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I know there was trouble with key wear on Rolands a few years back.. Yes, this is the impetus for my concern.
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Sorry, I just meant fingertips. No callouses on RH. Ah, I get you now. See below. My acoustic is steel string: medium. Electric, also medium strings, I forget which type. Medium gauge on acoustic is 13 - 56. They'll hold their tune for ages and give good tone and volume but they might be hard for a beginner. Medium gauge on electric is 10 - 46. I trust that's what you've got. Hybrid is what I found worst, because of the sharp difference between the pick sound and the fingertip sound. If it's just fingers, then that's not so bad. But the combination didn't work. Maybe I just need to work on technique more? You'll find ficker-picking on steel will also build mild callusses on your right hand with a subsequent improvement in tone and volume. Don't give up on it too soon. Ok, I'm curious, what's snapping? Pulling the string away from the guitar and snapping it back against the fingerboard. This became popular with bassists in the seventies. I don't use it myself.
Richard
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I could be wrong, but I believe the Roland "Ivory Feel" is the way they mold the thick plastic that forms the tops of the white keys. I'd be very surprised if it were as thin as paint or could be rubbed off or otherwise removed without sanding the entire top of the key away. That would be nice, but I don't think it's right. That sort of implies that 1. The Ivory feel material as as robust as (if not identical to) the material on their plain plastic keys. 2. The Ivory feel material is the key-plastic, not a coating on it. I *think* both are incorrect. A friend of mine just got a fairly new Ivory Feel Roland and within a very short amount of time had scratched up the surface pretty well with his fingernails. He contacted Roland and they sent someone out to replace his keys with the standard, non-ivory-feel plastic. To me, this says the Ivory feel stuff is a different material. My impression last time I tested Rolands was that it was a thin coating of a material with more ivory-like properties (absorbing sweat...yuck!) on top of the regular plastic. Of course, I could be way off. I guess I don't actually have any reason to think the coating is thin other than my impression and what I've heard here in the forum. You actually own a Roland, and I do not, so your guess may be more reliable than mine.
Last edited by gvfarns; 03/09/12 09:35 PM.
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Pulling the string away from the guitar and snapping it back against the fingerboard. This became popular with bassists in the seventies.
They stole the concept of it from Roy Nichols James Burton and a bunch of 50's 60's country players.. they totally made it into a different thing: They combine with slapping the strings off the frets and make whole passages of only that technique.
Last edited by Jonny Guitar; 03/09/12 10:44 PM.
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That sort of implies that
1. The Ivory feel material as as robust as (if not identical to) the material on their plain plastic keys. Not necessarily. My theory is that it's a semi-porous casting of some sort, and the porosity is what makes it fragile. If you take a flashlight and look at the grain it seems to have a "strain-like" pattern around the cut in corners for the black keys. If the ivory feel were merely painted on it would be difficult to get this pattern, whereas a casting might naturally do this as the plastic is injected into the mold. Here's a picture of it on our RD-700NX (all of the keys have a similar pattern):
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I wonder ... does it really matter how the keytops are made?
In the end, the damage gets done. Many people have experienced the problem over the past several years. So, whether painted, cast, or molded ... you just have to skip Roland and go with the other guys.
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I own a Roland V-Piano, and, I am now waiting for a full key bed replacement of my "Ivory Feel" keys with another set that might be more resilient to scratches, although that is the question that remains to be seen.
Keeping very short finger nails apparently makes no difference with this issue since any contact with the keys (particularly the thumb nail which invariably scrapes the key even when trimmed) will scratch and mar the surface.
Have had detailed correspondence with another PW member who has an HP-305 / 307, as he is now on his third key bed exchange and I am waiting to hear if they are any better than the others.
Still no confirmation of more resilient keys with these key bed exchanges...
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^^ That concerns me, especially with the only store that carries them locally only offering a 12 month warranty.
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Wish I would practive so much to see any scratches on my FP-7F's keys :-)
Last edited by ClavBoy; 03/10/12 08:04 AM.
