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Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: EssBrace] #1769475
10/12/11 08:04 PM
10/12/11 08:04 PM
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Hobart, Australia
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ando Offline
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Originally Posted by EssBrace
Placing "ize" on the end of a word doesn't make a new word in my book.



Are you sure? So why are we Aussies and Poms always complaining about the "Americanisation" of our language? wink You definitely hear "Americanise" more than, "the placing of American words, idioms or influences in our language". grin But I guess Americanise would be the one exception to the no-ise rule because you are saying it is so American! Confused yet?! crazy

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Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1769477
10/12/11 08:14 PM
10/12/11 08:14 PM
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Posts: 15,111
Hamamatsu, Japan
Kawai James Offline
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My favourite Americanism is de-encouragize:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPfi4GDF53E#t=1m12

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1769478
10/12/11 08:14 PM
10/12/11 08:14 PM
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Suffolk, United Kingdom
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EssBrace Offline
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Well, maybe what I'm saying is that "ize" words ("ise" words in proper English) are fine if they have been a staple of the language. Generalise, categorise etc...all fine. But alphabetize? Do me a favour!

Aussies are as bad - I was proof-reading something for an Australian friend the other day and he used the word thereunder...what the heck does that mean I asked - I thought it was a typo. The word does exist in Australian dictionaries apparently. Needlessly of course!


Roland RD-1000 | Yamaha CLP 645 | Broadwood Barless 7' 6"
Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: Kawai James] #1769482
10/12/11 08:16 PM
10/12/11 08:16 PM
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Suffolk, United Kingdom
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EssBrace Offline
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de-encouragize - classic!


Roland RD-1000 | Yamaha CLP 645 | Broadwood Barless 7' 6"
Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: EssBrace] #1769487
10/12/11 08:26 PM
10/12/11 08:26 PM
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Hobart, Australia
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ando Offline
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Originally Posted by EssBrace
Well, maybe what I'm saying is that "ize" words ("ise" words in proper English) are fine if they have been a staple of the language. Generalise, categorise etc...all fine. But alphabetize? Do me a favour!

Aussies are as bad - I was proof-reading something for an Australian friend the other day and he used the word thereunder...what the heck does that mean I asked - I thought it was a typo. The word does exist in Australian dictionaries apparently. Needlessly of course!


Actually "thereunder" is a very old and established construction in British English indicating position under the thing already specified. It is part of a host of "there" words which can take on a preposition as a suffix, therein, thereof, thereunder, thereat, thereover etc. As long as it was used correctly, there's no problem with the word. Sorry mate!



Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: Kawai James] #1769586
10/13/11 12:15 AM
10/13/11 12:15 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,675
Northern NJ
dewster Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
My favourite Americanism is de-encouragize

OK, I'm definitely going to give that one a go, thanks sincerely for the pointer!

I'm curious, is there a term for British pseudo-Americanisms coined purely for comedic purposes?

Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1769593
10/13/11 12:19 AM
10/13/11 12:19 AM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 15,111
Hamamatsu, Japan
Kawai James Offline
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Yes, slang.


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1769614
10/13/11 12:54 AM
10/13/11 12:54 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,675
Northern NJ
dewster Offline OP
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Languages that aren't in constant flux are basically dead. People play all kinds of games with them because spoken language is largely an instinct for us - put two infants on a desert isle and if they survive they'll come up with something with internal consistency (i.e. follows grammatical rules).

Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: ando] #1769750
10/13/11 05:46 AM
10/13/11 05:46 AM
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Suffolk, United Kingdom
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EssBrace Offline
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Originally Posted by ando
"thereunder"....As long as it was used correctly, there's no problem with the word. Sorry mate!


It wasn't. Thereunder is only correct or sensible frankly in the context of legal documents or technical instructions - the context in which it was used was totally odd. When I questioned his use of it he quoted some Australian dictionary entry justifying it.

There's a concept - an Australian dictionary!...cobber, dag, rack (as in rack off), sheila and countless other inelegant contributions to the language no doubt grin


Roland RD-1000 | Yamaha CLP 645 | Broadwood Barless 7' 6"
Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1769910
10/13/11 12:49 PM
10/13/11 12:49 PM
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 67
Germany
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Germany
Originally Posted by dewster
Rindfleischetikettierungsüberwachungsaufgabenübertragungsgesetz


Well that was only a proposal, the final name of the law is "Gesetz zur Übertragung der Aufgaben für die Überwachung der Rinderkennzeichnung und Rindfleischetikettierung", which looks much nicer, doesn't it?

Last edited by ClavBoy; 10/13/11 12:49 PM.

