Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Tuner-Technicians Forum Perception of the PTG from non members

The exam is designed largely around the principle of fairness and consistency. The idea is that each examinee will get more or less the same exam so that people can't decry that their exam was harder than another person (although this still happens!).

The reality is that the exam is a tuning situation under more or less ideal circumstances: usually a 6' piano, Yamaha, Kawai, or Steinway - at pitch, detuned in such a way to equalize tension. False beats are taken into consideration.

Like Patrick says, there is room for a certain amount of preference in the exam. For instance, in the high treble there is a 6 cents tolerance. Keep in mind in that area of the piano one cent will equal more than one beat, so that is a generous tolerance. That's why it is rare for people to fail the high treble, even if they use quite a bit of stretch.

I occasionally have had the pleasure of working with Steve Brady, and sometimes fill in for his tunings at the Governor's Mansion concerts. I can tell you his tunings are very similar to a top notch exam tuning. Since he is currently the head technician for the Aspen Music Festival, to claim that this style of tuning is "unmusical" sounds absurd to me.

I challenge those who claim this to record their tunings and post them for our analysis so we can know what kind of stretch they are talking about.

Personally I have explored both ends of the spectrum. When I was working with Jessica Williams, I found that I needed to stretch more than I was normally comfortable. However I went over the limit one time with her and it really stressed her out.

Now, in my 20th year of tuning study, I find myself back to being a bit more conservative. This was inspired by a presentation by Don Mannino last year. I don't think anyone complains about Don's tunings being "unmusical".

All the talk about the tuning test is again one of the reasons I quit the PTG and why I certainly would never be tested. I don't need any more stress in my life. I have plenty on my plate and plenty of happy customers. I would constantly read in the Journal about different perceptions, opinions, methods, blah, blah, blah and in the end no one seems to agree anyway. So, I will continue to do things the way I want to do them unless somehow somewhere I am convinced that I should do otherwise.

As I've read over what I just wrote, I know it sounds snotty but it's all very frustrating to me. I don't know any other way to put it. Maybe it shouldn't frustrate me but it does. There is so much good stuff in the PTG and I really do appreciate that it's there but it feels like you can't just be happy that you have work and enjoy making pianos sound better.

In all honesty, I have nothing against the Guild. I just like being in this profession where I'm privileged to know a bunch of great techs and people, whether they're in the Guild or not.

Thank you!
I always feel guilty for take more than two hour to raise for 15 cents.

I personally don't against PTG. One thing disappointed is I don't know why I felt only RPT is good tuner. From this tread, I found good tuners who are not always a RPT.

That says it all...ditto here...

Rick

When I started a couple of years ago I had a lot of help from two local guild members here (both CTE's). Initially I found it instructive to try to pass the RPT tuning exam by dry runs at home, scoring myself against tunelab. I then decided to join as associate member for several reasons.

One is that by paying the yearly dues I am happy to support the guild. It's not much and I'm sure the money is not spent on large bonuses for PTG executives but on more useful things.

Another is that when I'm ready I could take the RPT test. I sort of feel that it should be obliged by law that you can only operate as piano technician if you are properly certified. Otherwise it is sort of like practicing medicine without a license. This is not implying at all that non RPT's are not qualified. I don't think anyone would doubt that some prominent non PTG posters here would, if forced, pass the test easily while talking on the phone.

I've been only to one local chapter meeting as they are usually too far away for me. Interestingly everyone here seems to use the Reyburn tuner, with only 2 purely aural tuners.

Just my subjective point of view...

Kees

I am using Verituner.

Oblige by law to have a certificate to tune piano!!!

Cool idea. There should be certificate to play cocktail piano, jazz piano, blues, classic and etc too.

I think some PTG people would really like this too. With all due respect I'm very much against it. I Feel that the comparison to practicing medicine is flawed. A piano is not a person. If I make a mistake no one dies. Also, I would hate to see more government regulation.

The gubmint is no better at selecting the wheat from the chaff then the public is most of the time. They just simply put an exhorbitant cost on the process.

Do auto mechanics need some kind of legal certification or license? How about contractors? Plumbers? Electricians? Roofers?

I think the piano technology arena is too small for it to ever have any type of standards overseen by the Government, so this is all very hypothetical.

I am all for enforced standards in tuning, as long as it is ET!

Yes, in California, auto mechanics and contractors of several varieties need licenses. Movers do, so you need one to move pianos. However, there are many professions which are not licensed. One can do work that requires a license if the amount of money is small, under $400 I believe.

are PTG members "licensed, bonded and insured"? you see this nowadays on most ads for
building contractors,plumbers, electricians etc, I guess its like the old "good housekeeping seal" I don't think they use that anymore..

No, we are not "licensed, bonded and insured." At least not through the PTG. We have to do that on our own as individuals if we want it, but it is not a requirement here in Michigan at least.

That is one thing that PTG is totally against and wishes to avoid if at all possible.

There is no connection between the standards of the tuning exam and any requirement or even recommendation by PTG that any piano at any time for and circumstance be tuned in ET or that its members, RPT or Associates should try to mimic in any way the standards of the tuning exam in practice.

As Jer, said, PTG does not involve itself in that. However, any responsible person in business does carry such insurance. After all, if we cause damage either to the piano or something else in the course of our work, we are liable for it under the law. Sometimes, the entities we work for may require proof of such insurance.

Actually, it is probably organizations like PTG that is saving all the "independents" from governmental licensing requirements. You see, there has been talk of that by folk who think about regulating people that work on other people's stuff (real estate brokers, electricians, plumbers, to name a few). It is the presence of some kind of self-regulation process that keeps the busybodies from imposing governmental regulation requirements.

I doubt that there is anyone in PTG who wants governmental regulation. If such a thing were ever to come down the pike, it would be PTG that would be representing the interests of the trade. With the independents, it would be a classic case of "divide and conquer".

Gov't license has certain protection to bad tuners, like the medical doctor. If he has licence, follow procedure strictly, the patient die, the docto has not liability.

If tuner need a licence, then ETD also need certificate. If client complain about tuning, just reply:"I am using certified ETD, following legal tuning procedure strictly. You have right to not satisfy, but you can not judge my service."

Very cool.

That's good to hear Keith. I'm glad you think I'm wrong!

Could you imagine if some states licensed tuners and some didn't - and there were different tests for each state, and for those techs living in a border area needing licenses for two or three different states? What an mess that would be. I don't think anyone need worry about that anytime soon.

Personally I found the one note sharp, one note flat more than annoying while testing. I'd rather have the whole piano 3 cents flat. Nothing is perfect, I guess.