Roland FP-7F
Working on: Schumann: From Foreign Lands and Countries, op. 15; Burgmüller op. 100, Arabesque; Tchaikovsky op. 39 no. 15, Italian Song
Dreaming of: Some Scott Joplin pieces i.e. Bethena. Still years to go for that... Satie: Gnossienne No. 1. Maybe a bit earlier
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Most of the DP key surface will be scratched after continuous playing. The question is which surface is more resistant to scratch. The plastic glossy finish or the matt ivorite finish?
I have a feeling that matt, slight porous ivorite finish would be more resistant to scratches.
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I wonder ... does it really matter how the keytops are made? For me it is helpful to understand the failure mechanism. In the end, the damage gets done. Many people have experienced the problem over the past several years. So, when painted, cast, or molded ... you just have to skip Roland and go with the other guys. The picky / paranoid / meticulous may want to skip Roland due to this issue. From my experience selling stuff on-line (Craigslist, Amazon, eBay, etc.) I've found that a minority of customers can be quite nitpicky and overly demanding. I'm not saying that's the only group complaining about the wear issue, but I suspect that they are over-represented in it. The rest may want to give Roland a shot due to the advantages of SN. I haven't seen wear or scratches on our RD-700NX yet (it only gets played maybe an hour or two a week) but if it arises I'll be sure to let everyone here know. The possibility of key wear was something that scared me before we bought it, but so far so good. Eschewing SN due to possible key wear is possibly akin to throwing out the baby with the bathwater (that is if you like the sound of SN and it works for your particular DP needs - I think it sounds really good through decent headphones but lacks something through decent speakers).
Last edited by dewster; 03/10/12 12:45 PM.
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^^ That concerns me, especially with the only store that carries them locally only offering a 12 month warranty. Here in the states Roland's default warranty is 1 year parts / 90 days labor. For the FP-7F and most of their home pianos it is 5 years / 1 year - LINK. If you get something with "Ivory Feel" play the heck out of it and see if it wears and go from there. This isn't an unknown issue for Roland, I wouldn't be surprised if they are replacing worn keys in DPs that are out of warranty on their dime.
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Here in the states Roland's default warranty is 1 year parts / 90 days labor. For the FP-7F and most of their home pianos it is 5 years / 1 year - LINK. Wow. I am in Canada and I questioned the dude at store about only a year and he reiterated 1 year only. I will have to investigate this further and if it is only a year up here I will buy it from the states....cheaper there anyways. Thanks for heads up!!!
Last edited by Jonny Guitar; 03/10/12 01:39 PM.
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You'll find ficker-picking on steel will also build mild callusses on your right hand with a subsequent improvement in tone and volume. Don't give up on it too soon.
Oh, I see. That was the one piece of the puzzle I hadn't worked out. I sound dreadful, but should keep going. Got it now. Got skin to kill.
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Wow. I am in Canada and I questioned the dude at store about only a year and he reiterated 1 year only. Apparently he's right, the Canadian warranty is only 1 year parts / 1 year labor ( LINK ). But there is an extended warranty of 1/5 for the following products (from the link - and only if you register them with Roland): DP-990, HP201, HP203, HP207, HP-302, HP-305, HP-301, HPi-6s, HPi-7s, KR-103, KR-105, KR-107,KR-111, KR-115, KR-115M, KR-117M, LX-10, RG-1, RG-3, RG-3M, RG-7, RM-700, RP-101, RP-201, HP-307.
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^^ I would suspect that for 95% of repairs, the parts are cheap compared to the labour: barring a motherboard collapse, wouldn't most of the part be pretty darn cheap compared to the bench costs involved. Maybe the 1 and 1 isn't that much of a downgrade from the the 5parts and 1 labour. Maybe it just sounds like a big difference.
What do you all think?
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There is no doubt that there is an issue with the key surface. After only 3 months of owning a RD700NX I noticed and felt the scratches on certain notes. I have very short nails (biter) but the damage was caused by the side edges of my thumb nails. The scratces are in the middle region of the board at the bottom of the key.(middle C being the worst) It certainly annoyed me at first but now I'm over it and almost a year on it's no worse and I'm no longer stressed over it. Of course I'd rather it hadn't happen and I'm sure that Roland must be working to rectify the problem but I certainly wouldn't give up the NX because of this. For my needs and enjoyment it is the best board available.
Roland RD700NX, Korg SV1 88.
Thank God for the gift of Music
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