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Tuning Pin Sleves #1924021
07/07/12 10:46 PM
07/07/12 10:46 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 9
Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan, Canad...
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Blair Scott Offline OP
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Blair Scott  Offline OP
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 9
Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan, Canad...
Anyone out there using tuning pin sleeves? What is their performance like? I've never used one, but am about to put new bass stings from Aldridge on my 7' Baldwin and the bass has been restrung in the past. Several very loose pins in the lower bass. 97% of the pins are very good, easily torqued, but a few in the bass are quite jumpy. I've seen these sleeves for years, but never really heard much about them in the field. What is the general consensus about Aldridge bass strings?

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Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924028
07/07/12 11:01 PM
07/07/12 11:01 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
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Oakland
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BDB Offline
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Replace the pin block and the rest of the strings, instead. The sleeves do not work.

Baldwin pin blocks are easy to replace.


Semipro Tech
Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924041
07/08/12 12:04 AM
07/08/12 12:04 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,219
Olympia, WA
rysowers Offline
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Technicians have come up with some interesting uses for the tuning pin sleeves, but not for the purpose intended. Like BDB says, they don't work. Why they still sell them is a mystery. They just make a mess.


Ryan Sowers,
Pianova Piano Service
Olympia, WA
www.pianova.net
Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924046
07/08/12 12:09 AM
07/08/12 12:09 AM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 9
Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan, Canad...
B
Blair Scott Offline OP
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Blair Scott  Offline OP
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Joined: Jul 2012
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Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan, Canad...
Thanks guys,
I suspected that may be the case. Replacing the block in this case would put the piano out of commission for quite some time however and it is in use every Sunday. I would love to have the luxury of time to change the block. Anyone have any options? What do you think of using larger pins? it is only a few in the lowest register.

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Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924049
07/08/12 12:16 AM
07/08/12 12:16 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,377
KZ
Maximillyan Offline
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Maximillyan  Offline
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Originally Posted by Blair Scott
I've seen these sleeves for years, but never really heard much about them in the field.

Please, put a link photos this sleeve. What materials it's made?

Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924050
07/08/12 12:20 AM
07/08/12 12:20 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,377
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Maximillyan Offline
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Anyone have any options? What do you think of using larger pins?
Perhaps this information will be useful to you,Blair Scott
http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubb...0been%20thinking%20abou.html#Post1903472

bass region. Replace Without a sleeve
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gi_8mh-AFYA

Last edited by Maximillyan; 07/08/12 12:27 AM.
Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924051
07/08/12 12:21 AM
07/08/12 12:21 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,935
Colorado
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Inlanding Offline
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Colorado
Based on what you describe, replacing a couple of tuning pins with larger ones while you are replacing the bass strings is the overall best solution. I did exactly that on my piano with excellent results. It'll buy you all the time you need should at some time you do any major work later. Your tech will want to take a quick measurement to ensure the best fit.

Glen


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Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924058
07/08/12 12:38 AM
07/08/12 12:38 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 26,897
Oakland
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BDB Offline
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A good person could have the piano restrung with a new pinblock in less than a month, once all the preliminaries are done. A poor or halfway job could have the piano working badly for years. Just do it right. You might find someone who could supply you with a loaner.


Semipro Tech
Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924064
07/08/12 01:09 AM
07/08/12 01:09 AM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,404
Québec, Canada
accordeur Offline
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If you have not heard of CA glue, it would be a good time to look into it.

If you have removed both pins and strings, going up a size could also be a solution.

Replacing the pin block would be great. With new strings and number 2 pins.

If this is not feasible, coating the pin holes with high quality epoxy also works quite well.

It all depends on the job and the customers budget. And the quality of the core piano.

It is sad, but many pianos are not worth the work and effort.





Jean Poulin

Musician, Tuner and Technician

www.actionpiano.ca
Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: accordeur] #1924067
07/08/12 01:46 AM
07/08/12 01:46 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,377
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Maximillyan Offline
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Originally Posted by accordeur


If this is not feasible, coating the pin holes with high quality epoxy also works quite well.

Epoxy will exfoliate from wood hole when you will hammering a pin in the pinblock. It's loss of your time as result zero effect.

Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: accordeur] #1924068
07/08/12 01:49 AM
07/08/12 01:49 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 26,897
Oakland
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BDB Offline
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It is a 7 foot Baldwin. It is worth fixing, and fixing correctly. Baldwin pin blocks are simply screwed to the wood frame and bolted to the plate, so it is very simple to replace them.

I suspect from the other topic about this piano, it is due for complete restringing anyway. New bass strings and old treble strings do not play together well.


Semipro Tech
Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924069
07/08/12 01:54 AM
07/08/12 01:54 AM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,404
Québec, Canada
accordeur Offline
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Ok Max, let's suggest corrugated cardboard.