Roland FP-7F

Working on:
Schumann: From Foreign Lands and Countries, op. 15; Burgmller op. 100, Arabesque; Tchaikovsky op. 39 no. 15, Italian Song

Dreaming of:
Some Scott Joplin pieces i.e. Bethena. Still years to go for that...
Satie: Gnossienne No. 1. Maybe a bit earlier


Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1770076
10/13/11 07:02 PM
10/13/11 07:02 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,675
Northern NJ
dewster Offline OP
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If anyone with a Yamaha CLP-990 could pop the hood and snap some pix of the key mechanism I'd be eternally grateful!

Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: EssBrace] #1770283
10/14/11 04:04 AM
10/14/11 04:04 AM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17
Missouri, U.S.
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Missouri, U.S.
Originally Posted by EssBrace
I (or my house) would be burgled, you would be "burglarized", which is absurd to me. Placing "ize" on the end of a word doesn't make a new word in my book.


Burgle? Come now, let's be civilIZEd. I wouldn't expect someone so serious about preserving proper English to use such recent, colloquialIZEd "ungly English."

From the Oxford English Dictionary:

burgle, v. orig. colloq. or humorous.

(ˈbɜːg(ə)l)

[A back-formation from burglar n., of very recent appearance, though English law-Latin (1354) had a verb burgulāre of same meaning.]

a.a intr. To follow the occupation of a burglar. b.b trans. To break feloniously into the house of; to steal or rob burglariously.

   1872 M. Collins Pr. Clarice I. iv. 63 The burglar who attempted to enter that room would never burgle again.    1874 Standard 14 Nov. 3 New words with which the American vocabulary has lately been enriched; ‘to burgle’, meaning to injure a person by breaking into his or her house.    1884 Blackw. Mag. 513/2, I burgled myself again in the night.

Hence ˈburgled ppl. a., and ˈburgling vbl. n. and ppl. a.

   1880 Daily News 28 Oct. 5/3 Treachery seems to have been developed even in burgling circles.    1884 C. Dickens Dict. Lond. 28/3 A gentleman of the burgling persuasion.    1885 Graphic 14 Feb. 151/1 After the ‘burgling’ is completed.    1886 Phelps Burglars in Par. vii. 117 ‘Oh’, said the mistress of the burgled cottage‥to the policeman.


laugh

Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1770292
10/14/11 04:42 AM
10/14/11 04:42 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 78
Tehran, Iran
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reza Offline
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Tehran, Iran
Dear Dewester thanks you for this wonderful and rare collection of photos. As an Electronics engineer I also have this tendency to see inside of every electronics device.

Reviewing the photos related to the boards (brains), I can see that most of them following embeded systems design patterns that is the reason why they are so limited and hard to upgrade. I can see that in near future most of the electronics devices will be a brainless I/O devices, acting as a dock for something like iPad/iPhone. The brain and user interface can be separated from these devices. This way, you can put your iPAD on any DP and start to play your favorite software instrument. I know that some companies already started to walk in this path by introducing devices like iMIDI (to connect your midi device to the iPAD/Phone, but I really waiting to see big players like Yamaha, Roland, etc. To wake up and stop ignoring popular devices like iPhone/iPAD.

Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1770413
10/14/11 10:45 AM
10/14/11 10:45 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,675
Northern NJ
dewster Offline OP
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Northern NJ
Language is central to culture, so it's only natural to feel protective towards it, particularly when outside forces are influencing it. But protecting it from change is a losing battle IMO. And besides, new phrases and constructs can be fun, even if they don't completely (or perhaps because they don't) fit into the existing logical framework (not that any language is 100% internally consistent).

Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1770435
10/14/11 11:18 AM
10/14/11 11:18 AM
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Let's remember what fun the French had with 'le weekend', when their own subjects preferred the Frenchified version of the English rather than their own long-winded invented version.....(I can't remember know what it was now).

The same applied to the new technical terms invented since the computer age.


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: reza] #1770457
10/14/11 11:44 AM
10/14/11 11:44 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,675
Northern NJ
dewster Offline OP
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Originally Posted by reza
Reviewing the photos related to the boards (brains), I can see that most of them following embeded systems design patterns that is the reason why they are so limited and hard to upgrade. I can see that in near future most of the electronics devices will be a brainless I/O devices, acting as a dock for something like iPad/iPhone. The brain and user interface can be separated from these devices. This way, you can put your iPAD on any DP and start to play your favorite software instrument. I know that some companies already started to walk in this path by introducing devices like iMIDI (to connect your midi device to the iPAD/Phone, but I really waiting to see big players like Yamaha, Roland, etc. To wake up and stop ignoring popular devices like iPhone/iPAD.

