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sat. morning; good time to try some different configs. here's a config that's promising:



akg 420s in cardioid mode, parallel to the LID, per DPA suggestion. will try them up higher and back a bit as well.

here are some sample recordings (please overlook boo-boos; am focused on recording not music). of course no effects:

http://www.box.com/s/5axfetptdnrhq9ryp6u3
http://www.box.com/s/z6kcd9haxgey7bd7a6r5
http://www.box.com/s/cigu3lcpxr2xiav1eb8d

Only the first clip is working.... but it sounds about... well... about as good as I can imagine. That's the sort of raw material you could make a very, very mainstream-quality piano (classical) recording from. (Add now-requisite verb and you're 99 per cent there!) That AGK looks like, sounds like, an exception to the rule... "they all sound the same in the end"!!!

JG

sorry, switching to soundcloud.com; i think they have better codecs; try this (with a bit of 'verb):

http://soundcloud.com/ekriege/schubert-impromptu-142-no2-a

I've been listening with the Grados headphones to all the still available recordings you made, Entheo.

The Scarlatti and Schubert are very, very nice. You found excellent distance and placement with this AKG 420 set-up. I'd lock this one down as the basis on which you judge all of your other experiments.

You play beautifully

Glen

thanks glen! yes i agree i'm going to go with this setup and start focusing on the music again

Thanks for this.
I've been considering buying a good mic soon (to replace an ancient Shure 58 I've got) and I think I'm going to go with the AKG 420.

On the road without good headphones so I can't listen critically until this weekend, but I'll take the rave reviews from other posters as "mission success" for you.

Hurrah.

Glad the DPA book was a help even if we've decided on different placements.

andrew, i tried your placement and there were good results, but i prefer the focus i'm getting with my current placement & cardioid mode -- at least for now!

I also used MXL 990's... superb results at the same time i recorded with the built in microphone of the TASCAM BB1000 CD direct to CD OR SD CARD = WHAT AN EASY MACHINE TO USE, NO COMPUTER, NO SOFTWARE JUST PUSH REC AND GO FOR IT!

Love that Schubert... and the 420s in Card sound excellent!

Here's a mistery mic I used to record that old saw .... by JSB...

http://www.box.com/s/ctsg3mjrl5c6ebmg788v

Less precise, I think, than the AKG 420..

And that old Chopin again, but now on the same mystery pair...

http://www.box.com/s/e0bzcprrr221ox1so44t

By way of edit, I've changed the Bach to a close-miked version of the WTC 2 prelude, which is sort of a test piece, I guess.

There are numerous pops and clicks, which I attribute to the underpowered Macbook's audio recorder.

The Chopin is a more distant miking, a couple of feet off the piano.

Oh, yes, I added verb to the Bach, if it isn't obvious. Amd I had to equalize out some of the boomy bass around 100 hz.

JG

other than the clicks & pops i can find no fault with either recording, and believe that your choices (close mic for bach and a bit back for chopin) served each piece respectively well. and having to edit OUT some bass; my, what a luxury! your piano sounds excellent.

so will you tell us the name of the mystery mics?

Hi John,
Wonderful playing. Perhaps a bit too much room feel on the Chopin recording (I guess it's all a matter of taste), but it sounds great.

The placement for your Bach recording sounds about right to my mind's ear.

Glen

I agree about the Chopin being, perhaps, a bit "roomy", and the piano sounding a bit in-a-box on the distant miking.

OK... the mics, which I only purchased out of morbid curiousity (and I can return them) are Chinese Ribbons!!!! Apex 210, which you can get, I think, for around 230US a pair.

These are very fussy about placement (I suppose all ribbons are).

I think I can live with the Bach sound, and I'm not sure whether in this room, with this piano, my equipment, etc., I would do any better with expensive cardioid small diaphrams, like the AKG 451 series, or the KSM 141s (switchable between card and omni). I may still yet be in a position to rent some Schoeps, and if that happens a comparison would be interesting.

As it stands, I think this Ribbon mic captures the actual tone of the instrument more accurately, depending of course on placement.

JG

i close out with a "final production" (as if there is such a thing) of the schubert impromptu, as follows. AKG 420s in cardioid mode, audiobox 22VSL, studio one DAW, converting WAV to MP3 with Exact Audio Copy (YouTube codecs suck, what can i say), windoz7 movie maker, here ya go:

Edited by moderator... SPAM

John - I listened carefully with my studio monitors, and I agree with your conclusion. The Apex 210's sound as good as the AKG condensers - maybe even a little better - at least on my equipment.

I actually like the Chopin sound a lot, though there were some balance issues between the channels.

I think a little fiddling with that would give me the "classical" sound that I like.

Interesting about the Apex 210.

Good luck with it, and, BTW, I think you're playing of the Bach was darned good.

Finally had a chance to listen on my studio monitors to your Soundcloud clip.

Hurrah - you're there!

The recording sounds just fine;
the C7 sounds just fine;
and so does your playing.

Congratulations.

=====================================

PS - I have received a lot of benefit from the resurrection of this thread. I'm self producing/recording a CD of "Music from the Golden Age of the Piano" soon as there's time this spring. I think folks will enjoy the music as well as the sound of my 1929 Steinert (New York Steinway B close copy). I've changed microphone placement based on what I learned in several posts - I've got an idea of what sounds "right" to some very fussy PW ears - and I learned about some dirt cheap Chinese ribbon mics that sound fantastic on solo piano which might even fit into my budget.

Good Evening to All.

Good afternoon, friends. I frequently record grand piano, both solo and in ensemble. The tools and techniques that work for you will depend on your instrument, your space, your genre, your vision, your budget, etc. That said, let's get to the nitty-gritty...

This thread (Barber's Piano Concerto, Piano World Thread) has some videos recorded with two Shure KSM141s in omni:



And here's the same space, [different] piano, different performers, recorded with Rode NT5s (omni) on the piano and Gefell M270s in omni on the ensemble:

VERY nice recordings norsehorse!

NorseHorse - you are, of course, correct. Me, I'm usually good with the vision thing; it's the darn budget that does the squeeze

Your two included recordings sound... professional.
Did you use the same preamps?

FWIW, I was surprised to find I liked the sound with the single omni pair of Shure KSM141s over the one with the NT5 and the Gefell M270s for the orchestra. I'm listening with a decent pair of headphones, not over speakers, since I'm on the road this week - but I didn't find the Gefells to sound better on the ensemble. As for the NT-5s, I'm note a Rode fan. They made the piano sound "brittle" and a bit "dead" to me.

I'll keep you in mind for recording work when I have the budget to pay for you