Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Forum Manufacturer Abandons Dealer over Warranty Issue

That is the 64 thousand dollar question…..

If I had to answer I would state do your research. For anyone you hire to work on your piano, home, boat, car, etc.

There is a professional group that gives people, such as yourself, complacency by claiming to be a standard for the industry.

At times this can be an illusory as we can all witness in this particular case.

Sparky,

Yes the Teflon thread, the Warranty Tuning Only thread, and this thread, all the same tech.




Impossible to help people who don't want my help.

From Brodmann's perspective, it may be that they know that the tech is incompetent, but do not wish to alienate the piano owner. If they deal directly with the customer, then they take the problem off the hands of everyone else.

There is a thin line that many of us walk in this business. If we criticize someone else's work, there is a chance that we are the ones who will not be believed.

I’ve been told more than once by piano professionals that the piano industry is encapsulated within a small world. Most people in the business know each other or have heard of each other, whether directly or indirectly.

I would also imagine the same is true within the realm of piano technicians… many dealers are technicians, just as many dealers are trained pianist, and good ones on both accounts. I would also imagine that those who do poor/substandard work soon build a reputation for themselves, for better or worse (such as in this thread/case).

I also know from experience that when you recommend someone, quite often, the person to whom you make a recommendation holds you responsible to a certain extent. So, I guess it’s prudent to be very careful who you recommend, for anything.

FWIW, I happen to know my piano tech very well… in fact I know what he’s thinking 24/7, and he knows his limitations.

Rick

Yea I think BDB is correct here.
It would be hard to imagine that Brodmann could be this blind so they're just trying to keep the actual owner happy despite the fact that he appears wanting in the smarts department.

From what you wrote I get the impression that Brodmann agreed with the customer that he sticks with customers' preferred tech. Because they know this 'tech' is making a mess of it, they have released both you and the dealer from any responsibility and "take it over".

Since they write explicitly


I suppose this is their nice but vague way of saying that his warranty is not valid anymore?

Since this thread has little point other than accusing Brodmann Piano of "abandoning" a dealer, taking some kind of jab at the PTG, and in the process recommending "the manufacturer void the warranty in writing to the owner”, I’m naturally skeptical, especially after hearing only one side of the story and considering the preemptive nature and lack of evidence other than a few pictures for which credibility has not been established.

The only one who heard both sides of the story was Brodmann Piano and after hearing it and seeing all the, er, evidence presented, they felt they had no other recourse than to remove the responsibility for the warranty from the dealer and his tuner, a fairly strong message. They did not want to get in the middle of a he said, she said. Probably good advice for all.



Mike

Sparky and Wouter79,

Thanks for the additional observations. Wouter yours is a unique perspective that had not come to mind.



This is good too.

That is why when I discovered the unusual regulation and was made aware that the invoice I was looking at were the same technician I reported what I had directly to the dealer and the manufacturer.

Most manufacturers of ANY product have designated service professionals. In the absence of an on-site service center, the are usually centralized service centers. For example, we don't fix digital pianos, we connect digital service customers to Authorized service centers for the particular brand and product.

There is more than one perspective here, but both on its face and even with some speculation, it strikes me as very unusual for a manufacturer to willingly undermine a dealer even if it is an unintended consequence. Brodmann's solution is a novel one, given the customer's wants. There are no winners here. I think the only remaining issue is the $100 service turned $1200 invoice.

I have known individuals in and out of our industry that do a lot of harm without consequence or recourse. There truly is not any forum for this kind of problem. Not for doctors, not for plumbers, not for piano technicians. I feel the main reason this goes on is because few people are willing to challenge someone's livelihood for anything less than a criminal act. Our litigious society makes targets out of even the most reasonable advocates.

Wow, I would LOVE to 'hear' the whole story from Brodman and the technician's perspective. This certainly sounds cut and dried but I have found many times in the past that there are often several sides to most stories.

I expect neither will be posting here to let the resident Lynch mob beat them up though

Just sayin'

You know, you are right, Roger... there are two sides to every story. I think sometimes we are too quick to pass judgment (myself included) without all the evidence, from both sides.

Rick

That is certainly true.
However after seeing the itemized invoice that the same technician provided (on another piano) it sure appears that there is something pretty questionable about the work mentality.
It was like he was just making stuff up and I certainly can't imagine a true professional listing things like that.

I don't know if this will come across gently enough, so please pardon if this sounds a bit rough edged.