Jean Poulin

Musician, Tuner and Technician

www.actionpiano.ca
Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924082
07/08/12 04:43 AM
07/08/12 04:43 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 824
England
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MU51C JP Offline
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Posts: 824
England
Pin sleeves are absolutely useless - The worst thing ever in my opinion. If there are no splits where the pins are loose, just try using larger wrestpins. Installing a new pinblock seems a little expensive if only oversize pins do the trick.

You might even get away with corrugated cardboard as used by MAX-BODGER, I'm sure he will be only too pleased to show you how frown


Concert Tuner & Technician for the past 52 years in the United Kingdom
www.jphillipspianoservices.freeindex.co.uk : E-mail jophillips06@aol.com
Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Blair Scott] #1924098
07/08/12 06:01 AM
07/08/12 06:01 AM
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,628
PA
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Loren D Offline
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Ok, I'm outa this place. Between the name calling and back-biting, this is no longer a place for professionals.

Have fun!


DiGiorgi Piano Service
http://www.digiorgipiano.com
Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: accordeur] #1924099
07/08/12 06:06 AM
07/08/12 06:06 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,377
KZ
Maximillyan Offline
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Originally Posted by accordeur
Ok Max, let's suggest corrugated cardboard.

No offense,accordeur. However, I expressed my point of view on this issue. I think that the epoxy will slide like glass in hole of pinblock. Frictions will be minimal. Or am I wrong?

Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: MU51C JP] #1924112
07/08/12 06:53 AM
07/08/12 06:53 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,377
KZ
Maximillyan Offline
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Originally Posted by Johnkie

You might even get away with corrugated cardboard as used by MAX-BODGER, I'm sure he will be only too pleased to show you how frown

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/i...ETsy6IX;_ylv=3?qid=20120701005853AA62DuJ What do think about this method "foot wrap'?

A message (Yahoo) from my adept, who lives in South Africa. He is very well says about "Max's cardboard fix"

nj
south africa


Best Answer - Chosen by Asker
Hi Maxim, here I go again replying in your post. Your question on the previous one is quite vague (your way of using english language) which makes one wonder what you were trying to say. You quoted my words that I used footwrap. True and thanks to you, because I saw your video and tried it in some pins. Then you say here that the string must not be removed, then it is not an easy task to try. The strings will reach the point of breakage if you continue to turn the pin backwards for the purpose of loosening it. I did break one string so I continued with others having the strings removed after few turns, and putting it back is the most difficult part because of the acquired coiled shape of the string that you advised to be screwed back with the pin and not hammered in. But anyway with patience, I put it all in place and it really turned into super tightened pins with the cardboard wrap.

By the way, thank you for the tip I learned from your video, though it is not the conventional one commonly used by many but it worked in a good way in some of my tuning pins. I am relaying my message to you here because I can't add to your last one mentioning about me using footwrap. You may be able to use my words as reference but I may add, one can try your method at their own discretion. I boldly use it because my piano is not an expensive/precious one but it become precious to me now because it is playing well. Imagine for a 200bucks Otto Bach that one can express a soul via music. Unfortunately, I am not keen on video making to show myself what I do, but rather happy to watch other's video tips. Keep up the good work friend. Have a great day to all.
Source(s):
maxim's video

Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Maximillyan] #1924213
07/08/12 12:04 PM
07/08/12 12:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
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beethoven986 Offline
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Originally Posted by Maximillyan
Originally Posted by accordeur
Ok Max, let's suggest corrugated cardboard.

No offense,accordeur. However, I expressed my point of view on this issue. I think that the epoxy will slide like glass in hole of pinblock. Frictions will be minimal. Or am I wrong?


Using epoxy for this purpose has been used successfully. This technique is often used in museum-grade restorations, where the main goal is to retain as much of the original instrument as possible. However, I would not recommend its use here. I recommend replacing the pin block, refurbishing and re-pinning the bridge, and then restringing entirely. This is a high-performance instrument, and should be treated as one.

Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: Loren D] #1924545
07/09/12 07:09 AM
07/09/12 07:09 AM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,889
Bradford County, PA
UnrightTooner Online content
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Originally Posted by Loren D
Ok, I'm outa this place. Between the name calling and back-biting, this is no longer a place for professionals.

Have fun!


frown

If you leave, there will be one less "good" role model for others to observe.


Jeff Deutschle
Part-Time Tuner
Who taught the first chicken how to peck?
Re: Tuning Pin Sleves [Re: rysowers] #1924550
07/09/12 07:22 AM
07/09/12 07:22 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,377
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Maximillyan Offline
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Originally Posted by rysowers
Why they still sell them is a mystery.


They just sell this sleeves.
They don't set it's and do not fixate on it's tuning.

They do not hear criticism disgruntled customers after the repair of the piano.


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