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#1860211 03/11/12 11:36 PM
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Hello,

I'm narrowing down my DP search again. I have tested the CA93 briefly a while ago and liked it. I don't know if I can test the MP10 because I haven't found it around where I live and I'm not sure if the Kawai dealer has it. I plan to go to the Kawai dealer this week and take a second look at the CA93.

The CA93 is more expensive, but I'm intrigued by the soundboard design and the ability to layer piano and e-piano sounds. The MP10 is cheaper and offers more Virtual Technician settings but it doesn't have the ability to layer piano/e-piano sounds and I need to get speakers.

If you're given the choice of these 2 excellent DPs, which one would you choose and why?

Warm regards,

Nicolas





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MP10.

- Better acoustic piano sounds.
- Much better EP sounds + amp simulator.
- Much better user interface, greater flexibility.

Cheers,
James
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
MP10.

- Better acoustic piano sounds.
- Much better EP sounds + amp simulator.
- Much better user interface, greater flexibility.

Cheers,
James
x


Thanks James. I didn't know that the acoustic piano sounds on the MP10 are better. Do you know in what ways they're better?

Warm regards,

Nicolas


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Well, I believe the Concert Grand is the same, however the Pop and Jazz categories use new samples that are not found on the CA93/CA63.

Kind regards,
James
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MP10.

Purely, based on form factor. I dislike all upright/console digital pianos - except for the Kawai CS9.

Originally Posted by mrcultureshock
The CA93 is more expensive........and the ability to layer piano and e-piano sounds.

I thought it was possible to layer AP and EP (and strings/pads) sounds on the MP10 - just not 2 AP (or EP) sounds.


vegasE #1860268 03/12/12 01:55 AM
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Originally Posted by vegasE
Originally Posted by mrcultureshock
The CA93 is more expensive........and the ability to layer piano and e-piano sounds.

I thought it was possible to layer AP and EP (and strings/pads) sounds on the MP10 - just not 2 AP (or EP) sounds.


Right, I think that's what he meant.


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MP10 because you could get speakers, stand and decent headphones for the same price.
But you should just get another CP300 ...nothing else will make you happy.


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Dr Popper #1860280 03/12/12 02:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Dr Popper
MP10 because you could get speakers, stand and decent headphones for the same price.
But you should just get another CP300 ...nothing else will make you happy.


Thanks for the reply Dr Popper. I actually never owned a CP300 but I almost bought a CLP-480 until I started reading this forum. Now I just have to choose between the CA93 or the MP10.

Warm regards,

Nicolas


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Nicolas, alternatively, you could stick with your original plan of purchasing the CLP-480 - it's a very nice DP.

Cheers,
James
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Originally Posted by mrcultureshock
Originally Posted by Dr Popper
MP10 because you could get speakers, stand and decent headphones for the same price.
But you should just get another CP300 ...nothing else will make you happy.


Thanks for the reply Dr Popper. I actually never owned a CP300 but I almost bought a CLP-480 until I started reading this forum. Now I just have to choose between the CA93 or the MP10.

Warm regards,

Nicolas


Sorry ...I mistook you for the guy who had a CP300 he gave away to his daughter. Get a MP10 (or MP6 if you want to layer EP's with AP's)


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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Nicolas, alternatively, you could stick with your original plan of purchasing the CLP-480 - it's a very nice DP.

Cheers,
James
x


Hi Nicola,

Please do NOT listen to Kawai James LOL smile

The CLP480 is a very nice DP, but its keyboard cannot be compared to CA63 / CA93. I have a CS6, the new version of the CA63, and I promise you will not be disappointed!

Regards,

Luis



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I think the CLP-480 would be a very nice thing. I like the action and find it to be a very decent emulation of a real grand piano. The iAFC (or whatever they call it) is very enjoyable in terms of the onboard sound system. Don't rule it out.

MP10/CA93 has the action everyone is raving about - with some justification because it is a wonderfully smooth and satisfying action. I'd have to play them back-to-back to be sure but in terms of piano tone I'd probably give the Yamaha the edge. The Kawai can sound just a wee bit strident and unrefined to my ears.

Good luck,

Steve

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Originally Posted by Kawai James
MP10.