I believe that Dan is rightly upset with this situation, and he has presented good evidence of the shoddy work done by this other "tech."

But he has also taken Brodmann to task:



Whenever a customer comes on this board to vent about a dealer or a manufacturer the attitude of many is generally quite suspicious. Strong claims about product deficiencies or bad dealer tactics are often scrutinized quite closely. This is the "other side of the story" some have mentioned.

Yet here we have a maker whose quality control is challenged, and whose relationships with dealers and technicians is strongly criticized. Nary a peep of contest about this.

I have no dog in this fight, to be sure. I just find this curious.

Perhaps Brodmann should see this thread and respond?

I've spent most of my career working as a manufacturers rep, including years as a service manager and as such I wouldn't go near this thread.

Not a peep from old Norbert. Seems a bit odd.

Bob,

From page one your query;

Regarding the Bosie strings; those photos were taken July 14, 2007. The treble wire replacements are still there.



Not really. If you read the email I posted that came directly from Brodman administration clearly Norbert and any technicians that responded have been dismissed from the responsibility of this file along with any obligation as to warranty requirements.

So I am not sure why he would respond at all.

Maybe he knows that if he posted anything he would attract flak.

But it appears that even without posting anything he still seems to get attention.

Poor Norbert.

Dan--It seems as though the manufacture, faced with a difficult situation, has decided to do whatever it takes to keep the customer happy---even if that means additional (and likely unjustified) expense to them. I just hope you're able to get paid for the work you've done.


Piano*Dad--Some technicians, as a matter of routine, check the tightness of the plate bolts. Unfortunately, there are some who get a bit uhh, 'over-enthusiastic' when tightening these bolts. Without having personally checked the piano out before and after, it's difficult to say if the stripped out bolt is something that happened during manufacturing process, or after...

I agree with both of your observations.

What I am pointing out is that Dan has said things that someone like me (a completely neutral and disinterested party) easily sees as disparaging remarks about the quality of Brodmann products and about their management.

When a customer makes comments of a similar sort about any particular maker, many people here at PW get all over them like the proverbial cheap suit.

Dan says he is aware of even more warranty issues on Brodmann pianos. One does not usually point out stuff like that (without evidence) unless one is venting, and that sort of venting usually gets a very chilly response from the ownership here, since manufacturers have a tendency to issue warnings about liability for .... ah, misstatement.

The implication of Dan's posting seems to be that Brodmann either doesn't believe him, or that Brodmann thinks that he and the unnamed (but probably Vancouver-located) dealer are somehow to blame for these repair problems.

Your explanation about Brodmann's thinking is much more likely, and much less inflammatory.

If you want to see inflammatory, just reread the thread title.

Simply pointing out that it may now be difficult to get a local tech to deal with a few warranty issues with a few Brodmann pianos is hardly "disparaging remarks" in my opinion.

Everyone is pretty aware that it is not that uncommon among many brands that sometimes they require minor details to be attended to with a new piano.




Yes it does seem that way but I think many of us would also feel the same way because it would be hard to not take it personally as a personal affront when a company appears to support an incompetent tech when in fact all they are doing is just trying to bend to the wishes of the obviously misguided customer.


I think Brodmann did perhaps drop the ball in explaining their decision to the dealer and that they could have told him that everything the dealer did was proper but in order to make peace and for good public relations they have done what the customer wanted.

Sometimes I think it may be a bit of a problem at times with a few of the Chinese manufacturers (Hailun comes to mind) with regards to their relations with their dealer support.
I suspect that something like that might have to do with a recent change in Toronto with regards to Hailun dealer support.

Possibly their pianos building skills are improving at a faster rate than their dealer relation skills.

But I'm just an outsider thinking aloud so nobody should really put much stock into my musings.

(I think Brodmann pianos are outstanding).

Piano*Dad, you make some very good points in your comments.

I might add, as a reminder to everyone here, we, as individuals, are responsible for what we write here on the forums, and not Piano World. This is plainly stated in the forum policies and rules.

Also, I think that the professionals here may be a little more outspoken or passionate about certain things they encounter in their daily experiences in the real world because it may affect their livelihoods or their reputations.

I too, would welcome more responses from industry professionals on the issues brought up in this thread.

In regards to the title of the thread, I’m not so sure the manufacturer has actually abandoned the dealer in this case… they simply allowed the piano owner to have their way in this particular situation in order to keep them happy.

Rick