinions)



SCHERZI:

1, 2, 4, 3

BALLADES:

3, 2, 1, 4

POLONAISES:

'heroic', op44, 'fantasy'

OTHER:

nocturne op48 no1, fantasy, barcarolle



Now that I've gotten that out of the way, I'd like to help you pick your first grand work! What is your skill of level? And what is your favorite work? Those are really the only two deciding factors. My first grand work was the 2nd scherzo, and now I'm working on the 1st ballade. So, again.. skill level? Favorite piece?

I think that says it all.


There are three reasons why this kind of ranking has little meaning:

1. Everyone's technique has different strengths and weaknesses.

2. It's hard to separate out the purely mechanical difficulties (just hitting the right notes) from the interpretive difficulties. This is music, not exercises. Sometimes the right interpretive idea makes a passage much easier.

3. People don't talk about this point very much, but I think that everything depends on what speed you choose to play. I'm not talking about silly tempi like op.10/1 as an adagio. I mean that there's a range of "acceptable" performance speeds, and your choice of speed affects the difficulty of the piece, a lot. (For instance, I'm working on the 1st Scherzo. MM=80 is an acceptable tempo (for an amateur), and the piece is not that hard at that speed. MM=96 is what I'm shooting for, and it's a big challenge for me. The tempo as marked (MM=120) is beyond my technique.)

-Jason

THank you guys! Well I can play quite advanced pieces. For example, I play Beethoven Op 13 and Op 26, Chopin Op 9 No 2, Op 10 No 3, Op 27 No 1, Op 28 No 1, 2, 3, 4, 14, 18, 23, Op 37 No 2, Schubert Impromptus Op 90(all four), and Bach Italian Concerto and Well tempered Klavier book 1 number 10 and 12.

I wonder, is the Op 48 No 1 the easiest of the pieces I listed, is it accessible considering what I play, or is the Op 44 Polonaise or any of the Scherzos easier than the Op 48 no 1 and more accessible?

They are just as accessible, but I would recommend a scherzo. If I were you I would mess around with various parts in each scherzo to see which one you would be most comfortable playing.

Okay! I will do so, although, if Op 44 or Op 48 No 1 is easier I think I will choose one of them? Which one would you recommend out of the Scherzi and those two?

If you are going to pick a scherzo first, which I recommend, I would need to know your strong points and weak points of technique. What are your strengths?

With the repertoire you have listed, I think that the most reasonable answer is : try; find out for yourself which of pieces are best for your current level of skill and abilities. A listing of repertoire can also be limited in its significance, because it doesn't tell anyone
- at what level of skill, competence or "artistry" you play these pieces,
- how long it has taken you to get these works to where they are
- what technical and artistic challenges you manage well and which are greater challenges for you.

You and someone who knows your playing would be a better judge of what might be the best place for you to begin your next assault on the works of Chopin.

Regards,

I think I am quite good at octave playing actually, and and I have a pretty good rotation technique, my weakness is probably double notes.. I am quite good at chord playing, but when it comes to playing broken chords(like in the coda of the first ballade) it becomes a weakness..

BruceD is right. We cannot answer really, because we don't now how you play, and also, many people will give you different answers, as they have different experiences of what is more difficult and so on.. But generally, I think most people would agree that the Op 48 No 1 is the easiest piece of the ones you listed, mainly because it's much shorter than the others. However that piece requires a maturity that few pieces does, and it's one of the harder Chopin pieces to interpret.. If you are weak at chord playing, this piece is a nightmare, as it's all about bringing out a top voice in thick chords...

Instead of choosing not to answer your question, I'll just assume that you have an accurate assessment of your own technique. I would recommend experimenting with the 3rd scherzo. I LOVE this scherzo. Assuming you don't know this piece, it is the shortest of the four.. but by no means the easiest. It is octave-happy and the middle section is full of cascading parts. The coda starts off full of bliss then suddenly transforms into tragedy. Listen to the piece until you know it in your head backwards and front then take it to the piano. Bust out the score and experiment with all of the technical aspects. If you decide to learn this then I wish you luck - and get back to me!

If I were to recommend this scherzo or any other piece - which I patently refuse to do - I would say : Get the score, study it, start reading/playing through it until you begin to understand - for yourself - what it's about. Forget about listening to recordings so much that "you know it in your head backwards and front..." You won't know it until you start studying it.

Regards,

The 3rd scherzo is pretty hellish to start with...the only benefit of starting with a Scherzo is that they're pretty repetitive, and so there's less work to do compared to another large work from Chopin.

The 3rd isn't too bad, provided you can do the octaves. The cascading textures fit the hands quite well, but the coda is indeed hellish.

I hate doing stuff like this because in most cases we're splitting hairs, and all the pieces are very hard.

But I was gonna do it anyway -- and couldn't. It pained me too much.

All I can do is put them in 2 categories: Those that someone can maybe take a try at without being extremely advanced (let's call it category 1), and ones that you really better not (2).

"Category 1"
Scherzo 1, 2, 3
Ballade 3
Nocturne Op 48 1
Polonaise Op. 53 (maybe)
Barcarolle

"Category 2"
Scherzo 4
Ballades 1, 2, 4
Fantaisie Op. 49
Polonaise Op 44
Polonaise-Fantasie

I consider Scherzo 4 the most untouchable. I think we could make an argument for picking any of the others to tackle first.... heck, someone could make an argument for Scherzo 4 too.
But IMO that's the only one for which we should say "absolutely not," even more so than the 4th Ballade, Polonaise-Fantaisie or any of the others.

Interesting! But I think you hugely underestimate Scherzo 4.

edit: I think just about everyone is hugely underestimating the difficulty of the piece.

Although....maybe it's because of what Beet314 said -- how fast people are thinking of playing it. And I'd suggest also it's because maybe not everyone assumes we're talking about playing it real well.

If we're talking about playing at a credible tempo (and I don't even necessarily mean the same tempo as pros), and evenly, and with some semblance of the right feel, it's hard for me to see how this piece wouldn't be put at the highest level of difficulty, not just among these pieces but among anything.

That could very well be the case. I will have to withhold judgement until I actually attempt it. Marvelous piece nonetheless.

I'm interested and surprised, by the way, at how people are ranking the Polonaise-Fantaisie so highly. It's very hard to pull off successfully, no doubt. And it's technically not easy. But I don't think there's anything in there in the same league as the first Ballade's scherzo and coda, or the second and fourth Ballades's codas, or op.53's middle section octaves, or large stretches of the F minor Fantasie.

When I play it now, I feel at ease and untaxed. In contrast, the first Scherzo feels like running a marathon uphill. That one's a monster.

-J