- Better acoustic piano sounds.
...

In single voice mode (e.g. using factory presets): yes, slightly better concert grand.
In custom dual voice mode (AP+AP): no, not even close, it's a world of acoustic difference in favour of the CA93 (otherwise I would have bought an MP10 already).


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Thanks for all your replies. I talked to both Kawai dealers and they don't stock the MP10. I've checked the Guitar Centers and Sam Ash near me and they don't have it either.

So I can either buy the MP10 sight unseen, or get the CA93 (if the price is reasonable), the CLP-480/470, or the CP300 (yet to demo but it's the cheapest option). I'll be demoing the CA93 this week and I'll go try out the CLP-480 again and see if I can find the CP300.

Is it even worth for me to consider the CP300? It's the cheapest option but it has the oldest technology.

Warm regards,

Nicolas






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You can ask "Should I get a Honda Civic or should I get a Toyota Corolla?" They fall into the same market space.

But you ought not ask "Should I get a pickup truck or a mini-van?" They're not comparable.

So first decide whether you need a console (CA93, CLP470/480) or a keyboard (CP300, MP10). Then narrow the field.

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Point taken, MacMacMac, but the analogy is not entirely apt. For one thing the two classes of piano, console and slab, are not incomparable, as the two classes of cars are. No one NEEDS a console and only people who gig need slabs. The reality is that the two types of piano are essentially interchangeable for the original poster (otherwise he would already know which type of piano he wants). Also, pianos from different manufacturers that are in the same class are quite different and polarize people in dramatic ways. Much more so than the two cars you mention.

Rather, the way these pianos separate most naturally is the action and sound. The CLP's are much more similar to the CP300 in those respects, as are the MP10 and CA93. The CA93 adds some aesthetic and a little functionality at a certain cost, but as it will be used, it is very similar to the MP10.

I think agonizing over whether to get an MP10 or CA93 makes perfect sense (is the extra stuff worth the price?), while being unable to tell whether you like the Kawai action or Yamaha seems altogether implausible to me. One only has to try both to know whether you like one brand better or the other. It's choosing the model that is hard.

That's how I would see it, anyway. Choose the action you want, then look at the models that have it and figure out which one is cheapest subject to the constraint that it has the features you intend to use.

Last edited by gvfarns; 03/13/12 01:37 AM.
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Nicolas, I would recommend that you contact Kawai America and ask for suggestions about where to play-test an MP10.

Kind regards,
James
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gvfarns #1860896 03/13/12 07:59 AM
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Originally Posted by gvfarns
Point taken, MacMacMac, but the analogy is not entirely apt. For one thing the two classes of piano, console and slab, are not incomparable, as the two classes of cars are.
I may have exaggerated the class differences between slabs and consoles. Still, there are choices to be made that differ in the two categories.

Consoles always have speakers. Slabs sometimes do not. Among those that do, you don't have any high-end speaker choices.

Consoles can have furniture styling. Slabs do not.

Consoles generally include a stable stand. Slabs do not.

Some slabs are portable (or at least, luggable). Consoles are not.

So I think it's important to start by choosing a category, based, at least, upon those criteria.

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Originally Posted by MacMacMac



So I think it's important to start by choosing a category, based, atleast, upon those criteria.


I disagree entirely. OK, maybe not entirely. Every once in a while a poster says they need a console for aesthetic reasons, or a slab for portability. More often than not, action and sound are primary consideration. I ordered an MP-10 recently after testing a bunch of DPs. My thinking was to get the cheapest option with the action I wanted. I was relatively indifferent to console or slab. I would have preferred console, but only if I could have the action at a close price point. That wasn't possible, so I bought a slab. Speakers are handled externally, and I might make a more solid stand.

Point is, most people here seem to care about action and sound generation, and get the DP that they can afford with those 2 features.

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Originally Posted by mrcultureshock
Thanks for all your replies. I talked to both Kawai dealers and they don't stock the MP10. I've checked the Guitar Centers and Sam Ash near me and they don't have it either.


I heard that Kawai is heavily back-ordered in terms of MP10 - there is a huge demand and little supply. I can understand that. However - technically, if you like CA93, MP10 should be the same in terms of touch and sound, and the look - you can find on youtube videos.

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