When I look at the brains photos I'm struck by a preponderance of what appear to be proprietary processors connected to old DRAM and expensive random access Flash on large PWBs with a fair amount of old misc. glue logic. For the price of all that (+manufacturing) I'd think a newer more highly integrated off-the-shelf processor on a much smaller PWB could easily be less costly and much faster - win/win? I just don't understand the strange economics and backward technology of the DP industry. Perhaps there is little significant market competition between manufacturers?

The dockable processor is an interesting concept, though I'm not sure I'd want it on a DP. Like any computer, the OS, form factor, and interfaces change too quickly. A cheap DP should last at least 10 years, a high-end one I'd expect 20 to 30 years from (with some maintenance) but perhaps my expectations are unwarranted. Will the IPod as we know it even be around in 5 years?

On the other hand, it's kind of a shame that 5-pin DIN MIDI is on its way out. An essentially brainless product with excellent keys, excellent built-in sound system, MIDI out, and analog audio in could be viable for decades - just add a sound module (which are also disappearing) or PC / laptop / tablet / iPod. The problem is lack of integration - I desire this so much that I don't mind paying a premium for it. The only way to get it is with an internal processor - luckily they are getting cheaper all the time.

Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1770535
10/14/11 01:39 PM
10/14/11 01:39 PM
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Tehran, Iran
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reza Offline
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Tehran, Iran
I think one reason behind this hardware-oriented trends in DP industry are existing R&D teams that are not ready to accept the new era of computing world. They are following the old traditions of hardware designs.

Regarding lack of interface standards in the post-PC computer devices (like tablets, smart phones, etc), I am fully in agree with you. The market is crazy and everybody wants to dominate it's own standards. But soon or later we will have kind of standards for docking interfaces. I really wish to see newcomers of tablet industry to begin labling their tablets with things like "iPhone Compatible" (Similar the way that PC industry did by saying IBM-Compatible in 90s).

Even without relying on third party devices like iPad, the DP industry can gain a lot by introducing it's own dock able computing devices. This way we can select the best action and form factor, independent of the sound engines. At worse case, let each company introduce it's own standard.

Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1770550
10/14/11 02:02 PM
10/14/11 02:02 PM
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Posts: 8,317
Raleigh, North Carolina
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I don't think that they're stuck on old designs. Instead, they're stuck on remaining profitable. Which of the suggested improvements would help profits? None, I think.

If a new competitor came along and offered those things, then the major players (YRK) would have to respond. But there is a huge barrier to the entry of new competitors, mainly in two areas:

1. The keyboard. It's not easy to design one that will perform well and last long. The majors have long experience in this. Lacking that, a new competitor would face major expenses to develop one.

2. The marketing. People buy what's they see in stores. That would be Y, R, K, and C (and maybe the other K). From a dealer's point of view, there isn't room for a new, brand X. He's trying to make a profit selling YRKC's. What benefit would he gain that would offset the cost of keeping inventory of yet another brand?

Anyway ... when will we (and I) do less blathering ... and see more of the exposing promised by the thread's title? smile

Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: dewster] #1777262
10/26/11 12:20 AM
10/26/11 12:20 AM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 9
Tennessee, USA
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Harry_440 Offline
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Tennessee, USA
Maybe this picture of a peeled-apart Roll Up Piano keyboard will go with the Hecsan Rollup Piano link. (Sorry - I can't seem to embed the actual image in the PW Web site.)

[img]http://www.mediafire.com/?dm59511gz659f86[/img]

The keyboard peeling was done in the process of modifying a "PLAY 'N' ROLL" rollup piano sold by Shaper Image. I replaced the rubberized keyboard with some button switches, providing me with a fairly small electronic pitch pipe for use in doing my Bruce Arnold ear training exercises.


Harry

Older adult beginner
Kawai CA63

Re: DPs Exposed! [Re: Harry_440] #1778339
10/27/11 06:49 PM
10/27/11 06:49 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,675
Northern NJ
dewster Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Harry_440
Maybe this picture of a peeled-apart Roll Up Piano keyboard will go with the Hecsan Rollup Piano link. (Sorry - I can't seem to embed the actual image in the PW Web site.)

Thanks! I don't think MediaFire will let you hot link to files unless you pay them some $.

So I used the PW File Uploader to store it:

[Linked Image]

Ta da!

And while I'm at it, here's a high res view of the Roll Up Piano brains:

[Linked Image]

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